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Thread: The Srebrenica Hoax

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    The Srebrenica Hoax

    Today, one often sees casual references to the "Srebrenica genocide" in the media. Especially with the recent arrest of the former political leader of the Bosnian Serbs, Karadzic. Srebrenica is a city in Bosnia, and was the site at which Serb paramilitaries supposedly executed thousands of Muslim men and teenage boys in July 1995, that they had captured. Their supposed motivation was ethnic hatred and their goal, genocide. The story is accepted uncritically in the West. And the story led NATO to intervene directly in 1995.


    Srebrenica is a hoax. A lie that is shouted so often for political reasons.

    Here is the reality of it.
    1. The city of Srebrenica and its surroundings were held by Muslim military units in mid-1995.
    2. The Muslim stronghold of Srebrenica was encircled by exhausted Serb units. The Muslim defenders had a very good defensive position, had a good defensive capability, and had enough supplies. The Serb formations should have been no match.
    3. Considering #2, the Muslim action around Srebrenica in July 1995, was one of the most pathetic military actions in modern European history.
    4. For an unexplainable reason, the Muslim commanders [despite being in a superior position] decided suddenly to attempt a retreat across open (Serb-held) land. The Serbs laying siege to the city were shocked at this unexpected exodus of the Muslims.
    5. This poorly-led, haphazard retreat resulted in "easy pickings" for the Serbs. Like target practice. The Muslim units retreating west-northwest were harassed constantly and they were eventually destroyed totally over the next days while on their pathetic and unnecessary retreat. Something like 2,000 Muslim soldiers were killed or died from wounds, compared to very few Serb soldiers lost in that action.
    6. The "battle" was such a humiliating military tactical disaster for the Muslims, it could have hurt Muslim morale in the war quite badly. But the Muslim leaders were clever. Their leaders began to promote the idea that it was a massacre. (It was a massacre, but one occurring in the field of battle, not against unarmed prisoners). A "genocide". The Muslim goal was to get sympathy and NATO intervention, and they succeeded in that.
    7. Ever since then, the story has been "milked for all it's worth". The numbers have been inflated, and many of the men listed by the Muslims as being part of their "Srebrenica Dead", have been found by investigators to have died months or even years before or after July 1995. If a 60-yr-old Muslim from that region died in September 1995 of a heart attack, it would not be uncommon for his name to appear as one of the "Srebrenica dead".
    8. This is Interesting : There has been some speculation that the Muslim government itself planned the annihilation of the Srebenicia Muslim formations, and secretly ordered the commander to make this suicidal maneuver. They knew it would be a disaster. Their plan was to sacrifice their own fighters by the thousands, to set up a "genocide" story to gain NATO intervention and get a good propaganda to demonize the Serbs. Whether this is true, or whether it was really just a display of pathetically-poor military field command which was then twisted by Muslim political leaders and propagandists, we do not know for sure.
    9. Some small number of executions of individual Muslims did occur. These were Muslims known to be guilty of atrocities against nearby Serb villages [vigilante-paramilitary justice]. Such executions cannot possibly be called "genocide".
    10. Looking back, it is easy to see how the myth got started and then exploded onto the world political stage. The news that "Muslim men and teenage boys had been executed by Serbs at Srebenicia", combined with the fact of total Muslim losses were in the thousands in that area over only one week in July 1995. It is fertile ground for a propagandist.
    11. Why does the myth persist today (that everyone knows about it)- The same reason Auschwitz does. It discredits nationalism and promotes aliens inhabiting Europe.

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    I dont believe everything thats said about the Serbs, just like the ww2 discussions it was war so both sides did wrong things and since Albanians dont even get any word about what they did in that war its useless to arrest this former president.

    I hate the tribunal and specially because its in the Netherlands, we are mixing into one sided tribunals that are not in any way giving him a change to defend himself normally.
    I didnt like the tribunal of Slobodan Milošević and i'm against this one also.

    Another thing is my brother was one of the Dutch soldiers in Bosnia and saw how people got killed there by both sides, and everyone knows we are blamed for some things that happened there they even made a movie about it without even asking Dutch soldiers what they saw or how they felled they should see how they are sitting in mental hospitals now.
    This war didnt have a good side they should arrest all war criminals from both sides with actual evidence what they did or just not simple as that.
    If christ is the answer then what is the question?

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    Drim, it is interesting that you bring up Dutch soldiers in Bosnia.

    What is interesting is that the mostly-Dutch U.N. military observers at Srebrenica in July 1995, all of them corroborate the version of events I posted in post #1and scoff at the idea of mass executions of thousands of people. They were on the ground in the middle of it, so they should know some things better than people sitting in Sarajevo or The Hague. But their testimony is ignored because it is inconvenient.

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    my brother and alot of other soldiers never got asked about anything, they also didnt get help when they came back.
    Thats why i dislike the case how can you start a tribunal on files full with lies and without opinions of the people that were actually in the middle of it.

    But believe me this tribunal is gonna be fun i think this guy is actually gonna do alot of weird things, he will tell secrets there including deals with the USA.
    And i dont think they can actually end this case in any way it will probably end like Slobodan Milošević he dies and case is over.

    Sit back because the circus has started
    If christ is the answer then what is the question?

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    Here is a map showing the action.

    Green : Muslim movements
    Red : Serb movements



    The map may be slightly confusing. Refer to this excerpt
    The attack was, according to Mladic, not designed to take the entire enclave. That decision was made only after the bulk of the Muslim fighters decided to give up the Defence and to attempt an extremely risky outbreak in the night of July 10 to Tuzla. "Muslims fled in large numbers the night before the attack," said the Dutch Army representative in Washington, Colonel G. van Oppen, in the Fries Dagblad of 13 October 1995: "The question of why this happened was never asked in the Netherlands."

    Muslim commanders had apparently left the city after a provocation from their side, the night before the first Serb tanks entered the scene. "The apparent decision made by the Muslims to leave the city gave the Serbs an unexpected opportunity to seize Srebrenica."

    (from the article "The Construction of a Trauma" by Abe de Vries)

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    That makes sense. I always wondered, if the serbs 'wanted to massacre innocent civilians', only men of military age were the 'victims'
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drim View Post
    This war didnt have a good side they should arrest all war criminals from both sides with actual evidence what they did or just not simple as that.
    Nope, either we pick a side and help them to achieve victory, or we stay out completely, nothing else.
    "Nothing is more disgusting than the majority: because it consists of a few powerful predecessors, of rogues who adapt themselves, of weak who assimilate themselves, and the masses who imitate without knowing at all what they want." (Johann Wolfgang Goethe)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jäger View Post
    Nope, either we pick a side and help them to achieve victory, or we stay out completely, nothing else.
    What about picking both sides and turning a profit, financial, political, strategic or otherwise, like in Northern Ireland, or like the 'international community' does with Israel-Palestine?

    How do we prevent wars and conflicts like this? Do we even want to?

    The NS way, I believe, is to ensure that all profits from war are given to the people who fought them, something which also allows for the rich opportunity that there might be in 'picking both sides'.

    No need for the moral highground here.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fortis_in_Arduis View Post
    What about picking both sides and turning a profit, financial, political, strategic or otherwise, like in Northern Ireland, or like the 'international community' does with Israel-Palestine?[..]
    No need for the moral highground here.
    It's not about morals, it is about being consequential, a high value.
    If it is in our interest that two parties fight each other, namely that they defeat each other, than we only need to support the loosing side, no need to tinker with the other side.
    "Nothing is more disgusting than the majority: because it consists of a few powerful predecessors, of rogues who adapt themselves, of weak who assimilate themselves, and the masses who imitate without knowing at all what they want." (Johann Wolfgang Goethe)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jäger View Post
    It's not about morals, it is about being consequential, a high value.
    Anyway, The Muslims were worst choice to give our support.

    In the fervor in 1991, the Muslim [Bosniak] leaders openly spoke of their desire for an Islamic state of Bosnia, to do their part for the international Islamic revival. (Unlike the Albanians, the Bosniaks are actually religious-- Their plan if they won the war was to be a true Islamic state, with Sharia including.)

    Albania, Kosovo, Bosnia, and that piece of Turkey: Four Muslim states with territory in Europe?
    ...Two of which only exist thanks to Western intervention!

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