View Poll Results: Is socialism compatible with Germanic preservation?

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Thread: Is Socialism Compatible with Germanic Preservation?

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    Is Socialism Compatible with Germanic Preservation?

    So far there have been heated discussions between left and right and some members here seem to think socialism, isn't compatible with Germanic preservation. So, let's debate this. In your opinion, are socialism and Germanic preservation compatible, and why? Please explain your choice.

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    Of course it's compatible but is it preferable? Socialism seems like a wonderful idea in theory but in practice it's infeasible, human begins are egotistic by nature not altruistic. Self-reliance is a great virtue that's central to Germanic cultures, the nanny state shouldn't have little authority in the distribution of goods and services.

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    What do you mean by socialism? If you mean a government that uses some of the resources of a country to solve its problems and take the edge off the worst excesses of capitalism, then yes, socialism is compatible with Germanic preservation. It should nourish the creative energies of the people while protecting them from invasive forces that would drag them down.

    If you mean the more totalitarian version of the old Soviet bloc, well that is only compatible with the most constricted, corseted versions of preservationism. The ideology of racial purity and puritanism that some on this board seem to advocate would require a sheltered, stagnant society.
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    as far as I can understand any real form of nationalism (which includes making 'germanic preserve' :p) is by definition collectivistic and so socialistic...

    I'd love to hear someone expalin why socialism isn't compatible with making jam, uh sorry preserve, uh sorry, I mean, preservATION.

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    I understand socialism broadly defined as a political and economical theory that stands for a cooperative society where the means of production and distribution are owned by the government or collectively by the people. Or, as an analogy, with socialism you have two cows. The government takes them and puts them in a barn with everyone else's cows. You have to take care of all the cows. The government gives you all the milk you need. Actually, this is compatible with nationalism, considering nations are groups of people. Whether it's the ideal system, is another matter. It is surely not the best option for Germanics in multiethnic/multicultural states, because it advantages the foreigners.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Renwein View Post
    as far as I can understand any real form of nationalism (which includes making 'germanic preserve' :p) is by definition collectivistic and so socialistic...
    Exactly! This is why I view socialism more compatible with nationalism than capitalism. Capitalism is an individualistic ideology. Nationalism is by its definition, a little bit egalitarian because it's a belief that someone's nation and its interests are of primary importance. Nation comes before individual. Or, to quote George Orwell, "The abiding purpose of every nationalist is to secure more power and more prestige, not for himself but for the nation or other unit in which he has chosen to sink his own individuality."

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    Socialism is the ONLY economic model compatible with German nationalism. In the GDR, we hardly had any foreigners. We had no greedy capitalist pigs to employ cheap Turkish or Polish neighbour and steal the jobs of the Germans. Capitalism is greedy, individualistic, disgusting. How can smeone call himself a nationalist, yet reject his countrymen because they are not "educated" enough? Work should be available for ALL Germans, and those who don't find any should be given a job by the government. There's no shame in being a German manual labourer, a member of the working class. Capitalism creates poverty and hungry mouths because the greedy pigs aren't concerned with German well-being. They prefer to let them starve and employ foreigners for joke salaries. Greedy capitalists will also emply illegal immigrants and criminal scum because they only care about one thing: MONEY.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Flash Voyager View Post
    Of course it's compatible but is it preferable? Socialism seems like a wonderful idea in theory but in practice it's infeasible, human begins are egotistic by nature not altruistic. Self-reliance is a great virtue that's central to Germanic cultures, the nanny state shouldn't have much authority in the distribution of goods and services.
    Well many people ( too many from my point of view ) feel the same things about socialism as you do Flash Voyager.

    But the thing to remember is that capitalism is based on the promotion of selfish individualism and thus sets the course for human relations to some extent.
    It is true we are both altuistic and egotistical so what side of these human tendencies a system rewards will have a great bearing on what side prospers or is adopted

    We are social animals and the promotion of isolated individualism is most definately not beneficial for anyone , imo. Especially when ones sense of human solidarity is sacrificed at the alter of crass consumerism and the never ending drive to satisfy created wants is what replaces it.

    The psychiatrists may do well out of it in the future but little else that I can see.
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    I don't see how a rational system can expand outward to encompass all within a certain limit, to the detriment of the individual and family, and then stop at a certain point? Such a tendency naturally leads to globalism.

    On the other hand, if you have the individual/family as the basis of your interest. then it naturally expands outwards to extended family, and then ethnicity, meta-ethnicity, subrace, race, etc; in that order.

    To say, I will point my own interests and my family's interests aside and disregard them for the 'greater good', and then expect this to stop at some arbitrary point before extending to encompass all of humanity, seems quite unnatural.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SwordOfTheVistula View Post
    I don't see how a rational system can expand outward to encompass all within a certain limit, to the detriment of the individual and family, and then stop at a certain point? Such a tendency naturally leads to globalism.

    On the other hand, if you have the individual/family as the basis of your interest. then it naturally expands outwards to extended family, and then ethnicity, meta-ethnicity, subrace, race, etc; in that order.

    To say, I will point my own interests and my family's interests aside and disregard them for the 'greater good', and then expect this to stop at some arbitrary point before extending to encompass all of humanity, seems quite unnatural.
    And I don't see why an individualist would give two shits about his family. Actually capitalist greed has been the source of many familial conflicts and assasinations for the sake of inheritance and wealth.

    On the contrary, socialism is natural. Like skyhawk said, man is a social animal.

    For most of human beings' time on earth, people lived in small, peaceful communities where cooperation and mutual reliance were the basis for survival. That remained true for well over 100,000 years.

    It's only in the last 5,000 years or so that developments in technology (first in domesticating animals and farming, then in industry, now in computers) allowed people to create more food and other products than they could use immediately. That "surplus" allowed a small minority of people to begin living off the labor of others.

    In order to defend their privilege of not working and enjoying the wealth that others created, they began to build up police forces of one kind or another. From Greek and Roman slaves to Aztec peons to European serfs to modern wage workers, since the rise of the first class societies, there haven't just been rich and poor--there have been rich because there are poor.

    Capitalism, which began in some small parts of Europe a few hundred years ago and has only just recently all but wiped out the last forms of local, indigenous cooperative societies, is no different than the Roman Empire--in that those who work are poor, and those who do not work are rich. Caesar would feel right at home in the U.S. Senate.


    Why socialism makes sense

    Socialism can take both nationalist and internationalist faces. It can restrict itself to the nation just like love, altruism, care, defense, all part of nationalism, can restrict themselves to the nation. It's about a collective, and the collective can be as small as a city or as big as a nation. All there needs to be is a clear collective identity.

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