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Vegans Are Freaking Insane

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  • #31
    im natural.....i love meat....hunted meat:p
    Tasmanian twice the heads!!.......twice the intelligence!?

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    • #32
      i love meat.. chicken, beef, salmon, tuna..mMmm
      vegans i know tend to be sickly and unhealthy looking. i always tell them to eat a burger, it'll do some good!

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      • #33
        Originally posted by Bärin
        Are you sure nothing you consume is an animal product?
        No. But I do everything I can to ensure the things I use don't have animal products in them. I even carry around a laminated card which lists E numbers containing animal products. As I often say to people, veganism and animal rights is about intention. It's not some totalitarian regime.

        Originally posted by Bärin
        Anyway don't you feel guilty about contributing to killing plants? Plants have some level of awareness too, and they can feel pain, they're beings too, not objects.
        Perhaps. Studies have shown that plants can feel pain (in the scientific sense), but they're not sentient beings. True suffering requires a combination of senses. When a cow is drugged up restricted of movement it sees, hears and smells the horrific situation it is in. Suffering is more than just instinctive pain - it is the capability to know how miserable and hopeless your situation is. Animals can suffer, plants cannot.

        Originally posted by Bärin
        Made by nature. Or do you really think that animals are made to die of old age in comfy and warm beds?
        I despise the anthropocentric mindset. It is one that we humans have gradually acquired, and has most likely been propogated by the Abrahamic religions and the Bible, which teaches us that the Earth was made for man and animals are here for our convenience only. The idea is that animals don't have a purpose or reason for being other than to feed and serve us. My views on existence couldn't differ more strongly from this and for that reason, I don't see cows, pigs and chickens as existing for the sole purpose of feeding us. I do believe in the food chain and I do believe that it's natural for humans to eat cows, pigs and chickens, but I don't believe that the way we do it today is natural.

        As for all the cases of doctors telling people that they need to start eating meat to become healthy again - I've heard a million of these stories. The problem is that doctors, like anyone else, are biased by their own views and philosophies. If you are a meat-eater, you will believe strongly that meat-eating is correct. If you are a veg*n, you will believe that your decision is correct. Most doctors, like most people, are meat-eaters. So when someone tells a doctor that they are unwell and don't eat meat, it's far easier for a doctor to apply their own personal philosophy and command the patient to eat meat than to spend the time asking questions about how full and balanced that person's veg*n diet is. Because, yes, many veg*ns are clueless about good diet and think they can survive on tofu and bread. A bad vegan is as bad as a bad meat-eater. If an obese person goes to a doctor, the doctor will tell them to cut out the fast food and eat more vegetables. If a bad vegan goes to a doctor, the assumption is that this person already eats enough vegetables so it must be the lack of meat that's causing problems. What the doctor doesn't realise is that this person is likely to have just as poor a diet as the meat-eating fast-food junkie.
        "If by being a racialist, you mean a man who despises a human being because he belongs to another race, or a man that believes one race is inherently superior to another in civilisation or capability of civilisation, then the answer is emphatically no." - Enoch Powell

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        • #34
          I despise the anthropocentric mindset. It is one that we humans have gradually acquired, and has most likely been propogated by the Abrahamic religions and the Bible, which teaches us that the Earth was made for man and animals are here for our convenience only. The idea is that animals don't have a purpose or reason for being other than to feed and serve us.
          /off topic

          Thank you, that is the jist of the story actually. You summarized my worldview in this paragraph and that is also my biggest grudge with christianity.

          You want to eat animals? Go ahead, by all means. But please, PLEASE, do not present it in such a way that 'animals are made to be eaten', 'nature is made to serve us', etc.
          Please be grateful to the animals that you eat, don't alienate yourself from the process of killing & meat production, it's not just a piece of meat you're eating, it used to be an animal. Respect it

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          • #35
            Originally posted by Fortis_in_Arduis
            ...I think that I would encourage my children to be lacto-veg. I have seen the results of such a diet in children and they grow into beautiful adults with good teeth, hair, skin, nails, bone structure, as well as having a pleasant nature. They really do stand out amongst their peers.
            ...
            I have also seen families who eat vast amounts of meat, who do not have the 'meaty' appearance of most meat-eaters, and their children are also as charming as lacto-veg children so perhaps there are no hard and fast rules.
            The only reason people get a "meaty" appearance is lack of exercise. I am 22 and the youngest of my brothers is 14, and we are all over 6ft, and are fit, strong, and lean. We eat a lot of meat - but we do a lot of exercise too.

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            • #36
              Originally posted by Cythraul View Post
              As for all the cases of doctors telling people that they need to start eating meat to become healthy again - I've heard a million of these stories. The problem is that doctors, like anyone else, are biased by their own views and philosophies. If you are a meat-eater, you will believe strongly that meat-eating is correct. If you are a veg*n, you will believe that your decision is correct. Most doctors, like most people, are meat-eaters. So when someone tells a doctor that they are unwell and don't eat meat, it's far easier for a doctor to apply their own personal philosophy and command the patient to eat meat than to spend the time asking questions about how full and balanced that person's veg*n diet is. Because, yes, many veg*ns are clueless about good diet and think they can survive on tofu and bread. A bad vegan is as bad as a bad meat-eater. If an obese person goes to a doctor, the doctor will tell them to cut out the fast food and eat more vegetables. If a bad vegan goes to a doctor, the assumption is that this person already eats enough vegetables so it must be the lack of meat that's causing problems. What the doctor doesn't realise is that this person is likely to have just as poor a diet as the meat-eating fast-food junkie.
              So, all doctors are wrong, only vegans are right and everything else is a big meat-eating conspiracy?

              Originally posted by Blood Axis
              /off topic

              Thank you, that is the jist of the story actually. You summarized my worldview in this paragraph and that is also my biggest grudge with christianity.

              You want to eat animals? Go ahead, by all means. But please, PLEASE, do not present it in such a way that 'animals are made to be eaten', 'nature is made to serve us', etc.
              Please be grateful to the animals that you eat, don't alienate yourself from the process of killing & meat production, it's not just a piece of meat you're eating, it used to be an animal. Respect it
              I am a meat eater and I do respect animals, I believe. I have never tortured an animal and I have always bought my meat from locals who raise them in proper conditions. Animals are made to be eaten, that is part of the natural cycle, for something to live, something else has to die. Our Germanic ancestors punished torturing and killing animals without reason, but they ate their meat. If animals were not eaten, nature would confront itself with animal overpopulation. Animals, unlike humans, do not control their breeding. We, just like lions and tigers, hunted and ate for millennia.


              Die Sonne scheint noch.

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              • #37
                Originally posted by Blood Axis
                /off topic

                Thank you, that is the jist of the story actually. You summarized my worldview in this paragraph and that is also my biggest grudge with christianity.

                You want to eat animals? Go ahead, by all means. But please, PLEASE, do not present it in such a way that 'animals are made to be eaten', 'nature is made to serve us', etc.
                Please be grateful to the animals that you eat, don't alienate yourself from the process of killing & meat production, it's not just a piece of meat you're eating, it used to be an animal. Respect it
                How does your worldview reconcile with eating fish and seafood? Do they not suffer when man catches them? I have seen how some of the seafood is prepared, the "products" are steamed alive. Don't tell me what to respect and what not, I don't disrespect anything. What do you suggest the farmers should do with their farm animals? Keep them as pets? eyes: Some farmers are skilled in killing animals quickly. They snap a chicken's neck effectively and it dies soon. I'm studying the agricultural field, I know about farms and how animals are treated there. That's why I buy from them. We humans are animals too, and animals eat other animals. Get over it. Animal cruelty is another thing, me and my friends spread out flyers with the horrible way they turn animals into burgers, this habit was brought here by foreigners, if you ever heard how the Muslims and Jews produce their halal and kosher foods. You had a picture of you eating at McDonalds, even if you only bought a Coke from them, you support a big corporation which is cruel to animals in case you didn't know, so who are you to lecture others about respect?

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                • #38
                  Bärin, my post was not even referring to you and I seriously think you should cut down on the irony and assumptions about people you don't know.

                  I generally said 'respect the animals' and not view their reason to live as becoming your snack, be grateful to nature, etc.
                  I was not referring to you but to all people who claim that 'humans are the chosenites of the Earth', that they can do whatever they like because they're 'smarter' than other beings, like certain capitalists here who claim that climate change and global warming are not real and/or are socialist conspiracies. Get it?

                  I eat fish and drink milk and like you I also believe that plants are sentient beings and no less important than animals, but like you say, it's part of the life cycle to eat other species, be it animals or plants or whatever. I just choose to eat less to none red meat for various reasons, I hope that does not piss everybody off, OK?
                  P.S. and yes, I once drunk Coke at McDonalds. I'm going to Hell

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Blood Axis View Post
                    Bärin, my post was not even referring to you and I seriously think you should cut down on the irony and assumptions about people you don't know.
                    To who was it referring to?

                    I generally said 'respect the animals' and not view their reason to live as becoming your snack, be grateful to nature, etc.
                    I am grateful to nature, but farm animals are grown to become snacks or to provide humans with products like milk, eggs, wool and others, that's why they are there, to think otherwise is fooling yourself. What do you suggest should be done with them? Keep them as pets? Or release them from farms and then what? Have hungry immigrants fight over them? Let them be kileld by cars and pollution? Farmers treat animals with respect, they protect them from cold and dangers, and the animals give them what they need from them.

                    I was not referring to you but to all people who claim that 'humans are the chosenites of the Earth', that they can do whatever they like because they're 'smarter' than other beings, like certain capitalists here who claim that climate change and global warming are not real and/or are socialist conspiracies. Get it?
                    Who are these people? I haven't seen any posting in this thread.

                    I eat fish and drink milk and like you I also believe that plants are sentient beings and no less important than animals, but like you say, it's part of the life cycle to eat other species, be it animals or plants or whatever. I just choose to eat less to none red meat for various reasons, I hope that does not piss everybody off, OK?
                    P.S. and yes, I once drunk Coke at McDonalds. I'm going to Hell
                    If it's part of the life cycle to eat other species, then it means they are made for that, if they weren't made for that we wouldn't be eating them, so where's the contradiction? It doesn't miss me off, I just find it hypocritical to lecture others about respecting animals when you shopped at a corporation which disrespects them and when you eat fish.

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                    • #40
                      I just told you to what I was referring. It was a general rant like many other occasions, I have been reading a Savitri Devi book these days that says exactly the same things and I felt it like a really good occasion to exclaim enthusiastically about how much I agree!

                      Who are these people? I haven't seen any posting in this thread.
                      So, do they need to post in this thread specifically? They have expressed their opinions a millionth times already in this forum.

                      I just find it hypocritical to lecture others about respecting animals when you shopped at a corporation which disrespects them and when you eat fish.
                      Again, assumptions. I am not lecturing anyone. Why would I do that? People will always do what they do, I or anyone else cannot change others around us but we can still express our opinion, can we not?

                      Besides, I really think these words 'hypocritical', 'traitors', etc, have been overused and overrated. Keep repeating something like that in everyday and every occasion, and it loses its value too.

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                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Dagna View Post
                        So, all doctors are wrong, only vegans are right and everything else is a big meat-eating conspiracy?
                        No, I'm merely pointing out that to go against the grain has always been met with overwhelming opposition. This is true for almost every grand controversy and scientific leap. Doctor's aren't wrong, they just succumb to the same natural inclination as the rest of us - to let their own moral and philosophical compass guide their decision making. The difference is that doctors are an authority and regularly make decisions for others on the basis that they know better. The problem is, even doctors aren't able to make completely objective decisions based on their medical knowledge. They are human and prone to letting their own feelings on a matter influence a decision. It would be the same as if a doctor were a non-drinker. They'd be more inclined to suggest giving up alcohol for the treatment of an ambiguous discomfort such as regular headaches.
                        "If by being a racialist, you mean a man who despises a human being because he belongs to another race, or a man that believes one race is inherently superior to another in civilisation or capability of civilisation, then the answer is emphatically no." - Enoch Powell

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Gorm the Old View Post
                          Our dentition shows clearly what we are OMNIVORES. We are not herbivores. If we were we could graze in the fields or browse in the forests. Our teeth are suited for a mixed diet of meat and vegetable foods. Not only are we CAPABLE of subsisting on such a mixed diet. WE NEED TO.

                          If, in order to be healthy, we need to supplement a Vegan diet with artificial mineral and vitamin supplements, then this is prima facie evidence that this diet is not adequate for our needs. This is not a natural diet for us.

                          Partly, this is a matter of to what our bodies have become accustomed. At the age of 40, having begun to study Hinduism, I sought to become a vegetarian. I did not flourish. My body had had 40 years to become adapted to an omnivorous diet.

                          Having studied the dentition of ancient animal species in Vertebrate Paleontology, I came to realise that we can infer the type of diet for which the animal is best suited by its distinctive dentition. An animal develops the kinds of teeth it needs for the kind of diet it needs. It's not that a herbivore CAN eat vegetation, it MUST. Given its distinctive dentition, a carnivore MUST eat meat.

                          Misguided Vegans have starved cats to death by forcing them to eat a meat-free diet. Our omnivorous dentition, as I mentioned above does not merely PERMIT us to eat a mixed meat-and-veggies diet, it proves that that is what our bodies NEED.

                          If I saw teeth like ours in the jaw of an extinct animal, I would not hesitate to say that it lived on a diet of meat and vegetable food, not merely that it COULD survive on such a diet, but that such a diet was NORMAL for it, AS IT IS FOR US !
                          I feel the need to counter this outrageous post.

                          Perhaps age forty was too late for Gorm..... as he had missed the vegetarian boat.

                          So how does this add any weight to the idea that humans must eat meat? It does not.

                          This is Gorm's personal opinion and, if anything, suggests that a vegetarian diet is preferable for health and it is not for him to visit his misfortune upon others by deliberate misdirection.

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                          • #43
                            FiA;

                            I respect your intelligence and knowledge, and the fact that you often bring new and fresh ideas and viewpoints into the discussions here.

                            However, I have to object to the way you address Gorm. I know it's nothing but a matter of personal values and preferences, but to me a disrespectful attitude towards seniors is unacceptable.

                            And, Gorm's point about about Homo Sapiens's teeth being designed for an omnivorous diet was exactly on the money afaIk.

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                            • #44
                              eat what you crave in moderation, listen to your body.
                              i on the other hand practice breatharianism. yes, i live on air and sunshine baby! what now vegans!? :p
                              haha, yeah right.

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                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Fortis_in_Arduis
                                I am lacto-veg for religious reasons and because I do not like the taste of meat and eggs.
                                I believe the Hindu prohibition against beef-eating was generally a Brahmin response to a Buddhist and Jain stimulus. I find the latter sects to be rather um, "life-denying" to say the least.

                                I personally would like to see the abolition of industrial factory farming slaughter, and a reversion to the old farm method.

                                The ancient Vedics as a huge cattle culture (like the Irish for example) did eat beef in the past. As a matter of fact, a certain king (unfortunately, I forgot his name) slaughtered 21,000 cattle for a dinner party. I read it was common and perhaps even obligatory, for people to offer a beef dish to guests as a gesture of hospitality.

                                How is there empirical evidence that chili, onions, garlic, and mushrooms alter the senses negatively?

                                It's like how grains are prohibited for the one meal on Navratri because of a myth involving Brahma and an Asura... It's folk tradition.

                                More pertinent however, I find that vegetarianism is a viable diet and that humans don't need any foreign supplements.

                                For example, the Mongols lived on a diet of mare's milk and vegetables; as the empire expanded the nobility became avowed carnivores (not to mention gluttonous alcoholics) thus leading to health problems, infertility, and early death.

                                Interestingly enough, the Mongols have the highest instance of any ethnic group of lactose intolerance... Why I have no idea.
                                SVMDEVSSVMCAESARSVMCAELVMETINFERNVM

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