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Thread: Racial Types of the Walloons

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    Senior Member Patrioten's Avatar
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    The Walloons, Who Are They?

    I would very much appreciate information about the origins of this people, their racial make up, pigmentation etc.

    From what i have read they are for the most part borrebies, with a high tendency of dark pigmentation in hair color, is this correct? And is it also correct that the Walloon population has alot of red heads among them? Any information you can give would as mentioned be highly appreciated.

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    Senior Member Waarnemer's Avatar
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    Re: The Walloons, who are they?

    The most important element would be the Alpinoid (Borreby and Alpinid) with Nordid and perhaps a minor tendency towards Mediterranid, or even Berid.



    From Coon:

    "The conclusions derived from this study are not that the Flemings are Nordics and the Walloons Alpines, as has been frequently stated. The Flemings are, in fact, a people who are largely Nordic, and who derived their Nordic blood from their linguistic ancestors, the Franks. The Nordic sub-type of the Franks is that of the Keltic Iron Age.

    They have absorbed, especially in western Flanders, a certain amount of Borreby blood by intermarriage with the earlier inhabitants of the Flemish plain, who lived there in small numbers before this plain had been dyked and drained. The Walloons are the descendants of the large-headed highland population of the Neolithic, which was of mixed Alpine and Borreby derivation.

    To this has been added a Nordic accretion, and the actual metrical differences between Flemings and Walloons, while consistent, are not great. Only the inhabitants of the province of Luxemburg may be called Alpines in the strict sense, and their relationship is clearly with Lorraine and Burgundy."

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    Senior Member Patrioten's Avatar
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    Sv: Re: The Walloons, who are they?

    Quote Originally Posted by Waarnemer
    most important element would be the alpinoid (borreby and alpinid) with nordid and perhaps a minor tendency towards mediterranid, or even berid

    Interesting, the mediterranid part, is that a remnant from when the Spaniards ruled over the Netherlands (and also what is now wallonia?)? Or is it earlier admixture? It's interesting to me because my grandmother's father on my fathers side was of some walloon descent, how much i don't know, i have alot of dark hair (blackish) pigmentation on that side of the family, but also reddish brown together with dark blue/lighter blue eyes.

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    Senior Member Waarnemer's Avatar
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    Re: Sv: Re: The Walloons, who are they?

    Probably not, only very sporadic Spanish officers married into Belgium and Dutch families - I'm Flemish and have a Catalan ancestor from that specific period of time.

    Mediterranids are of Megalithic or Neolithic long barrow origin and are to be found all over Western Europe; in the Northwest mostly around coastal regions, like the British isles, Frisia, the Netherlands, Western Germany and Scandinavia.

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    Senior Member Patrioten's Avatar
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    Sv: Re: Sv: Re: The Walloons, who are they?

    I should probably read up on Coon's Races of Europe now when they have uploaded the whole thing .

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    Re: The Walloons, who are they?

    The Walloons are a north-western extension of your average central Europeans: a Nordic/Alpine/dinaric/atlantid blend like you may find in france/northern italy/southern Germany/Austria and so on...

    They speak French nowadays but their language were originally a Langue D'oil to which I find an eery ressemblance with Spanish sometimes, with some syntax borrowed from Germanic language.

    For instance, the girl I posted for classification here is from Wallonia.

    Something I always wondered though: Walloons in the 17th century immigrated to Sweden to teach their advanced iron-working technique...if you take a look at the immigrations of the United States, you'll find the same pattern: the biggest concentration of people of Walloon ancestry is in the Wisconsin/Minnesota area which happen to be mainly populated by Swedes... what is it with Walloons and Swedes?

    PS: Walloons were the real founders of New York, not the Dutch.

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    Senior Member Patrioten's Avatar
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    Sv: Re: The Walloons, who are they?

    Interesting notes and observations, thanks alot. The Walloon-Swedish connection i can understand though, we are truly nice people to live among .

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    Racial Types of the Walloons

    Wikipedia article:

    The term Walloons (French: Wallons, Walloon: Walons) refers, in daily speech, either to Belgians inhabitants of Walloon Region, either to people from Wallonia who have in common a «built identity» based on ideas of the Walloon Movement. It can also designate the Walloon speakers.
    The terme Walloon is derived from Walha, a very old Germanic term used by Germanic Tribes to refer to Celtic and Latin speakers. According to areas, Walha transformed, in particular by loans in other languages, and by semantic reduction. It is the case with Walloon that was created in Roman language aside of other related terms but it supplanted them.

    Its oldest written trace is found in the Jean de Haynin's Mémoires de Jean, sire de Haynin et de Louvignies in 1465 where it refers to Roman populations of Burgundian Netherlands. Its semantic reduce yet during French and Dutch periods, and at the Belgian independence, the term designate only Belgians speaking a romance language (French, Wallon, Picard, …)

    The linguistic cleavage in politics of Belgium and the birth of a Walloon Movement will add a «conceptual and emotional content» to the term Walloon, that will then also designate the inhabitants of Wallonia — a monolingual French-speaking territory — opposed to Flemish.

    As with any part of the world where languages are spoken that have no physical barrier between them, the extent of Wallonia has shifted through the ages; the more so in that through history the low-lying area of Flanders and the hilly region of the Ardennes have been under the control of many city-states and external powers; all of which have brought variations to the borders, culture, and language.

    The Walloon language itself, widespread up till the Second World War, has been dying out of common use owing to growing internationalisation, official education that does not include it as a language, and the efforts of the French government to support the use of French within the "Francophonie" commonwealth.

    This is made more complex by the federal structure of Belgium, that splits Belgium into three language groups - French community (though not Walloon), Flemish community and German community - with privileges to use their own tongues in official correspondence, but into three autonomous regions, known as "Vlaanderen" (Flanders) and "la région wallonne" (Walloon region, including the German community) and the bilinguial (French-Dutch) Brussels region, also federal capital of Belgium.


    Brussels - not Walloon but French-speaking

    Many non-French-speaking observers (over)generalize Walloons as a term of convenience for all (even born and living in the Brussels Region) Belgian French-speakers. While the mixing of the population for economic and practical reasons over the centuries means that most families can trace ancestors on both sides of the linguistic divide, the fact that the Brussels region is around ¾ French-speaking as mother tongue but lying geographically in Flanders has led to friction between the regions and communities. The local dialect in Brussels, "Brussels Vloms", is a Brabantic dialect, reflecting the Dutch heritage of the city.

    In relatively modern history, Brussels has been the major town or the capital of the region. Under the long Spanish and French rule, it ended up that the sole official language was French; after a brief period with Dutch as the official language while part of the United Kingdom of the Netherlands, French was reinstated after independence in 1830, and the Walloon region, being a major coal and steel producing area, developed very quickly into the economic powerhouse of the country.

    Walloons were therefore politically dominant, and many Flemish immigrants came to work in Wallonia. Between the 1930's and the 1970's, the gradual decline of steel and more especially coal, coupled with the imbalance in investment in service industries and light industry which came to predominate in Flanders, started to tip the balance in the other direction and Flanders became gradually politically dominant, and in their turn Walloon families have moved to Flanders in search of jobs. This evolution has not been without political repercussions.

    The heartland of Walloon culture is the Meuse Valley, Dinant, Namur (the regional capital), Huy and Liège. Its Walloon language could be considered as an element of Walloon identity. However, not the entire French-speaking population of Wallonia can be culturally considered as Walloons, since a significant portion in the west (around Tournai and Mons) and smaller portions in the extreme south (around Arlon) belong to other languages (namely Picard, Champenois, Luxembourgish, and Lorrain) as mother tongues.

    Furthermore, Walloon and those other languages are mostly spoken by elderly people nowadays, and all of them can speak French as well or better. The younger can usually understand only bits and pieces of their ancestors' language. On the other hand, Givet commune, several villages in Ardennes département in France and a few villages in Luxembourg are historically Walloon-speaking.

    The Walloon Region institutionally comprises also the German-speaking community of Belgium around Eupen, in the east of the region, next to Germany which ceded the area to Belgium after the First World War. Many of the about 60,000 inhabitants of this very small community fiercely reject being considered as Walloon and – with their community executive leader Karl-Heinz Lambertz – demand separation from Wallonia and recognition as a separate region in Belgium.

    In the 13th century, the German medieval colonisation of Transylvania (central and North-Western Romania) comprised also considerable numbers of Wallons. Almost 10% of the Romanian Germans are of Wallon descent.

    At their height, the German minority of Transsylvania accounted over 10% of the area's population. Currently, there are about 700.000 Transylvanian Germans and descendants all over the World, especially in Germany. Only 39.000 of them are still living in Transylvania (as 2007). Place names like "Wallendorf" (Wallon Village) and family names as "Valendorfean" ("Wallon peasant") can be found among the Romanian citizens of Transylvania.

    Starting from 1620s, a considerable number of Walloon miners and their families had settled in Sweden. They were originally led by entrepreneur Louis de Geer who commissioned them to work in the iron mines of Uppland and Östergötland. The wave of migration continued substantially into 18th century. Walloons became gradually integrated into Swedish society. However, Walloon ancestry is still traceable through Walloon surnames and people of Walloon descent are organised in Sällskapet Vallonättlingar (Society of Walloon Descendants).


    Famous Walloons - Including people from the region before it became known as Wallonia.

    • Baldwin I of Constantinople, Count of Flanders and Hainaut, first emperor of the Latin Empire
    • Gilles Binchois, Franco-Flemish composer
    • Godfroid de Bouillon, leader of the First Crusade and first European King of Jerusalem
    • Robert Campin, Flemish painter
    • Jacques Daret, Flemish painter
    • Jesse de Forest, Walloon settler, first colonizer of New Netherland and what would become New York City. Monument dedicated and located in Battery Park, Lower Manhattan.
    • Nicolas Defrecheux, poet in the Walloon language
    • Paul Delvaux, surrealist painter
    • Guillaume Dufay, Franco-Flemish composer
    • César Franck, Belgian composer
    • Louis De Geer, merchant and industrialist
    • Zénobe Gramme, inventor of the Gramme machine
    • Justine Henin, tennis champion
    • Orlande de Lassus, Franco-Flemish composer
    • Jean Lemaire de Belges, late Medieval, early Renaissance poet and historian
    • Georges Lemaître, founder of the "big bang" theory of the Universe
    • Rene Magritte the surrealist artist
    • Pierre Minuit, who purchased the island of Manhattan from the Native Americans and founded what would become New York City
    • Edouard Remouchamps, playwright in the Walloon language
    • Pierre de la Rue, Franco-Flemish composer
    • Jean-Michel Saive, table tennis champion
    • Adolphe Sax, the inventor of the saxophone
    • Georges Simenon, author of Maigret and other novels
    • Ernest Solvay, inventor of the Solvay process and founder of the Solvay Business School.
    • Léon Degrelle, leader of Rex and leader of the Waffen-SS Walloon division

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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrioten View Post
    I would very much appreciate information about the origins of this people, their racial make up, pigmentation etc.

    From what i have read they are for the most part borrebies, with a high tendency of dark pigmentation in hair color, is this correct? And is it also correct that the Walloon population has alot of red heads among them? Any information you can give would as mentioned be highly appreciated.
    Easy. The Walloons are the French-speaking Belgians, mostly direct descendants of the ancient Belgae and Gallo-Romans before the Frankish invasion. While their northern neighbors (Flemish) are much more closer to the Western Germanic (Frankish).
    Flemish are predominantly Keltic Nordid, while Walloons are Borreby with strong Alpinid admixture (Walloon type). Most Belgians have brown hair with blond being slightly more frequent among Flemish than Walloons. Slightly over 50% of Belgians have light eyes (blue, green or gray).

    Flemish = 18%(blond)), 32% (blue-eyed)
    Walloons = 13% blond, 23% (blue-eyed)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aragorn View Post
    Wikipedia article:



    The terme Walloon is derived from Walha, a very old Germanic term used by Germanic Tribes to refer to Celtic and Latin speakers. According to areas, Walha transformed, in particular by loans in other languages, and by semantic reduction. It is the case with Walloon that was created in Roman language aside of other related terms but it supplanted them.

    ...

    In the 13th century, the German medieval colonisation of Transylvania (central and North-Western Romania) comprised also considerable numbers of Wallons. Almost 10% of the Romanian Germans are of Wallon descent.

    At their height, the German minority of Transsylvania accounted over 10% of the area's population. Currently, there are about 700.000 Transylvanian Germans and descendants all over the World, especially in Germany. Only 39.000 of them are still living in Transylvania (as 2007). Place names like "Wallendorf" (Wallon Village) and family names as "Valendorfean" ("Wallon peasant") can be found among the Romanian citizens of Transylvania.

    Starting from 1620s, a considerable number of Walloon miners and their families had settled in Sweden. They were originally led by entrepreneur Louis de Geer who commissioned them to work in the iron mines of Uppland and Östergötland. The wave of migration continued substantially into 18th century. Walloons became gradually integrated into Swedish society. However, Walloon ancestry is still traceable through Walloon surnames and people of Walloon descent are organised in Sällskapet Vallonättlingar (Society of Walloon Descendants).

    Interesting, since the terms Walloon and Wallachia (Vlach) both come from the Proto-Germanic term for "foreigner." "Wales" and "Cornwall" are also attributed to the Anglo-Saxon term Wealas, which is not too far from that Proto-Germanic word, Walhaz.

    https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Recon...ermanic/walhaz
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