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Thread: Luxemburg, Between Romance Europe and Germanic Europe

  1. #21
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    Luxemburg, Between Romance Europe and Germanic Europe

    Small country bordered by Belgium, France, and Germany and the world's only remaining sovereign Grand Duchy. There's a similar case as with Switzerland. Luxembourg lies on the cultural divide between Romance Europe and Germanic Europe, borrowing customs from each of the distinct traditions. Luxembourg is a trilingual country; German, French and Luxembourgish are official languages.

    The question is, as it was posed in the Switzerland thread. What do you think should ideally be the status for Luxembourg? Should it preserve its status or should it be encouraged to join Germany? Or does it belong with Belgium and France? The motto of Luxembourg is "We want to remain what we are" ("Mir wëlle bleiwe wat mir sinn" in Luxembourgish). It refers to the ambition of the Luxembourgian people to remain separate from, and independent of, those neighbouring countries around it that have traditionally dominated it politically and militarily: Belgium, France, and Germany. Should they?

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    Why not rejoin the Netherlands?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Todesengel View Post
    Small country bordered by Belgium, France, and Germany and the world's only remaining sovereign Grand Duchy. There's a similar case as with Switzerland. Luxembourg lies on the cultural divide between Romance Europe and Germanic Europe, borrowing customs from each of the distinct traditions. Luxembourg is a trilingual country; German, French and Luxembourgish are official languages.

    The question is, as it was posed in the Switzerland thread. What do you think should ideally be the status for Luxembourg? Should it preserve its status or should it be encouraged to join Germany? Or does it belong with Belgium and France? The motto of Luxembourg is "We want to remain what we are" ("Mir wëlle bleiwe wat mir sinn" in Luxembourgish). It refers to the ambition of the Luxembourgian people to remain separate from, and independent of, those neighbouring countries around it that have traditionally dominated it politically and militarily: Belgium, France, and Germany. Should they?
    The Grand-Duchy of Luxembourg is ethnic and cultural German, Moselle-Frankish to be precisely, but it´s ruling caste is entirely francophilic. The witch-hunt against the native language and culture has not been as extreme as in Alsace, still there is no logic justification the Grand Duchy of Luxembourg is member of the „Organisation internationale de la Francophonie" .
    The Romance speaking parts of Luxembourg already have been taken by France and Belgium (other, German parts by Prussia), this map shows it good:



    Here a map of today´s Grand Duchy of Luxembourg (click to enlarge):



    The claim all parts of Luxembourg that were taken by Belgium were Romance speaking is false:



    The local Moselle-Frankish language was partly frenchisized, but still is spoken by most of the people, even the new coins bear "Lëtzebuerg" instead of the formerly used "Luxembourg", Luxembourgish does not differ from the Moselle-Frankish spoken in the neighbouring regions of Germany.



    An example of local heritage - "we want to remain what we are".



    I do not think the Luxembourgians want to join Germany again, about 1/3 of it´s inhabitants are immigrants, the problem is the lack of ethnic consciousness, not state-borders.

    Quote Originally Posted by Groene Wolf
    Why not rejoin the Netherlands?
    Why "rejoin"? The Netherlands and Luxembourg only were united through a dynastic personal-union, the Dutch kings were grand dukes of Luxembourg, this does not mean Luxembourg was part of The Netherlands, it was part of Germany, the Dutch kings German princes.
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  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Todesengel View Post
    The question is, as it was posed in the Switzerland thread. What do you think should ideally be the status for Luxembourg? Should it preserve its status or should it be encouraged to join Germany? Or does it belong with Belgium and France?
    It's ideal status would be as a Special Economic Zone of the Greater German Empire, due to it's low corporate taxes, business-friendly environment and specialization as an international financial center (World's 7th financial center, world's 2nd for investment funds). Kind of a Germanic Hong-Kong, Shenzhen or Macau.

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    I'm kind of agree with the proposition of Ahnenerbe.
    The business details make Luxembourg unique from other countries.
    But another thing, if its people really want to remain what they are, then they should stay true to their motto.

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    Luxembourg seems like a mixture between German and Dutch. I don't know if its inhabitants would feel more at home in one country than the other. In my view, there should be a separation between the French and Germans, like there should be in Belgium, or Alsace, so both groups can preserve their ethnicities, cultures and languages.

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    Is Luxembourg a "Real" Country?

    Could Luxembourg be considered a "real" nation, with it's own history and native people, or is it simply another on of those "microstates" that could quite easily be an integrated part either France or Germany (probably Germany for the most part).

    Another example, as far as I can see, San Marino isn't really a nation, the native language of it's people is Italian, the people are racially the same as Central Italians, and they have no cultural features which are distinctly San Marinese (sp?) - they are pretty much fully Italian, and while I don't speak much Italian, I would suspect that the San Marino accent is identical to the accent of that region of Italy.

    So, is Luxembourg a similar case in line with the likes of San Marino and Monaco, or does Luxembourg have more claims towards being a "real" nation than the examples of other "microstates" I've put forward here?

    I guess at the end of the day what creates a nation is a particular region having a culture and a language that is visibly distinct from others in the region, and the truth is most land-locked microstates are not visibly distinct from their bigger neighbour.

  8. #28
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    Well it is just a city-state, and a rich one (like all that still exist).

    When Germany was created, Bismarck specifically said it was not to part of Germany.

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    I think Luxemburg and Liechtenstein are there just to remind us that there was once a Reich.. and it wasn't such a bad thing. Why? Well unity is nice, but tyranny (FRG, Federal USA, etc.) is not. If a government is small, that makes it more difficult for it to crush a region's sensibilities and culture, like the urban hegemony in Britain crushed the fox hunters and gun owners.

    That's one of the reasons I don't like the EU.

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    They have their own accent I think. Germans should understand them though?

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