Page 1 of 5 12345 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 42

Thread: The Antichrist, Nietzsche. Book Study.

  1. #1
    Senior Member Moody's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Last Online
    Tuesday, July 10th, 2012 @ 09:18 AM
    Status
    Available
    Ethnicity
    English
    Ancestry
    Albion
    Subrace
    Paleo-Atlantid
    Country
    United Kingdom United Kingdom
    State
    Essex Essex
    Location
    England
    Gender
    Family
    Single adult
    Occupation
    Investigator of Souls
    Politics
    Pan-Germanic Nationalist
    Religion
    Runosophy
    Posts
    1,904
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    9
    Thanked in
    9 Posts

    Post The Antichrist, Nietzsche. Book Study.

    I want to start some on-line book studies.

    I say that Nietzsche's 'The Antichrist' will be a good place to start.

    Head your own posts, 'Preface', or 'Section 1' etc., according to which section you are commentating on, so we know where we are.

    Best to take one section at a time and not jump ahead, although some may do so to illuminate other sections.

    This could make for some interesting reviews once edited down.

    LINKS FOR THE ANTICHRIST ON-LINE;

    http://www.fns.org.uk/ac.htm

    www.publicappeal.org/library/nietzsche/Nietzsche_the_antichrist/the_antichrist.htm

    http://www.infidels.org/library/mode...ntichrist.html
    Last edited by Moody; Tuesday, December 12th, 2006 at 05:52 PM. Reason: updated thread
    Why are there beings at all, & why not rather nothing?
    [Leibniz/Heidegger]

  2. #2
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Last Online
    Tuesday, March 13th, 2018 @ 09:14 AM
    Status
    Prolonged Absence
    Ethnicity
    Dutch
    Gender
    Posts
    2,673
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    2
    Thanked in
    1 Post

    Post Nietzsche and nationalism

    What about the following:

    The conditions under which any one understands me, and necessarily understands me--I know them only too well. Even to endure my seriousness, my passion, he must carry intellectual integrity to the verge of hardness. He must be accustomed to living on mountain tops--and to looking upon the wretched gabble of politics and nationalism as beneath him.
    [Emphasis by me]
    What do you think about Nietzsche's attacks against nationalism? I have some thoughts of my own on this, but I'd like to hear what others think first.
    Last edited by Siegfried; Thursday, February 22nd, 2007 at 08:48 PM. Reason: split thread

  3. #3
    Senior Member Moody's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Last Online
    Tuesday, July 10th, 2012 @ 09:18 AM
    Status
    Available
    Ethnicity
    English
    Ancestry
    Albion
    Subrace
    Paleo-Atlantid
    Country
    United Kingdom United Kingdom
    State
    Essex Essex
    Location
    England
    Gender
    Family
    Single adult
    Occupation
    Investigator of Souls
    Politics
    Pan-Germanic Nationalist
    Religion
    Runosophy
    Posts
    1,904
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    9
    Thanked in
    9 Posts

    Post

    Quote Originally Posted by Siegfried Augustus
    What about the following:



    What do you think about Nietzsche's attacks against nationalism? I have some thoughts of my own on this, but I'd like to hear what others think first.
    I will add that;
    1) Philosophers must be 'big' enough to look at all sides of the issue.
    2) In terms of an aristocratic out-look, he has a point.
    3) He also says elsewhere that nationalism is necessary to COUNTER liberalism.

    I want to study Nietzsche closely to show the difference between philosophy and ideology: the philosopher will always be a heretic!
    Last edited by Moody; Thursday, May 6th, 2004 at 04:59 PM. Reason: split thread
    Why are there beings at all, & why not rather nothing?
    [Leibniz/Heidegger]

  4. #4
    Senior Member Scoob's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Last Online
    Friday, April 1st, 2005 @ 09:39 AM
    Subrace
    Europid
    Country
    European Union European Union
    Location
    Inside the Box
    Gender
    Politics
    Posthuman
    Posts
    836
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    6
    Thanked in
    6 Posts

    Post

    Quote Originally Posted by Moody Lawless
    I will add that;
    1) Philosophers must be 'big' enough to look at all sides of the issue.
    2) In terms of an aristocratic out-look, he has a point.
    3) He also says elsewhere that nationalism is necessary to COUNTER liberalism.

    I want to study Nietzsche closely to show the difference between philosophy and ideology: the philosopher will always be a heretic!
    Nietzsche abhorred what he called "the Herd." He hated human collectives and celebrated isolated individuals who achieved "greatness" despite the mediocrity of their peers. Nation is a group identity, so naturally he was against it.

    Nietzsche also said that he was an ardent seeker after truth, even painful truth (as he described to his sister in letters) - perhaps he noticed how nationalism causes people to disregard truths and replace them with cofortably consistent lies.

    Nietzsche also was a lover of cultural genius, and remarked that periods of cultural interest alternate with periods of nationalism and militarist enthusiasm - the two "moods" are mutually exclusive.
    Last edited by Moody; Thursday, May 6th, 2004 at 05:00 PM. Reason: split thread
    "Whatever is done from love always occurs beyond good and evil." - F. Nietzsche

  5. #5
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Last Online
    Tuesday, March 13th, 2018 @ 09:14 AM
    Status
    Prolonged Absence
    Ethnicity
    Dutch
    Gender
    Posts
    2,673
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    2
    Thanked in
    1 Post

    Post

    Quote Originally Posted by Scoob
    Nietzsche abhorred what he called "the Herd." He hated human collectives and celebrated isolated individuals who achieved "greatness" despite the mediocrity of their peers. Nation is a group identity, so naturally he was against it.

    Nietzsche also said that he was an ardent seeker after truth, even painful truth (as he described to his sister in letters) - perhaps he noticed how nationalism causes people to disregard truths and replace them with cofortably consistent lies.

    Nietzsche also was a lover of cultural genius, and remarked that periods of cultural interest alternate with periods of nationalism and militarist enthusiasm - the two "moods" are mutually exclusive.
    More or less agreed, but Nietzsche did not oppose every collective; in fact, he was in favour of the caste system and birth privileges. I think this opens up possibilities for a racialist adaptation of Nietzscheanism.
    Last edited by Moody; Thursday, May 6th, 2004 at 05:00 PM. Reason: split thread

  6. #6
    jay-ded
    "Friend of Germanics"
    Skadi Funding Member

    VilhelMina's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Last Online
    Thursday, March 12th, 2009 @ 04:36 PM
    Ethnicity
    Scottish
    Subrace
    Nordid
    Country
    United States United States
    State
    Alaska Alaska
    Location
    60.42 (60°25') | -150. (-150°26'
    Gender
    Occupation
    Writer
    Religion
    Not sheep material
    Posts
    169
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    1
    Thanked in
    1 Post

    Post

    Quote Originally Posted by Scoob
    Nietzsche abhorred what he called "the Herd." He hated human collectives and celebrated isolated individuals who achieved "greatness" despite the mediocrity of their peers. Nation is a group identity, so naturally he was against it.
    Agreed. I think he was an unspeakable individualist - deep hatred of the "herd" or "the masses". I am convinced that his entire motive in writing was not only to over throw the slave morality of christianity and it's perculiar ethics but to replace them. This, I think, is overtly clear in Thus Spake Zarathustra. The terminology used by Zarathustra is very similar to that of Christ and Zarathustra is in many ways a Prophet, of the Superman.

    IMO Nietzsche is definatley not a bad guy as many historians and regimes have said. There is much optomism in his writings, beyond his contempt, of what man could be.
    Last edited by Moody; Thursday, May 6th, 2004 at 05:01 PM. Reason: split thread

  7. #7
    Senior Member Scoob's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Last Online
    Friday, April 1st, 2005 @ 09:39 AM
    Subrace
    Europid
    Country
    European Union European Union
    Location
    Inside the Box
    Gender
    Politics
    Posthuman
    Posts
    836
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    6
    Thanked in
    6 Posts

    Post

    Quote Originally Posted by DaughterOfScotland
    Agreed. I think he was an unspeakable individualist - deep hatred of the "herd" or "the masses". I am convinced that his entire motive in writing was not only to over throw the slave morality of christianity and it's perculiar ethics but to replace them. This, I think, is overtly clear in Thus Spake Zarathustra. The terminology used by Zarathustra is very similar to that of Christ and Zarathustra is in many ways a Prophet, of the Superman.

    IMO Nietzsche is definatley not a bad guy as many historians and regimes have said. There is much optomism in his writings, beyond his contempt, of what man could be.
    I find a lot I like in Nietzsche. Even where I disagree with him, I find that my mental evaluations of his arguments advances my thinking quite a bit - more so than with many philosophers.

    For someone so anti-Christian and anti-ascetic, Nietzsche was quite a miserable and ascetic guy. He never found a happy place in society (which is a bit sad, IMO) and this fueled a lot of his anti-social anger.

    I think that humans can't advance without forming collectives, basically. When the Will of many people is harmonious, it reenforces itself and grows more powerful by many orders of magnitude. It creates a positive feedback loop.

    Nietzsche was against most any collective - he said that the value of humanity is measured by the few outstanding individuals it creates, not by the mediocre herd, which is nevertheless neccessary.

    Nietzsche never really postulated a clear future for humanity. In order to use his writings as an ideological textbook for racialism, one must omit huge essential portions (maybe a majority) of what Nietzsche actually said.
    Last edited by Moody; Thursday, May 6th, 2004 at 05:01 PM. Reason: split thread
    "Whatever is done from love always occurs beyond good and evil." - F. Nietzsche

  8. #8
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Last Online
    Tuesday, March 13th, 2018 @ 09:14 AM
    Status
    Prolonged Absence
    Ethnicity
    Dutch
    Gender
    Posts
    2,673
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    2
    Thanked in
    1 Post

    Post

    I think that humans can't advance without forming collectives, basically. When the Will of many people is harmonious, it reenforces itself and grows more powerful by many orders of magnitude. It creates a positive feedback loop.

    Nietzsche was against most any collective - he said that the value of humanity is measured by the few outstanding individuals it creates, not by the mediocre herd, which is nevertheless neccessary.

    Nietzsche never really postulated a clear future for humanity. In order to use his writings as an ideological textbook for racialism, one must omit huge essential portions (maybe a majority) of what Nietzsche actually said.
    Yes, I agree with this, though I think Nietzsche was a bit more ambiguous on that last part. He certainly saw no point in racial preservation an sich, but, as he did approve of the caste system, he did not agitate against the idea of a group of noble men, bound together by blood and spirit, joining forces and establishing a ruling (and inbreeding) order - as long as these people did not give in to base collectivism. I think this might also be a good model for a racialist philosophy, regardless of wheter that was what Nietzsche intended to say.
    Last edited by Moody; Thursday, May 6th, 2004 at 05:02 PM. Reason: split thread

  9. #9
    jay-ded
    "Friend of Germanics"
    Skadi Funding Member

    VilhelMina's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Last Online
    Thursday, March 12th, 2009 @ 04:36 PM
    Ethnicity
    Scottish
    Subrace
    Nordid
    Country
    United States United States
    State
    Alaska Alaska
    Location
    60.42 (60°25') | -150. (-150°26'
    Gender
    Occupation
    Writer
    Religion
    Not sheep material
    Posts
    169
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    1
    Thanked in
    1 Post

    Post

    Quote Originally Posted by Scoob
    I find a lot I like in Nietzsche. Even where I disagree with him, I find that my mental evaluations of his arguments advances my thinking quite a bit - more so than with many philosophers.

    For someone so anti-Christian and anti-ascetic, Nietzsche was quite a miserable and ascetic guy. He never found a happy place in society (which is a bit sad, IMO) and this fueled a lot of his anti-social anger.

    I think that humans can't advance without forming collectives, basically. When the Will of many people is harmonious, it reenforces itself and grows more powerful by many orders of magnitude. It creates a positive feedback loop.

    Nietzsche was against most any collective - he said that the value of humanity is measured by the few outstanding individuals it creates, not by the mediocre herd, which is nevertheless neccessary.

    Nietzsche never really postulated a clear future for humanity. In order to use his writings as an ideological textbook for racialism, one must omit huge essential portions (maybe a majority) of what Nietzsche actually said.
    IMO Fascism and much of Nietszche "could" be compatible. Although others would disagree. I remember that Nietzsche once stated that he knows that he'll be misunderstood and his words are to be misused by the stupid. I think that's what he meant in the beginning of the Anti-Christ. "This book belongs to the most rare of men. Perhaps not one of them is yet alive."

    Maybe Nietszche is the fork in the road. The fascists turn right. All others left. The earlier lesser known work "Human, All-Too-Human" and "Daybreak" (aka "Dawn") are good "gateway drugs" -- less poetic and dense than Zarathustra and less threatening to questioners who might initially balk at Anti-Christ but who know something's fishy with the moral codes they were taught. It is a shame that madness overtook him before he could truly lay his philosophy out in full. He left many unanswered and incomplete questions. Nietzsche leaves room for interpretation on a few points here and there, and I do not necessarily see this as a negative aspect of his work. I wonder how much more he could have written had he lived beyond the age 60.

    I also believe Nietzche took survival of the fit to an entirely new level, once most people are afraid to go to because they fear public opinion. If you do go to that level, you find that it is just a matter of common sense to do things that way, only the weak and inferior untermensch are offended by an elitist phiosophy.

    IMO The Nietzsche idea is simple: If you are fit to live, then live, if not then make room for those who are. If you are fit to serve, then serve, if you are fit to rule, then rule. A system based on placing those capable of doing things in the position of actually doing those things would be optimal, unfortunately the socialized world is comprised mainly of inferior beings who either unfit to continue existing or fit only for an existance as slaves. These people cry out against the elitist system supposedly on the behalf of "handicapped" but in all actuallity to preserve their own hides. There is no logical basis for all humans to be considered equal.
    Last edited by Moody; Thursday, May 6th, 2004 at 05:02 PM. Reason: split thread

  10. #10
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Last Online
    Tuesday, March 13th, 2018 @ 09:14 AM
    Status
    Prolonged Absence
    Ethnicity
    Dutch
    Gender
    Posts
    2,673
    Thanks Thanks Given 
    0
    Thanks Thanks Received 
    2
    Thanked in
    1 Post

    Post

    Quote Originally Posted by DaughterOfScotland
    IMO Fascism and much of Nietszche "could" be compatible. Although others would disagree. I remember that Nietzsche once stated that he knows that he'll be misunderstood and his words are to be misused by the stupid. I think that's what he meant in the beginning of the Anti-Christ. "This book belongs to the most rare of men. Perhaps not one of them is yet alive."

    Maybe Nietszche is the fork in the road. The fascists turn right. All others left. The earlier lesser known work "Human, All-Too-Human" and "Daybreak" (aka "Dawn") are good "gateway drugs" -- less poetic and dense than Zarathustra and less threatening to questioners who might initially balk at Anti-Christ but who know something's fishy with the moral codes they were taught. It is a shame that madness overtook him before he could truly lay his philosophy out in full. He left many unanswered and incomplete questions. Nietzsche leaves room for interpretation on a few points here and there, and I do not necessarily see this as a negative aspect of his work. I wonder how much more he could have written had he lived beyond the age 60.

    I also believe Nietzche took survival of the fit to an entirely new level, once most people are afraid to go to because they fear public opinion. If you do go to that level, you find that it is just a matter of common sense to do things that way, only the weak and inferior untermensch are offended by an elitist phiosophy.

    IMO The Nietzsche idea is simple: If you are fit to live, then live, if not then make room for those who are. If you are fit to serve, then serve, if you are fit to rule, then rule. A system based on placing those capable of doing things in the position of actually doing those things would be optimal, unfortunately the socialized world is comprised mainly of inferior beings who either unfit to continue existing or fit only for an existance as slaves. These people cry out against the elitist system supposedly on the behalf of "handicapped" but in all actuallity to preserve their own hides. There is no logical basis for all humans to be considered equal.
    I fully agree
    Last edited by Moody; Thursday, May 6th, 2004 at 05:03 PM. Reason: split thread

Page 1 of 5 12345 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. The Antichrist, by Friedrich Nietzsche
    By Frans_Jozef in forum Modern
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: Friday, November 7th, 2008, 05:57 PM
  2. e-book: Friedrich Nietzsche - The Antichrist
    By Blutwölfin in forum Literature & Book Reviews
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: Wednesday, July 6th, 2005, 11:43 PM
  3. e-book: Friedrich Nietzsche - The Birth of Tragedy
    By Blutwölfin in forum Literature & Book Reviews
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: Wednesday, July 6th, 2005, 11:42 PM
  4. e-book: Friedrich Nietzsche - Thus Spake Zarathustra
    By Blutwölfin in forum Literature & Book Reviews
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: Wednesday, July 6th, 2005, 11:41 PM
  5. Replies: 13
    Last Post: Thursday, November 20th, 2003, 11:44 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •