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Thread: A PETA catalog of literature

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    Senior Member Mac Seafraidh's Avatar
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    Cool A PETA catalog of literature

    http://petaliterature.com/Order.asp I do not support Veganism though which they are pretty strong with.

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    Post Re: A PETA catalog of literature

    Quote Originally Posted by MVSSOLINI MIT VNS
    http://petaliterature.com/Order.asp I do not support Veganism though which they are pretty strong with.
    Peta is an awfully hypocritical organization. There is a very funny t.v. show I saw at a friends house [I dont have a t.v.] With Penn & Teller called ''bulls**t'' That did a show on them. Didnt make 'em look real great! Anyone else see it??? I think its on H.B.O. Or Showtime.
    Some days you just want to holler your head off!!!

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    Senior Member Turificator's Avatar
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    Post Re: A PETA catalog of literature

    I think there are some very committed people in Peta, although I stopped supporting their Italian counterpart ('Animalisti Italiani') some time ago (let's say their leader Walter Caporale, who isn't even vegan, made quite a few financial mistakes...). The problem with big organizations like that I guess is the money involved... grassroots orginizations are far easier to control. Anyway, thanks for the link...

    VEGAN POWER!
    WHITE POWER!

    BLUT UND BODEN!

    Some find it in a flag, some in the beat of a drum
    Some with a book, and some with a gun
    Some in a kiss, and some on the march
    But if you're looking for Europe, best look in your heart

    (Sol Invictus)

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    Senior Member Mac Seafraidh's Avatar
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    Post Re: A PETA catalog of literature

    No problem Camerato, I think it would be too hard for me to become Vegan. Wait a minute, I think I am actually an Ovo-Lacto-Pisco Vegetarian(spelling probably incorrect.) If yu eat eggs and have dairy then I think that is what I am.



    Quote Originally Posted by Turificator
    I think there are some very committed people in Peta, although I stopped supporting their Italian counterpart ('Animalisti Italiani') some time ago (let's say their leader Walter Caporale, who isn't even vegan, made quite a few financial mistakes...). The problem with big organizations like that I guess is the money involved... grassroots orginizations are far easier to control. Anyway, thanks for the link...

    VEGAN POWER!
    WHITE POWER!


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    Post Re: A PETA catalog of literature

    I think PETA's belief about protecting animals is reasonable. Animals deserve to be treated in a kind and humane manner. Fighting against the pointless killing of animals for fashion/beauty products and capitalistic gain is pretty admirable. I just think PETA takes it way passed extreme. The members should accept the fact that most people eat meat, and nothing that they do is going to change that....They need to cut all of the hostile BS and drop their "holier than thou" attitude because there is nothing wrong with raising animals to be eaten...It's not like cows and chickens are endangered species.

    I don't feel that trying to force veganism on the masses is the best idea...It may create some misconceptions about the lifestyle of veganism...I am going to go a bit off topic and center on the pros and cons of being a vegan.

    As a nursing student, I can affirm that veganism isn't as healthy as it is claimed to be. Our body is not capable of synthesizing some very long carbon chain fatty acids, and the only way to aquire them is through animal products, or through a strict and unwavering regimen of dietary supplements. However, If a person chooses to be vegan for ethical reasons, forget pills, obviously pills dont grow in trees, and require the same animal hunting as meat...

    It has been medically proven that Vegans live in a constant state of metabolic depression, with lower activity tolerance and a tendency to be easily tired. They have several changes in their phisiology, including lower digestion rates (which can turn really problematic: IBS for instance), constant muscle-degeneration, need for longer sleep cycles, etc.


    I'm not saying that vegans die because of their diet, however, it is an illusion that veganism is healthier. Fat and animal protein are not a poison, they are actually necessary to the human body. Vitamin B12, Vitamin D, dietary Zinc, Retinol, Vitamin C 20-22, polyunsaturated fatty acids and Iron, are simply some of the necessary and beneficial nutrients found in meat.

    Health Concerns and Nutrition of the Vegan diet:

    Vitamin B12 is present in substantial amounts only in animal foods. It is present in milk, but not in plentiful amounts, and its concentration is greatly reduced if the milk is boiled (pasteurized). This vitamin is required for the synthesis of myelin which acts as an insulating sheath for nerves. Deficiencies of Vitamin B12 at critical stages of nervous tissue development can result in irreversible damage to the nervous system.

    Also, the vegan diet is rich in polyunsaturated fatty acids as distinct from saturated fatty acids. Moreover, the ratio of linoleic/linolenic acid tends to be high and this is likely to inhibit the conversion of %-linolenic acid to docosahexaenoic acid. This may be important, as docosahexaenoic acid is absent from vegan diets. This acid is believed to play a role in retina and nervous system function.

    There are two forms of dietary iron; haem iron (which is present in animal products) and nonhaem iron (which is present in foods of animal and plant origin). Nonhaem iron is usually less well absorbed than haem iron, and vegans have limited, to no, intakes of the haem form. This introduces a risk of iron deficiency anaemia among vegans, especially for milk fed infants and for women who either are prone to losing more than usual amounts of iron during menstruation, or, have reduced iron intakes whilst dieting.
    Vitamin C is thought to assist in the absorption of nonhaem iron by the gut and this may be an important feature for vegans. Phytates, tannins, phosphates, fibres and soybean protein which are common ingredients in the vegan diet have an opposing effect, as they inhibit iron absorption by the gut.

    See, there are actual health deficiencies and risks associated with a vegan diet.

    The comfort and sensation of better health that most vegans describe, actually more often comes from other effects, such as associated lifestyle change, emotional changes, and the "placebo-emotional" effect.
    When passing through veganism, most people associate several changes to their routines: increase in self-esteem, a sense of accomplishment, general elevation in emotions,etc., which are often the reasons for a sometimes dramatic improvement in their health and overall well-being.
    Add to that, the fact that they EXPECT to feel better also makes them feel better, (i.e. the placebo effect).

    However, veganism is a lifestyle choice that shouldn't be discouraged or given a bad rap. It is a technique for gaining control of ones life, building a sense of commitment and stability. It is not simply a new way to eat, it is a spiritual undertaking that can prove mentally rewarding for dedicated individuals. The decision to switch to veganism should only be enacted after a slow and well-thought transition (that is an extremely important thing to think about when one changes their diet dramatically, a bad transition can send your body straight into a state of shock and may even physically, and irreversibly, damage the brain).

    Veganism is not a fad diet or a way to shed a few extra pounds, it's a way of life with which comes a whole new way of thinking and acting. So what I'm saying is that when choosing to undergo the transformation of converting to veganism....Think before you act, it is a serious choice that deserves some serious consideration.

    Note: Turficator...I feel the evil eye coming from you I'm not bashing veganism, I am only reflecting it from a medical stand point. It is my job, I'm an advocate for human health, all forms of it. I applaud your strength and dedication to your veganistic ways...I know that I certainly don't posses the will or discipline for such a cause....I would only last a few days before I said "screw this" and went out for a t-bone steak
    "Nature! We are surrounded and embraced by her:
    powerless to separate ourselves from her, and powerless to penetrate beyond her.

    Without asking, or warning, she snatches us up into her circling dance, and whirls us on until we are tired, and drop from her arms." - Goethe

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    Senior Member Turificator's Avatar
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    Post Re: A PETA catalog of literature

    Don't worry, TisaAnne, I don't make a dogma of my veganism.

    From a medical point of view, while some of the points you raised are indeed correct, it is unreasonable to claim that today veganism is not a healthy choice. There are far too many studies which prove the exact opposite. Vitamin B-12 deficency, for instance, is hardly a problem, unless you take no supplements whatsoever for years (and even then, you likely is it for you to develop a deficency?).

    We could go on for ever debating the health merits of veganism. For every negative claim you make I could come up with 10 positive ones- and vice versa I guess. However you look at the diet, you cannot claim that, if followed correctly, it is harmful in any way. Even the American Dietetic Association (hardly a radical group, and one much exposed to the pressure of agrocultural lobbies) claims that a strict vegan diet (no animal products), if followed correctly (as all diets should be!) is healthy. I have personally been following this diet for 5 years and I feel it has only improved my health.

    I am not claiming everybody in the world should stop eating animal products, or that veganism is the ideal diet for everyone. I am making a political and ethical choice to boicot exploitative industries, which torture animals and pillage the Earth, which I hold sacred ('Blut und Boden' should be more than just a slogan).

    You claim Peta are right in fighting the abuse of animals for fashion or beauty, but I don't see why this should be unecceptable while it is fine to raise billions of crippled (i.e. genetically deformed), grotesque creatures to a life of brutality for the consumption of food products we don't need.

    I don't want to sound 'holier than thou' or go off on a rant, believe me... it's just that I find it slightly hypocritical to claim that murdering animals for fur (in the context of the present industrial liberal-capitalist society) is wrong, while it's not to murder them for milk, eggs and meat. I would much rather prefer people being honest and just claiming that they like animal products or can't take a step towards reducing their consumption of them. That's ok- nobody's if perfect (I just happen not to be gluttonous... I have other vices...).
    BLUT UND BODEN!

    Some find it in a flag, some in the beat of a drum
    Some with a book, and some with a gun
    Some in a kiss, and some on the march
    But if you're looking for Europe, best look in your heart

    (Sol Invictus)

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    Post Re: A PETA catalog of literature

    Quote Originally Posted by Turificator
    I don't want to sound 'holier than thou' or go off on a rant, believe me... it's just that I find it slightly hypocritical to claim that murdering animals for fur (in the context of the present industrial liberal-capitalist society) is wrong, while it's not to murder them for milk, eggs and meat. I would much rather prefer people being honest and just claiming that they like animal products or can't take a step towards reducing their consumption of them. That's ok- nobody's if perfect (I just happen not to be gluttonous... I have other vices...).
    To me, animals serve many purposes...one which happens to be that of food. When killing an animal for food, for instance a cow: All parts are utilized, whether it be the heart, brain, liver, muscles, hooves, bones, hide...everything is used. Nothing is wasted. I guess I have sort of adopted the Native American philosophy about animals - If you kill an animal, utilize every part and waste nothing. When nothing is wasted, the animal's death was not in vain.

    Sure, people can surrvive on a diet completely devoid of animal products...but that would probably be a challenge that few people could undertake. An omnivorous diet has been the rule since the beginning of time...It is human nature, so why is it viewed as a gross injustice by some people?

    Killing animals for the sole purpose of making clothing or other materialistic manifestation: Animals that are killed for clothing (exempting cows, pigs, buffalo, and other edible meat/useable hide animals) are simply killed for their pelts...nothing more. They kill the animal, skin it and toss the rest as if were garbage. Think of all the little minks, rabbits or baby seals, etc., that have been killed for aesthetic pleasure...95% of the animal is just completely wasted. To me, that is wrong. There was a time when it was necessary to wear the skins of animals, but that was so long ago and it's not necessary now...we have textiles both natural and synthetic that serve that purpose.

    I justify my view of animals as this: If it is serving a purpose, being utilized to it's full extent...if people are benefitting from it in an essential way, then why not? It's not like people go around killing cows for a few choice cuts of meat and leaving the rest for the buzzards...it is not wasted. Yes, I feel bad that any animal has to die, but I view it as one of life's necessary evils.

    I lived a vegetarian (I just couldn't swing veganism ) lifestyle for a few years...I admit, I loved it. The plethra of available vegetables, fruits and grains out there is astounding and one could never possibly suffer from boredom with the cuisine...I just decided that I enjoyed my meat, right along with my veggies. An omnivorous diet is complete, balanced and satisfying. Most people would agree.
    "Nature! We are surrounded and embraced by her:
    powerless to separate ourselves from her, and powerless to penetrate beyond her.

    Without asking, or warning, she snatches us up into her circling dance, and whirls us on until we are tired, and drop from her arms." - Goethe

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    Senior Member Ewergrin's Avatar
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    Post Re: A PETA catalog of literature

    Quote Originally Posted by kinvolk
    Peta is an awfully hypocritical organization. There is a very funny t.v. show I saw at a friends house [I dont have a t.v.] With Penn & Teller called ''bulls**t'' That did a show on them. Didnt make 'em look real great! Anyone else see it??? I think its on H.B.O. Or Showtime.

    It's Showtime, and I have seen it. Talk about a eye-opener. Exposing hypocrisy after hypocrisy in the PETA organization. If I recall correctly, PETA, being a non profit organization, has to make their tax return public information. It was discovered that they wrote off a purchase of about 9K, which ended up being a massive walk-in freezer, similar to the kind you find in all resturants. Turns out that out of the few thousand animals they took in over the past year, almost 80% of them, PETA euthanized, and kept the bodies in that freezer. How's that for humane? Also, one of the members of PETAs upper eschalon is a cancer survivor. It was made public that the medicine that she took in order to overcome her cancer was made available due to ANIMAL TESTING. When she was confronted about it, she said, matter of factly, that it was then okay for her to use the drugs that were made available as a direct result of testing on animals because she was using her life to try and save theirs.

    Another point, PETA kills humans, bombs facilities and laboratories, makes death threats consistantly, all in the name of protecting the sacred animal. They advocate veganism. Yet, the estimated amount of annual accidental animal deaths as a result of harvesting crops is astounding. Whenever those large combines start rolling through wheat fields and corn fields, harvesting crops for the vegans to suck on, millions of animals die. Sure, they are not exactly the nicest animals. Field mice, rabbits, moles, gophers, and whatever other kinds of small rodents and I'm sure dozens of other species of animals are then churned up in these massive combine blades. For what? As I recall, PETA has yet to make a clear stand on this issue.

    PETA is nothing but a domestic terrorism organization. These people are radical, they possess not the ability to discern between right and wrong and they clearly suffer from some sort of mass delusion. They are sending convicted felons into our schools and recruiting our children to follow in their ridiculous mantra.

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    Senior Member Ewergrin's Avatar
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    Post Re: A PETA catalog of literature

    Quote Originally Posted by TisaAnne
    I think PETA's belief about protecting animals is reasonable.
    I think that perhaps they started reasonable, but it has been many years since reason walked out of the door for them.

    Animals deserve to be treated in a kind and humane manner.
    Absolutely.

    Fighting against the pointless killing of animals for fashion/beauty products and capitalistic gain is pretty admirable.
    Admirable? I don't think so. You have to look at it in the eyes of others. To the people using animal by-products, it isn't pointless. Doesn't mean I agree with it, necessarily, though.

    They need to cut all of the hostile BS and drop their "holier than thou" attitude because there is nothing wrong with raising animals to be eaten...It's not like cows and chickens are endangered species.
    Sounds great in theory, however, you cannot reason with these lunatics.

    I don't feel that trying to force veganism on the masses is the best idea...
    Warning: Trying to force veganism on me will be harmful to your health.
    (Not you, of course, I was merely replying to the idea, not to you.)

    See, there are actual health deficiencies and risks associated with a vegan diet.
    Of course there are. In my opinion it is just not natural. Of course, I do not deny anyone the right to choose veganism as their path in life. I just don't understand the need for those who are extreme in their views to forcefeed it down my throat, or tell me I am a murderer because I eat the flesh of animals. In my opinion, the majority (or at least a substantial portion) of these so-called vegans are not focusing on the "benefits" of the vegan diet in relation to health, but instead are focusing on the activism aspect and the level of social involvement they achieve due to being part of this so-called "movement." Veganism is merely a by-product to them.

    The comfort and sensation of better health that most vegans describe, actually more often comes from other effects, such as associated lifestyle change, emotional changes, and the "placebo-emotional" effect.
    When passing through veganism, most people associate several changes to their routines: increase in self-esteem, a sense of accomplishment, general elevation in emotions,etc., which are often the reasons for a sometimes dramatic improvement in their health and overall well-being.
    Add to that, the fact that they EXPECT to feel better also makes them feel better, (i.e. the placebo effect).
    They will undoubtedly argue the point that if it indeed makes them feel better, regardless of whether or not it is a result of a "placebo effect," is there enough reason not to continue on with what they are doing? Sure, not eating meat may not be the real reason they feel so much better, but since they are feeling better, it's no reason to discontinue what they've been doing. Besides, more steak for me.

    However, veganism is a lifestyle choice that shouldn't be discouraged or given a bad rap. It is a technique for gaining control of ones life, building a sense of commitment and stability. It is not simply a new way to eat, it is a spiritual undertaking that can prove mentally rewarding for dedicated individuals.
    I agree. There is nothing wrong with the diet itself, if that's what they are into. It's when it becomes a by-product for some self-involved, well-intention, meaningful dialogue types with an agenda is when it becomes tainted and therefore ruining it (not really, but definitely putting a bad spin on it) for the ones who choose that lifestyle for it's true benefits (that being a "healthier" body, mind and spirit.)

    Veganism is not a fad diet or a way to shed a few extra pounds, it's a way of life with which comes a whole new way of thinking and acting. So what I'm saying is that when choosing to undergo the transformation of converting to veganism....Think before you act, it is a serious choice that deserves some serious consideration.
    Not sure I agree with you on this one. A majority of the people who decide they want to seek this type of life are probably going to fail at it and return to doing what they do best: eating meat. I think that switching to veganism is something that probably doesn't require a lot of will power to start, but requires a significant amount to sustain.

    Overall I think your sentiments are pretty much on the same page as mine. Which reminds me, where in the U.S. do you live? I know of a great steak joint in my city.

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    Senior Member Ewergrin's Avatar
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    Post Re: A PETA catalog of literature

    Quote Originally Posted by Turificator
    I don't want to sound 'holier than thou' or go off on a rant, believe me... it's just that I find it slightly hypocritical to claim that murdering animals for fur (in the context of the present industrial liberal-capitalist society) is wrong, while it's not to murder them for milk, eggs and meat. I would much rather prefer people being honest and just claiming that they like animal products or can't take a step towards reducing their consumption of them. That's ok- nobody's if perfect (I just happen not to be gluttonous... I have other vices...).

    I love animal products. I don't mind wearing animal skin.
    I definitely do not believe that these things make one "gluttonous" by any stretch of the imagination.
    Quite simple:
    Every one of our ancestors ate animals. There is nothing wrong with it and claiming that it makes one "gluttonous" is definitely extreme.
    What are your other vices, if I may be so bold?

    Please don't misunderstand me. I support anyone who chooses veganism as their daily diet. I just do not appreciate said vegans claiming my lifestyle is something unnatural, or downright "sinful" (good thing I do not believe in sin, or else I would be pissed! )

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