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Thread: Scandinavians and the "Germanic" Nomenclature

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    Bjųrnstjerne Bjųrnson in 1901:
    – Jeg er Pangerman, jeg er Teuton og mitt Livs stųrste Ųnske er, at Sydgermanerne og Nordgermanerne og deres udvandrede Brųdre maa finde hverandre i et Forbund.
    "I am pan-Germanic, I am Teuton and my greatest wish is to find southern and northern Germanics and their expatriate brothers in a federation."

    Two other Norwegians, Ibsen and Hamsun also in part supported this idea. The brothers Grimm and later Wagner were some of the key persons behind this idea in Germany.

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  3. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vķšįlfr View Post
    I agree that this might deserve a topic on its own, but Germany as an 'invading enemy' to Norway? I don't know if I can agree with this one...
    Well, they literally invaded Norway, with soldiers, weapons and armor, and occupied the country by force for five years. So I don't see much of a basis to contest that. I'm not saying the relationship between Norway and Germany was anything like that between Germany and France, or Germany and Britain. But they were still never invited to ship 250.000 troops to our country and subjugate the Norwegian people.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vķšįlfr View Post
    There were migrations since ancient times, and mixed families within the same meta-ethnicity...
    Hardly involving 10% of the fertile female populations. Such a magnitude usually only happens during war/occupation.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vķšįlfr View Post
    This is debatable! What was the whole purpose of this? I think it was for a higher purpose...
    And what purpose would that be? The creation of a Pan-Germanic People? I doubt that. Even the Wehrmacht made official statements, advocating against German soldier having relationships and making children with foreign women (including Norwegian women), as there were a disproportionate amount of single and widowed women back in Germany.

    Also, a lot of the German soldiers supposedly already had wives and kids back home. And from the reports of the internment camps in the wake of the war, up to one third of the girls who were sent there for having relationships with Germans, had some kind of STD (normally syphilis or gonorrhea). So I don't think we should glorify the supposed sanctity of these relationship too much.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vķšįlfr View Post
    I can understand your stance on this, and I've heard arguments like these many times, also related to other cases, for example in Romania, about mixed families, German-Romanian. It's usually about the women who were Romanian and the men who were another ethnicity, and men often judge them and dare to call them whores for not marrying and having children with Romanian men, but with 'foreigners', for example Germans. It's usually men who complain about such things, for losing their women to better men from other ethnicities.
    I think the shaming and condemnation of women coupling outside their own Nation, comes from a sense of perceived disloyalty to responsibilities towards the survival and well-being of their Nation. Women, on the whole, decide which groups of men have children, and which groups doesn't. If a Nation loses 10% of their fertile women to outside groups every generation, it hampers the Nation's fertility rate by 20% every passing generation. It makes all the sense in the World, for a Nationalist, to be opposed to that. However, if it happens on a small scale, it doesn't matter much, and could even be beneficial.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vķšįlfr View Post
    I can understand the reasons, of course, but I cannot accept such insults because it's also the case of my Daco-Romanian great-grandmother who married a German man. I am very proud of my German side, so I cannot accept such accusations! Usually I just ignore them, because the debates on these issues can be endless, finding arguments on both sides...
    I'm glad you find pride in your heritage, and wouldn't want it any other way. But likewise you must understand why people who want to preserve their own distinct Nation disprove of ethnic mixing happening on a large scale.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vķšįlfr View Post
    Why judging things in barely black and white like that? I am sure there were other reasons too and not all women did that just to have a better social or economical status themselves. There is love too, for example... and often people also think about the future of their children, if they consider having a family and children.
    Climbing the socio-economic latter is a way to think about the future of one's children. I don't think that this was the only reason for these women, though. Surely genuine love happened as well. But there are several different factors which speak against this being the main motivation. Firstly, there's the language barrier. And then there's the social barrier - young women and soldiers rarely inhabit the same social circles, so they would need to be specifically sought out. Obviously, there was something which drew these women away from establishing relationships with Norwegian men, where they would have met none of these obstacles, even when there were obvious risks involved.
    A nation is an organic thing, historically defined.
    A wave of passionate energy which unites past, present and future generations

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