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Allenson
Thursday, October 23rd, 2003, 02:07 PM
I guess i should measure both of their heads the next time i see them! :) Alrhough they both will probably find me very odd for doing so. :D
My mother and myself almost definatlly fit borreby, even at lower weights we both exhibit a fleshier nose, deeper creases under the cheeks and much rounder cheeks.
I've found both my dad and brother to be a little more puzzling. The entire immediate family does lean towards being heavier set, even with moderate activity and moderate eating habits.
My brother has been exceptionally active during the past 2 years or so and we witnessed about a 60 pound weight drop in him. Once he becomes more sedintary again, read "behind a desk 8 hours a day" I do believe that the weight will creep back on him. I guess that's metabolism for ya!
In my family it seems easy enough for any of us to drop weight by being on the move all of the time, but even easier to put it back on with the slightest decrease in activity. All this without changeing eating habits at all. Anyhow, rambling again!

I wanted to thank you guys again for looking over these. I'm impressed with the knowledgablilty found on this forum.



I have a "theory" if you will about UP types and metabolism. I can't help but speculate that UP types have slower metabolisms than other, more gracile and linear types. One could perhaps argue that evolving in a cooler, glacial and post-glacial climate, might bring this about as a way of staving off the cold by being more efficient with consumed calories, spreading those calories out over a longer period of time (between those juicy mammoth burgers!) and perhaps also leading to the storage of some fat for insulation. Nowadays, with our cushy, sedentary lifestyles coupled with fatty foods, this may lead to being overweight.

Personally speaking, I usually am more fit in the winter time (my activity level is about the same as in other seasons) and my appetite is by all means greater! :)

cosmocreator
Thursday, October 23rd, 2003, 10:04 PM
I have a "theory" if you will about UP types and metabolism. I can't help but speculate that UP types have slower metabolisms than other, more gracile and linear types.


I think it is exactly the opposite.

I've done an experiment on myself. For the last year I've spent as much time as possibly at outdoor temperatures. Very hot summers are unbearable and make me irritable. Temperatures here during the winter don't drop too much below freezing. However, I sleep at night at outdoor temperatures. I did it last winter and I'm doing it now that the temperatures are getting cooler. It was only recently that I've made a connection. I'm loosing weight and I couldn't figure out why. Although, I don't usually have my first meal until mid-afternoon, I'm rarely hungry. And that first meal is very large. An example would be a pound of hamburger, baked potato with lots of sour cream and maybe a small ceasar salad. Sometimes I eat when I'm not hungry. Yet I'm loosing weight. And it's only recent since the weather is turning cooler. I think the body speeds up metabolism to keep warm. Well, I know it does. I read in one of Coon's books of a study of Alaskid (sp?) Indians that walk bare foot on snow and swim in ice cold water. When they came into contact with cold, their metabolism sped up.

So the reason UP European types are over-weight, is because (1) they aren't active enough (2) they've sheltered themselves from the cold. How many hours does the typical UP spend at cold outdoor temperatures? 2 hours a day? Probably not even that much.

There are alot of squatters here living in parks. They are basically homeless people. It would be an interesting experiment to offer them as much food as they want on the condition they continue to live outside in tents. You don't typically see an over-weight homeless person but that could be due to diet constraints. Remove the diet constraints and see if they gain weight and record how active they are.

Awar
Friday, October 24th, 2003, 12:01 AM
I think I'm largely UP, because of my skeletal build ( large head, big bones etc. )

I have a friend who is mostly Mediterranean, and two Gypsy friends. I've been watching their behaviour for years, and I noticed some striking differences.

1. I usually have around 100-105 kilograms at 180cm height I'm very muscular.

My Med friend is over 190cm tall, yet his weight never exceeds 90kg. He's very muscular also, but very lean. He cannot gain muscle mass, I hardly gain definition.

My Gypsy friends are small-frame with aproximmately 60-65 kg's. and 170-175cm height. They too cannot gain any mass.

2. I can go for days without eating anything. I can even train very hard, do a lot of work etc. without having to eat.

Both the Med and the Gypsies eat every 3-4 hours, if not, they feel depressed and dizzy.

3. I can walk for miles without feeling tired.

The Med can sustain such efforts, the gypsies cannot.

4. I have absolutely no problem with very hot or very cold weather, I easily adjust. My only problem is the rain, I feel very run-down when it rains.

Both the Med and the Gypsies absolutely love rainy weather ???

berlin
Friday, October 24th, 2003, 01:52 AM
I have to agree with cosmocreater to some extent. I've never actually done a formal experiment on myself but i can truely say that any considerable weight loss i've experianced has always occured in the winters. Especially the winters in the northern parts of Ontario. I don't really change my eating habits or activity level all that much and 10 to 20 pounds seem to just drop right off as soon as the temperature starts dropping below 0 degrees celcius. I've always found it odd.
Unfortunatly i fluctuate, a whole lot, and that weight comes right back very quickly when summer comes around again. I do find myself a lot more sluggish and lethargic in the summer months and don't tend to move around outside a whole lot. i suppose my activeness goes down, but my appitite also goes right down with it.

Vojvoda
Friday, October 24th, 2003, 01:58 AM
Your body has a tendency to heat itself, therefore, if you are active or train in cold weather you burn more calories as the body is trying harder to maintain a certain level of heat.

cosmocreator
Friday, October 24th, 2003, 03:20 AM
I think this thread should be split starting with post 31. The new subject heading should be something like Cold Weather and Metabolism.

And this post can be deleted.

Awar
Friday, October 24th, 2003, 03:38 AM
Your body has a tendency to heat itself, therefore, if you are active or train in cold weather you burn more calories as the body is trying harder to maintain a certain level of heat.

Certainly! I'd add that it depends on a person's ancestry in which way his organism reacts to such conditions for a longer period of time.

I think that Upper-Palaeolithic type tends to store more fat than either Mediterranean or Nordic, especially in the winter time. This is probably because UP's are accustomed to living in regions of long winters and short summers.

Vojvoda
Friday, October 24th, 2003, 03:39 AM
Certainly! I'd add that it depends on a person's ancestry in which way his organism reacts to such conditions for a longer period of time.

I think that Upper-Palaeolithic type tends to store more fat than either Mediterranean or Nordic, especially in the winter time. This is probably because UP's are accustomed to living in regions of long winters and short summers.

Just like bears:)

cosmocreator
Friday, October 24th, 2003, 03:48 AM
Just like bears:)


You are right there. In the summer I hardly sleep at all, in the winter I need more sleep.

Vojvoda
Friday, October 24th, 2003, 03:50 AM
You are right there. In the summer I hardly sleep at all, in the winter I need more sleep.

For sure, most people also get sleepy earlier in the day during the winter months. I though you were a North American grizzly:)

Awar
Friday, October 24th, 2003, 03:51 AM
Just like bears:)

You are what you eat :D

( the UP's probably hunted down a lot of European Giant Bears, Buffalos, Rhinos, sabre-tooth kitties, Mammoths etc. )

Allenson
Friday, October 24th, 2003, 02:24 PM
Sure, metabolisms speed up when one is cold...I didn't mean to imply otherwise. What I was trying to say is that I wonder if UP metabolisms are more efficient in the cold than other types. A UP's metabolism will certainly increase but not to the extent that a Med's might in an effort to stay woarm. If that were the case, then the UP's rate would increase during winter to help stay warm but would not 'run out of gas' as quickly as a linear subtype's might.

What was once an advantage has now become a detriment in our modern world of TVs, comfy couches and bacon double cheesburgers.

Loki
Friday, October 24th, 2003, 02:37 PM
I think this thread should be split starting with post 31. The new subject heading should be something like Cold Weather and Metabolism.

And this post can be deleted.

Good idea. Feel like splitting some threads, eh Dalonord? :D

Allenson
Friday, October 24th, 2003, 02:39 PM
Sure thing. I've just got to figure out how to do it. Hang on!

Awar
Friday, October 24th, 2003, 02:48 PM
Could you please tell us where the splitted thread went?

Allenson
Friday, October 24th, 2003, 03:27 PM
To readers:

This post should go with the other posts under the same subject heading. It was originally a classification request post but of course, we got off of the subject. :)

This post should be read first in the split thread followed by Cosmocreator's reply...found beginning the other thread by the same name.

Confused? You can bet I am.

Awar
Sunday, October 26th, 2003, 01:32 AM
Does anyone know for how long did various European populations live there......for example.....when did UP's come into Europe?

cosmocreator
Sunday, October 26th, 2003, 06:49 AM
To readers:

This post should go with the other posts under the same subject heading. It was originally a classification request post but of course, we got off of the subject. :)

This post should be read first in the split thread followed by Cosmocreator's reply...found beginning the other thread by the same name.

Confused? You can bet I am.


Yeah, but now you have to move the other posts here.

Johnny Reb
Sunday, October 26th, 2003, 10:35 PM
They went here. I've noticed that I am more energetic in the wintertime. During summer I just laze about the house. I used to love the heat, but in the recent years, I've come to strongly dislike it. I almost feel nauseous if it's really hot out. I thrive in near subzero temperatures. I don't know how my metabolism goes. I seem to put on weight during the summer, just because I dont' do much.

Awar
Sunday, October 26th, 2003, 11:18 PM
I'm very active during summer, but I don't get a lot of sleep. I think this causes depressions I have during summer. I don't get a lot of sleep because I somehow have more energy, and even though I go to the gym regularly, I don't seem to spend it all.

In winter, I have better results in the gym, but this is followed by a pleasant feeling of exhaustedness, and falling easily asleep in a warm bed :D mmmmm

Dr. Solar Wolff
Wednesday, October 29th, 2003, 04:49 AM
Wasn't there something in the Microbiology and Genetics section saying something about a mutation aprox. 25,000 years ago in Europe in which heat generation in the body cold be speeded up (making more heat) at the expense of muscular strength? There was some test with sperm of northern Europeans which moved slower (but presumably was warmer) than sperm without this mutation.

Also, years ago a study was done in Norway. College students were slowly exposed to the cold as winter set in with very little clothing. After a period of time their metabolism was measured. The results were that it had increased with increased cold.

Personally, I gain weight at this time of year and shead it in Spring.

Ogmios
Thursday, October 30th, 2003, 09:28 PM
I believe that those of Baltic/ Eastern European origin do indeed have a 'winter metabolism' that enables them to 'take in their stride' cold weather.

In winter sub-zero conditions (rarely found in the UK these years) I am at ease in a Tee shirt doing work such as cutting wood, chopping logs in several degrees minus zero ; whereas my English relatives have to wrap up with multiple layers of clothing ,and still feel the cold.

I believe that east Europeans have a metabolism that can naturally ratchet up to cope with sub-zero temps, whereas the 'temperate climate' European population(or those of southern european descent) cannot do that naturally - they have to utilise insulation(Clothing) to beat the cold.'

Many of my East European coleagues have the same metabolic 'advantage'.
:elkjoint

cosmocreator
Thursday, October 30th, 2003, 09:56 PM
I believe that those of Baltic/ Eastern European origin do indeed have a 'winter metabolism' that enables them to 'take in their stride' cold weather.

In winter sub-zero conditions (rarely found in the UK these years) I am at ease in a Tee shirt doing work such as cutting wood, chopping logs in several degrees minus zero ; whereas my English relatives have to wrap up with multiple layers of clothing ,and still feel the cold.

I believe that east Europeans have a metabolism that can naturally ratchet up to cope with sub-zero temps, whereas the 'temperate climate' European population(or those of southern european descent) cannot do that naturally - they have to utilise insulation(Clothing) to beat the cold.'

Many of my East European coleagues have the same metabolic 'advantage'.
:elkjoint


It has to do with UP's not solely Eastern Europeans. There are people who wear short year round here in Vancouver and many of them are from the UK.

Awar
Thursday, October 30th, 2003, 10:48 PM
For the last 10 or so years I'm constantly wearing only a t-shirt and a jacket when it's minus, and I don't feel cold, it even feels revivingly chilly :)

But, very high temperatures also don't bother me... I guess it's because of my mixed Med-UP ancestry :)