Why Has Our Movement Not Yet Taken Off?

[Hexenmeister]

What do YOU think is the reason the White Nationalist movement in the USA has not yet gone airborne?

I do not think the moment will come until there are significant fractures in the economy and politics. The recent health care question reaction comes to mind. Further demographic shifting, along with realization of the demographic deterioration, is also necessary.

In connection with the original consideration, I say that the reason this thing of ours has not taken off is spiritual, not religious, poverty. We have not yet spiritualized our quest. Given time, the White race may turn to our efforts as to a substitute for the degraded spirituality of the time. This may be so for the old and the young White victims, who finally realize that they are literally the second-class in a concrete, palpable day-to-day war imposed on them by Jews, African Americans, and Hispanics on an alien turf elaborated from the land of out fathers. There wil be no material progress until we learn to spiritualize our quest and our agenda as something like the Grail quest of the present time. Then, the Wotan archetype will be referenced and its energy released. At that point, it all is reduced to a mere engineering problem.

Interestingly, A. Hitler, in his last days (cf. published and unpublished diaries of Traudl Junge) prophesied that in perhaps one hundred years or less, "a movement based on the principles of National Socialism would sweep the world with the force of a religion."

Until this time, we can try to prepare the ground on good sites like this and try to non-virtually network, while we wait for the White savior and the White messianic era. Jung and Campbell stressed that White salvation would come only by reconnecting with the myths of our people. Sadly, the enemy knew this and successfully cut off most of us from our great literature and mythology, even as this enemy rewrote our history. At that point, the White heart was deprived of life-giving blood. But just look at the benefits of exercise, good nutrition, and angioplasty in coronary artery disease.

There is nothing for us unless we strive on. Always. When Pandora's box was opened, the only thing left in it after it was closed was hope. WELL, what do YOU think? Whether YOU are in the USA or somewhere else!

[SpearBrave]

As usual the whites in America are slow to react. To most Americans as long as they have a job,house and a TV they are happy.
On the other hand in my short life jobs,houses,and TVs have gotten harder to get.

[velvet]

I asked almost the same question some days ago, why the movement, despite all its noble goals and quality thinkers, cant form a unity, cant unite the forces that I believe we have, but somehow are unable to direct to the necessary steps.
Many people seem to be disillusioned, without a true vision, and discouraged by the threats one faces when actually standing in for what you believe in (in Germany you can end for some 'thought crimes' for several years in prison, just like in many other countries in Europe) and the social stigma it brings.

But I dont think that we have another 100 years, not even the 35 left when starting to count from end of WWII. And change dont happen without risk, so waiting for optimal conditions is just a bad excuse for not taking the risk. I think we dont have much to lose anymore but much to gain.

Yes, to a certain degree I agree that we need some sort of spirtual energy, but neither Hitlerism nor x-tianity will be of any help. Hitler is dead, and I dont believe in the messianic concept in general. But still, we need a spiritual force that is able to unite us as a folk, that to a certain degree determines the path to go. Sometimes I think the problem is not so much that we all dont agree about the threats we face, we do, but mainly about the solutions that we cant agree on.

Certainly the countless different spiritual beliefs, which also determine your stance on policy, life, morals etc, are one factor why that unity doesnt come to be.


You note your religion as catholic/esotheric NS, which sounds a bit weird to me, in addition you throw in the Wotan archetype. Would you mind to elaborate on this please? I dont think that is so easily reconciled, actually I would assume that it is not possible to reconcile catholicism with the heathen based esoteric NS branche, since both religious paths are diametrical opposed to each other.

[Willow]

As I always say, there's a general sense of apathy around nowadays. People are well and truly brainwashed, and more interested in what the latest 'celebrity' is doing, or what's happening on the latest 'big brother' or some garbage, not to mention the obsession with image and with sex. And don't forget the role consumerism has to play. The 'bread and circuses' phrase comes to mind, except now it's a case of 'bread and shopping'.
These are the concerns of the modern man/woman, and they couldn't give a damn about heritage or race. Correct me if you think i'm wrong, but that's my impression.

[Ocko]

I think our idea and aspiration can't get to the people right now. That might change in the future if the change movement is going to continue.

There is a lot of pressure in the kettle, 9-11 truth movement, birthers, healthcare, hatelaws you name it. It seems that pressure is close to burst. Which finally might end in a free press. The internet is good but for that it is not efficient enough.

I thought it might be good to start a little print media in your local area and distribute in cafe's public places etc. Also to go into different discussion groups only and state your opinions clearly and loudly. I have seen that and for me it was a relieve to see that I am not alone. That might be a good point for other people to come out from their cover.

I do regularly go into public discussion of big newspapers and state my opinion. As you do it without insult most often it is not going to be deleted.

After a while one gets better with arguing because you know the stereotype comments.

The good thing about us is that our ideas are fresh and new and definetly different than pc. A lot of people are fed up with pc. Lets not leave them alone.

[MCP3]

As I always say, there's a general sense of apathy around nowadays. People are well and truly brainwashed, and more interested in what the latest 'celebrity' is doing, or what's happening on the latest 'big brother' or some garbage, not to mention the obsession with image and with sex. And don't forget the role consumerism has to play. The 'bread and circuses' phrase comes to mind, except now it's a case of 'bread and shopping'.
These are the concerns of the modern man/woman, and they couldn't give a damn about heritage or race. Correct me if you think i'm wrong, but that's my impression.

Great post ! The reasons are the same in the US/CDN. Also of course any type of WN is vilified by WW2 propaganda and "KKK hanging poor negroes" stereotype. As long as the "Greatest Generation", Winston Churchill and FDR are worshiped no healing will take place. The racial cause is always the enemy of the USA state and the international high finance that control the so called "free West." The state ideology is promoting a multi-national, multiracial, multi cultural society in favor of race mixing. As long as these structures are in power there will be no change, the White race will continue to die. The anti-Germanism in both the US and Great Britain are still rampant and startling.

[Old Winter]

In my land we have what i would call: The new rightwinged movement, this movement mostly got of the ground after the politician Fortuyn got into politics, its pro the government of the USA, pro-Israel, against ''mass'' immigration, very anti-islam.

Its big, and most people of this new rightwinged movement now vote on Wilders.

Why is the pro-Germanic scene not taken of ? from what i see is that the information you see on this page and other nationalist forums (pro-Germanic or just plain pro-white like Stormfront) is not to be found on other places while the new rightwinged people spread their information about muslims and islam all over the internet.

What we need ? people who spread their knowledge and facts all over the internet and not just on some forums where everyone already knows everything about it...

Just because you know it doesn't mean everyone does...

I have seen many big rightwinged forums but no one there knows that for example the involvement of the Jewish/zionist world in the immigration laws, to just give one of many examples.

[Chlodovech]

Preaching to an audience that is not ready to receive the message is a daunting task - especially if they hear the nationalist voice just once, and the lies of the media all the time. Our dissent is sort of blotted out that way. It's better to set smaller goals, and try to meet them within geographically confined areas; slicing the cake, influencing our personal environment is a must, and to focus on gathering resources to assist us thereby - that is something each and everyone of us can do, and we don't need a vast network to support us in doing so. Just like the Wehrmacht, each soldier is his own general. And each little skirmish is part of the war.

The matter of serious organized militancy is complex, but it's necessary to point out that all Western countries suffer from apathy, individualism and from 'ontzuiling', as we call it in Flanders: society was once divided on clear ideological lines, political parties had their own imperia, youth movements and the militants that emerged from it, unions, newspapers, organisations from the social middle of the field ... all of that is gone, the masses are disorganised in this neoliberal dystopia of ours.

All sort of radicals suffer from this socio-political evolution, including Skadites.

But I dont think that we have another 100 years, not even the 35 left when starting to count from end of WWII.

One in five children don't speak Dutch with their mother in Flanders. At this rate, we only have, indeed a couple of decades, and that is an optimistic estimation - since the EU wants to import many more millions of foreigners in the immediate future.

Yes, to a certain degree I agree that we need some sort of spirtual energy, but neither Hitlerism nor x-tianity will be of any help. Hitler is dead, and I dont believe in the messianic concept in general. But still, we need a spiritual force that is able to unite us as a folk, that to a certain degree determines the path to go. Sometimes I think the problem is not so much that we all dont agree about the threats we face, we do, but mainly about the solutions that we cant agree on.

I doubt a spiritual regeneration of any sort is going to take place, I know many Skadites long for it (including me) but it's the most unlikely thing. Any sort of 'movement' to oppose this system in Europe, would realistically have to be an "atheist" enterprise - so to speak. So be it.

Certainly the countless different spiritual beliefs, which also determine your stance on policy, life, morals etc, are one factor why that unity doesnt come to be.

I think these things are not as important right now, I don't observe meaningful division amongst radical nationalists - or, rather, I'm not convinced we are hindered by it in a way that prevents us from gaining momentum, not in our current situation. And maybe these difference might become even more trivial because of the nature of our struggle - a whole new ideology with its own set of values might arise from it. Yet all of these differences have more to do with what can be done with political power once it is achieved, and that is not the immediate question for us.

You note your religion as catholic/esotheric NS, which sounds a bit weird to me, in addition you throw in the Wotan archetype. Would you mind to elaborate on this please? I dont think that is so easily reconciled, actually I would assume that it is not possible to reconcile catholicism with the heathen based esoteric NS branche, since both religious paths are diametrical opposed to each other.

In France there were (and still are) several esoteric, catholic pro-national socialist/fascist/monarchist think tanks, spiritual groups and organisations set up as lodges against the lodges. In fact, except for Skadi, I visit one other forum, and that forum is centered just around the subject mentioned above, there's a lot to be said about it. For instance, unlike messianic Judaism, Christianity is ingrained with the Pagan idea of the death and the rebirth of the Sun (and it has its grail mysticism). Emperor Constantine, who kickstarted the RCC, identified the Christian God with the solar god.

[velvet]

Preaching to an audience that is not ready to receive the message is a daunting task - especially if they hear the nationalist voice just once, and the lies of the media all the time. Our dissent is sort of blotted out that way. It's better to set smaller goals, and try to meet them within geographically confined areas; slicing the cake, influencing our personal environment is a must, and to focus on gathering resources to assist us thereby - that is something each and everyone of us can do, and we don't need a vast network to support us in doing so. Just like the Wehrmacht, each soldier is his own general. And each little skirmish is part of the war.

True, but a network will help. First, you cant collect the mass of information on your own, it is much easier to concentrate on the concrete task to spread the word when you have a knowledge and news resource like Skadi. It's hard enough to reproduce it in a way that people will listen over the first sentence to you
Second, when you play the lone wolf, without such a network in your back, you will feel all your efforts much too soon to be pointless, because you cant estimate the success.
So, networking, in one way or another, will be necessary, also because the messages delivered should be ideally go at least into the same direction, for that people are able to recognise that there is more of a movement than the lone wolf houling against the democratic pc machinery (a necessary requirement in this day and age where not even village mayors are able to stand against the next level above them).

The matter of serious organized militancy is complex, but it's necessary to point out that all Western countries suffer from apathy, individualism and from 'ontzuiling', as we call it in Flanders: society was once divided on clear ideological lines, political parties had their own imperia, youth movements and the militants that emerged from it, unions, newspapers, organisations from the social middle of the field ... all of that is gone, the masses are disorganised in this neoliberal dystopia of ours.

Yes, but how to overcome the apathy and lack of utopia?

All sort of radicals suffer from this socio-political evolution, including Skadites.

Devolution, and again, unfortunately true.

One in five children don't speak Dutch with their mother in Flanders. At this rate, we only have, indeed a couple of decades, and that is an optimistic estimation - since the EU wants to import many more millions of foreigners in the immediate future.

Should we say that luckily our political apparatus is usually slow and will create another five years of 'waiting for the storm'?
We talked about the remaining time we probably have to get the momentum, with this flooding plan the time frame is at best until 2014, maybe 2015, more likely but earlier than 2012.
(I have the feeling that this is an appropiate moment for panicking)

I doubt a spiritual regeneration of any sort is going to take place, I know many Skadites long for it (including me) but it's the most unlikely thing. Any sort of 'movement' to oppose this system in Europe, would realistically have to be an "atheist" enterprise - so to speak. So be it.

But whether it is something spiritual or atheist in nature, there must be something people can believe in, otherwise a movement that involves the so far dull masses (which are at least required not to fight against those who will fight at the end for them too) will not come to be.

I think these things are not as important right now, I don't observe meaningful division amongst radical nationalists - or, rather, I'm not convinced we are hindered by it in a way that prevents us from gaining momentum, not in our current situation. And maybe these difference might become even more trivial because of the nature of our struggle - a whole new ideology with its own set of values might arise from it. Yet all of these differences have more to do with what can be done with political power once it is achieved, and that is not the immediate question for us.

You're right, there are more immediate threats to stand against, but so far the unity doesnt come to be not because all the 'radicals' dont agree on the problems we have but on the solutions thereof. One group doesnt side with another because they have differing visions about the 'thereafter'. They start to fight internally about leading positions, who will be allowed to form the leading caste, how the society will/should look etc pp before there is even hope to be in a position to think about that.

In France there were (and still are) several esoteric, catholic pro-national socialist/fascist/monarchist think tanks, spiritual groups and organisations set up as lodges against the lodges. In fact, except for Skadi, I visit one other forum, and that forum is centered just around the subject mentioned above, there's a lot to be said about it. For instance, unlike messianic Judaism, Christianity is ingrained with the Pagan idea of the death and the rebirth of the Sun (and it has its grail mysticism). Emperor Constantine, who kickstarted the RCC, identified the Christian God with the solar god.

France always have been different in many aspects. France announced an own pope, France was the source for many strong movements throughout the centuries, the French people always were eager and willing to revolt, even today. Qualitities that I honestly admire in them.
Point is, this has never happened here. The German 'revolt' against the Roman pope was limited to a pointless paper of thesises, revolts against monarchs were limited to the person, unlike the French a revolt never resulted in a vast system change. You cant compare the French with us, they obviously are very different. Can we learn from them? Surely, and we should learn soon. But again, the German(ic)s obviously got so rotten that they are not able to really revolt anymore (I'm sure that this once was different, however).

When you say that this version of christianity is more pagan than christian, the question remains, why not build on the real thing (Germanic heathenism) and abandon the fake one alltogether? There are things in christianity that will never be reconcilable with the heathen core, not without twisting and perverting both, so this version will forever be weaker than the real thing. When you adore the sun god, why not adore our own sun god Tiuz instead of an alien 'Jesus' figure? When you adore the earth, why not adore our own earth goddess Jord with all her fertility cults instead of the infertile desert earth?
Why twist something to fit into one or another system when we can have our own, which is identified with our Blood and Soil, with our folk, with our soul, with our very lives in this, our region of the world?

It would just be right, and it makes me sad to see that people like you, whom I hold in the highest esteem, cant or wont understand this. The lack of spiritual identity grounds in the fact that all this is alien to us, that it doesnt depict our world but a world which is thousands of miles away, a desert instead of fertile green soil and wild seas, an alien mindset instead of our own, alien values instead of our own, alien laws and alien gods instead of our own, alien fathers instead of the fathers and mothers of our folk who gave the laws for us. For us alone.

I dont want to turn that into another heathendom vs christianity thread, but you know my stance on this, only our own cult and culture is able to offer the identity we need, the identity for which people will be willing to fight for. Cult and culture, folk, Blood and Soil, this all is ONE. We are dying because our root is cut off

We dont need an utopia, no ivory towers in far away skies, we have something to gain from reality, from the very possible vision of our own, true culture. It happened once, almost, and judging by the forces that were needed to fight us down again after only a few years, it was the ultimate power. Not even 60 years of reeducation could eradicate fully what was awakend back then. Maybe the concrete methods were wrong, but we know the goal: identity.

[Sigurd]

Why has it not taken off? One short answer: People's ego-trips and people being too particular about only supporting that which heralds their views at least 120%. People not willing to see the big picture for their need to fondle their ego's testicles 24/7.

Instead of uniting under a common banner and realising that we have to create something on the basis of a common patriotic/nationalist ground before we can further squabble about lesser ideological battles, i.e. different strands of nationalism, people like to practice the old infighting.

Someone opens a Party or an Organisation and people are wont to criticise it for being "too restrictive", "too liberal", "too socialist", "too capitalist", "too revolutionary", "too conservative", you name it. At the same time, nothing much happens because people are too caught up fighting with each other.

But it's not even between different strands of opinion, it's even the same within pretty much the same worldview that people start to squabble about petty things: One day, two leading activist friends and comrades were arguing about the way a leaflet should look and were not on speaking terms over it for a couple of weeks! Symptomatic, really...

And if there is not even a petty thing, then one is created for people to inflate their own egos. The FPÖ, in one of its strongest villages in Tyrol, has recently, in a sub-quorum meeting of its local committee, excluded its leading activist, long-year village leader, and probably the reason why it has performed so well in that village ... they claim "behaviour likely to damage the repute of the party", but in truth it's just another one of ego-manic usurperdom where the deserved got ditched because he had a few ideas that weren't liked by his jealous left and right hands who want their fifteen minutes of fame, too.

In short: Too many self-styled leaders and megalomaniacs who'd want to be the next Führer themselves, focussing on their personal fifteen minutes of fame rather than actually doing something worthwhile for the movement.

This is not specific to Austria or Germany, the problems are all the same the Germanic world over, whether in Europe or in the Former Colonies.