Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

"Sorcery and Religion in Ancient Scandinavia" by Varg Vikernes

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #31
    Originally posted by Forest_Dweller View Post
    Sigh... Varg Vikernes sees the gods as architypes and as symbolic deities reflective of the nordic soul. He does not take norse mythology literally but rather sees it as an expression of the ideals, morality and spiritual truths of the Germanic peoples. He sees our old ways as a way of life to live by alongside science and rationality and also as a way of preserving our identity and unifying Germanics as a people.
    This is what I personally believe. Pretty damn close. Minus the "rational science" part. Because most science is bullshit. But I also believe in magick. I'm more of a "Gnostic Wotanist/Heathen" of the left-hand path. He is hypocritical in many ways, now putting all that i've read into perspective. He claims on his site that his theories are "all original". as we now know, that is very far from the truth. And his German bashing gets old. Not to mention that he's gone from a norwegian Nationalist to a "Russiophile", now to a "French Nationalist". It's all so confusing considering his views on blonde hair/blue eyed Scandinavian supremacy. And he should NEVER use the term "Atheist" to describe himself. Ever.
    Looks like i'll have to buy this book after all. Just so I can see for myself.

    If I was to label him as anything I would put him under the category of a Wotanist.
    I think he'd disagree. "Wotan" is the GERMAN Germanic expression of Odhinn. Varg doesn't think very highly of Germany. He doesn't like Von List either. He also bashed Gorsleben in response to an email I sent him on Gorslebens book. Not that i'm saying Gorsleben is dead accurate but, it just goes to show his contempt for the German interpretations of the modern era.
    "The mystery and secret of Wotan is not that "knowledge" of him is passed along through clandestine cults or even through the re-discovery of old books and texts--but rather that such knowledge is actually encoded in a mysterious way in the DNA, in the very genetic material, of those who are descended from him." - Secret of the Gothick God of Darkness

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by Kauz R. Waldher View Post
      Yep, I agree with Olavsson and Irmingot. All the way. Only except he never said that he was "never" a neo-nazi. He said he was. He denied Satanism though. But the whole atheist thing made me lose respect for him. A TON of respect.
      I read that he includes the lyrics for the new record "Umskiptar" in english ONLY inside his new book. So, you have to buy his book to get the lyrics. For now anyway, obviously that'll change. He hates capitalism? I don't think so. He's a capitalist and an atheist. ALSO, he bashes anyone who doesn't have blonde hair and blue eyes, claiming they are all of a "mixed race". EVEN THOUGH he has brownish hair! My hair is as blonde as his, but do I list "blonde" as my hair color? No. It pissed me off when he made that comment.
      He thinks blonde hair and blue eyes means "superior". It does not. Though i'm in agreement of it's significance and importance to preserve, it does not equal superior. And to say it's more beautiful is false as well. Though I personally believe that it is, many others do not necessarily. That is an opinion.
      I was going to buy Varg's new book ... but I don't think I will now.
      He has indeed denied that he was ever a "nazi", Volkwin probably knows where to find the interview where he does. I am quite certain I have seen him say so in other interviews and/or articles as well. It's just like he doesn't realize what he says can be found years later through a simple search on the Internet. "Oh, I have NEVER said that! Aldri!".

      EDIT:
      Here's just one place, where he denies that he have ever had anything to do with any "nazi organization", and ever being a "nazi": http://www.dagbladet.no/2009/07/04/m...psdom/7051663/

      I løpet av disse åra har han blitt koblet til nynazistiske og rasistiske miljøer.

      — Jeg har aldri stiftet eller vært medlem av slike organisasjoner. Eneste organisasjonen jeg er medlem av, er Riksmålsforbundet.


      Means like:

      During these years, he has been associated with neonazi and racist groups

      - I have never started or been a member of any such organization. The only organization I am a member of, is Riksmålsförbundet


      And:

      — Jeg har aldri vært nazist, og er det heller ikke nå. Det er bare tull at jeg har startet rasistiske propagandagrupper.


      Means like:

      - I have never been a nazi, and I am not a nazi now. It is just a lie that I have started racist propaganda groups.

      So, this man is not only a raving liar, he is obviously insane. As he believes that ANYONE would believe that, it's like.... Yes.. Madness.

      I state once again, just to make myself clear: Everyone has their right to change their views, but for fuck's sake - be honest, be a man, and don't treat people like idiots.

      Comment


      • #33
        I have never been a nazi







        "Certainly I have experienced drugs; too often I have experiences how annoying others become when they take drugs... but no: I have never taken drugs myself. I am not that stupid."

        "I am much scarier in real life, because I am - unlike the picture most have of me - real."

        What do you think about skinhead movement?

        "I guess it's a part of the immune system of the nation, and a natural reaction to an unhealthy development."

        Comment


        • #34
          Do you have any thoughts on what happened in Norway in 93?

          The awakening of heathendom. I did a lot to light the fire of our past. In spite of what other influential Black Metallers sought for I followed my own path to the glory of Odin. This caused some heavy reactions and almost a state of civil war between the Vikings and Euronymous' feeble "Satanists". We all know the results of this quick war. Euronymous is dead 'n ashes buried in christian soil 'n blessed by "God's" inept servants while the police 'n the ludicruous Christians have torn our scene apart with totally ridiculous anti Burzum propaganda and with ex Euronymous supporting informers giving false testimonies in the Vikings disfavour. '93 was a year of chaos, rivalry death and most of all survival for the fittest. Left am I with my growing armies of Vikings. '94 will be a year of re-organisation of the scattered heathen hordes - stronger than ever. The anti Burzum propaganda of the police have been very successful indeed. Everybody believes I brutally murdered the commie rat Euronymous and that I'm the bad guy while Euronymous was just an innocent victim of Burzum. This is pure fuckin bullshit and time will tell. In the meanwhile the propaganda bullshit florishes. I'll crush their lies spit on'em afterwards. The victory of Vikings is at hands. Odin lives forever, the one eyed Satan.

          Today the scene with you and Burzum is a bit different, how do you see it? What does Burzum stand for today?

          The same as always. Total destruction of christendom in Scandinavia. The scene is different in the way that we no longer use the word Satanism, but instead we use Heathendom as a term to identify us with. I think the same but speak more clearly. Equivocative speech have proven only to cause confusion, thus I elucidate my views with clear speech to avoid erronous interpretations and misconceptions by the foul masses. Heathendom or Satanism, why not say Heathendom anyway?


          from Slayer magazine somewhen early 94.
          ====================




          Additional info: the "Satanist terrorists" (or the "activists" of the inner circle) was right from the start diverse in beliefs, with Euronymous the religious Satanists clashing heavily with Varg, who took Satan literally (Satan= enemy, adversary) and equalling him with Odin, because this is what the christian church did, making our gods "Satan" or "enemy of (their) god".
          Ein Leben ist nichts, deine Sprosse sind alles
          Aller Sturm nimmt nichts, weil dein Wurzelgriff zu stark ist
          und endet meine Frist, weiss ich dass du noch da bist
          Gefürchtet von der Zeit, mein Baum, mein Stamm in Ewigkeit

          sigpic

          Comment


          • #35
            "Additional info: the "Satanist terrorists" (or the "activists" of the inner circle) was right from the start diverse in beliefs, with Euronymous the religious Satanists clashing heavily with Varg, who took Satan literally (Satan= enemy, adversary) and equalling him with Odin, because this is what the christian church did, making our gods "Satan" or "enemy of (their) god".
            __________________


            I kind of agree here. I have also related to Odhinn to "Lucifer", not Satan. Satan is gay. Lucifer could very well represent Odhinn, if you think of who "he" is and what "he" represents. A raging primal force, bearing light and wisdom. It's one the of the very few ways that one can acknowledge the existence of yahweh and Wotan at the same. Think about it. Either yahweh doesn't exist, never did ... or he/it does and Wotan is his enemy. Which would make Wotan in fact "Lucifer". If you read what Lucifer is/represents you may see the correlation. I don't doubt the existence of yahweh. I just wage war against him.
            "The mystery and secret of Wotan is not that "knowledge" of him is passed along through clandestine cults or even through the re-discovery of old books and texts--but rather that such knowledge is actually encoded in a mysterious way in the DNA, in the very genetic material, of those who are descended from him." - Secret of the Gothick God of Darkness

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by Kauz R. Waldher
              I kind of agree here. I have also related to Odhinn to "Lucifer", not Satan. Satan is gay. Lucifer could very well represent Odhinn, if you think of who "he" is and what "he" represents. A raging primal force, bearing light and wisdom. It's one the of the very few ways that one can acknowledge the existence of yahweh and Wotan at the same. Think about it. Either yahweh doesn't exist, never did ... or he/it does and Wotan is his enemy. Which would make Wotan in fact "Lucifer". If you read what Lucifer is/represents you may see the correlation. I don't doubt the existence of yahweh. I just wage war against him.
              I'm not sure whether I want to agree that Lucifer = Prometheus = Odin. Both Lucifer and Prometheus would be rather of a fully giant nature when you put them into the Norse mythological context, Odin is not of a giant nature though. So there are some discrepancies in that interpretation.

              But that aside, you should really look what "Satan" means within the Jewish religious environment. Satan is not = Lucifer, Satan is a concept rather than any form of a deity. It's the enemy of Israel. Who this enemy was varies from time to time, Rome, Babylon, Assyria, etc, depending on the era. Likewise YHWH is no deity, the Jews killed their entire pantheon of gods. YHWH is the Jewish folk soul, depersonified and deified, and the carrier of the idea of Israel (in western interpretation commonly referred to as paradise) on Earth (compare, for a simpler form of the same concept, the Islamic Houses Dar-al Islam etc). It is a very western problem to mix up those concepts, because westerners commonly try to interprete what is said. Jews dont interprete, they mean literally. They lack entirely any artistic or metaphysical understanding, let alone talent. That is why "christians" study, like the Jews, their scripture over and over again to find "hidden meaning", "enlightenment" or whatever else they are made to believe to find there. Now, when a Jews speaks about Israel on Earth, he means that. It is Jewish dominance over the beasts (which includes explicitely every non-Jew) and the World. New World Order, anyone? However, Satan can be everyone (person, folk, nation, Hitler, Odin, you name it) who oppose Jewish supremacy.
              Ein Leben ist nichts, deine Sprosse sind alles
              Aller Sturm nimmt nichts, weil dein Wurzelgriff zu stark ist
              und endet meine Frist, weiss ich dass du noch da bist
              Gefürchtet von der Zeit, mein Baum, mein Stamm in Ewigkeit

              sigpic

              Comment


              • #37
                It is a common misconception, thanks to the King James (mis)translation that Lucifer is a name, it's not. It's a transliteration of the latin Luciferis, meaning morning star. Even in the King James Lucifer is found once, in the dual prophecy of the fall of the king of Tyre likened to the fall of Satan.

                Following the nature of things, Satan is indeed closest to Loki, including his binding.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by Irmingot View Post
                  EDIT:
                  Here's just one place, where he denies that he have ever had anything to do with any "nazi organization", and ever being a "nazi": http://www.dagbladet.no/2009/07/04/m...psdom/7051663/
                  He sure has a thing with the word "aldri" (never):
                  • Jeg har aldri bedt om hjelp.
                  • Selv har jeg aldri rørt alkohol eller medikamenter.
                  • Det er ganske ironisk å tenke på at jeg aldri drømte om noen form for berømmelse eller beryktelse.
                  • Jeg var truet av hans planer, men det var aldri min plan å drepe.
                  • Jeg har aldri stiftet eller vært medlem av slike organisasjoner.
                  • Jeg har aldri vært nazist, og er det heller ikke nå.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Yes, I agree. I do not believe YHWH is floating through space (or whatever) in a certain form. I absolutely mean as a "force" or collective spirit (or energy). I do not think Wotan is directly linked to Lucifer or YHWH. I just mean that Wotan is always on the journey seeking wisdom. Infinite wisdom. And "wisdom" is exactly what YHWH forbade. Is it not? Wisdom = Gnosis. Everything Wotan is, YHWH represents the opposite. "Bearer of Light" and Wisdom. Not light as in brightness. But light as in being AWAKENED. Aware of what YHWH wants to remain a secret. That of which is, God/divinity lies within. Bottom line ... it is esentially "us vs. them". The semites versus the Germanics. YHWH versus Wotan. In the final battle.

                    It is obvious YHWH exists. Simply observe the vile nature of his followers. It is the highly destructive force that is "spinning the planet" right now.
                    "The mystery and secret of Wotan is not that "knowledge" of him is passed along through clandestine cults or even through the re-discovery of old books and texts--but rather that such knowledge is actually encoded in a mysterious way in the DNA, in the very genetic material, of those who are descended from him." - Secret of the Gothick God of Darkness

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Wotan - "Stone Giants"

                      The stones rise in the foggy plain
                      Laid by giant hands
                      Gave us from a mysterious age
                      Silent witness of the ancient rites
                      Creatures of hell or mortal men
                      Who was the creator of this?
                      Whim of giants of human force
                      Only the ancestors know these secrets

                      [Chorus:]
                      Mighty stones for the gods
                      In a timeless place
                      Hymn of giants for the gods
                      Sanctuary of light

                      The stones are the dark message from the past
                      Laid by giant hands
                      The song of wind blows in the night
                      Voices in the dark

                      Sacrifice to the gods
                      Bloody cult in many tales
                      Holy place for many cults
                      It rose in the name of the bright god of light
                      "The mystery and secret of Wotan is not that "knowledge" of him is passed along through clandestine cults or even through the re-discovery of old books and texts--but rather that such knowledge is actually encoded in a mysterious way in the DNA, in the very genetic material, of those who are descended from him." - Secret of the Gothick God of Darkness

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        "I never was a nazi or aheathen"
                        Quoted from Vikernes' "Reality Time" article, from the late 90'ies:

                        "So, whom are YOU going to listen to? What Hitler, Bormann, Nietzsche, Himmler, Goebbels, Hess and not least what our Pagan forefathers said? Or are you going to listen to what some degenerate American "Christian-Identist" tells you?"

                        "How dare you call Adolf Hitler an "Israelite"? How dare you spit on my culture, my people, my race and everything I love and cherish like that?"

                        "It starts with their symbolical murder of Aryan children - which they call baptism. This is a ritual murder of the Aryan soul, they symbolically drown the Pagan man and bring him back to life as an Artificial Jew, by "shouting out" the name of the Jewish soul that is to replace the Aryan one. First they destroy our Aryan soul, with Christianity, and then they use this to destroy our Aryan blood - as the resistance to this genocide has been broken down by the murder of our Aryan souls! So wake up my friends! Wake up from the Jewish sleep and reclaim Your Aryan souls, by hailing Wuotan! ! Fight for the truth, like our forefathers did, like the Third Reich did! Like WE do! Wake up brothers and sisters, wake up and follow the call of Wuotan! Follow the voice of your blood, and of your heart! It will not lie to you! Heil Wuotan!"

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Kauz R. Waldher View Post
                          "Additional info: the "Satanist terrorists" (or the "activists" of the inner circle) was right from the start diverse in beliefs, with Euronymous the religious Satanists clashing heavily with Varg, who took Satan literally (Satan= enemy, adversary) and equalling him with Odin, because this is what the christian church did, making our gods "Satan" or "enemy of (their) god".
                          __________________


                          I kind of agree here. I have also related to Odhinn to "Lucifer", not Satan. Satan is gay. Lucifer could very well represent Odhinn, if you think of who "he" is and what "he" represents. A raging primal force, bearing light and wisdom. It's one the of the very few ways that one can acknowledge the existence of yahweh and Wotan at the same. Think about it. Either yahweh doesn't exist, never did ... or he/it does and Wotan is his enemy. Which would make Wotan in fact "Lucifer". If you read what Lucifer is/represents you may see the correlation. I don't doubt the existence of yahweh. I just wage war against him.
                          I don't know why you try to support Varg's lies? From the start, it was nothing but good ol´ Satan for Vikernes. After a while, he started with this "Odin as Norse Satan" thing, and later on - it was all Odin, just to end with "religion is ignorance and for stupid people".
                          I was into the Scandinavian "black metal movement" from like 1992-1993 and onwards, and read the almost daily articles in Swedish and Norwegian newspapers. When the spotlight finally fell on Vikernes, it was nothing but Satan that came out of his mouth. This whole "I-saw-Odin-as-Norse-Satan-I-was-never-a-Satanist"-thing, is just another post-construction of his, to fit his agenda. Today it's the "I have never been a Nazi, and have never ever had anything to do with such groups" thing he tries to pull off.

                          EDIT: Excuse me if the tone was a little harsh and hostile there, I simply meant that there's no use in trying to "split hairs" and see if he is right in any Odin/Satan correlation, because he is maybe right about that - but as stated, that is a post-construction, to cover up something he was obviously ashamed of. Just like the "I have never been a nazi"-thing is today.

                          Comment

                          Working...
                          X