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Agrippa
Monday, August 7th, 2006, 05:24 PM
Lappids and Racial variation in modern Sami people

Inspired by this thread:
http://forum.stirpes.net/showthread.php?p=82689

Compare with this for the development of the racial types in question:
http://forum.stirpes.net/showthread.php?t=7827

1. Unmixed or predominantely Lappid forms from anthropological works and historical photographs, this type is an Europoid contact race with the Mongoloid spectrum:
Sami woman:
http://www.baiki.org/images/postcard_mother.jpg
Old woman being typical:
http://www.trussel.com/maig/image/fighon4b.jpg

Two arctic people with a very different skull shape, Eskimid and Lappid after Baker:
http://img330.imageshack.us/img330/6420/eskimidlappidbakergj4.th.jpg (http://img330.imageshack.us/my.php?image=eskimidlappidbakergj4.jpg)
The Lappid skull is extremely rounded and reduced-infantile.

Compare with this Dalofaelid (essentially unaltered Cromagnid) skull:
http://img440.imageshack.us/img440/6952/phalianskull2fdfz5.th.jpg (http://img440.imageshack.us/my.php?image=phalianskull2fdfz5.jpg)

Nordid and Dalofaelid examples for comparison:
http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/999/pnpi8.th.jpg (http://img175.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pnpi8.jpg)

Lappid woman from Knussmann (1996):
http://img185.imageshack.us/img185/1456/lappidknussmannkf5.th.jpg (http://img185.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lappidknussmannkf5.jpg)

Lappid drawing after Lundman:
http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/8378/lappidlundmanvv8.th.jpg (http://img175.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lappidlundmanvv8.jpg)

Associated infantile body type from Lundman:
http://img441.imageshack.us/img441/8286/infantilinffoetbj7.th.jpg (http://img441.imageshack.us/my.php?image=infantilinffoetbj7.jpg)

Predominantely Lappid examples:
http://img334.imageshack.us/img334/5107/lappenrw5.th.jpg (http://img334.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lappenrw5.jpg)

The second from above is an extreme Lappid, typical for the evolutionary tendency (total infantilisation), whereas the one below is obviously mixed and shows progressive racial traits:
http://img324.imageshack.us/img324/9849/lappen2ga4.th.jpg (http://img324.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lappen2ga4.jpg)
http://img324.imageshack.us/img324/9849/lappen2ga4.th.jpg (http://img324.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lappen2ga4.jpg)

Typical Lappid girl:
http://img306.imageshack.us/img306/8773/saamilu6.th.jpg (http://img306.imageshack.us/my.php?image=saamilu6.jpg)

Typical Lappid woman:
http://img174.imageshack.us/img174/5818/lappidtj1.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Typical Lappids:
http://img174.imageshack.us/img174/1750/lappish2pi5.th.jpg (http://img174.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lappish2pi5.jpg)

Mixed Lapps:
http://img188.imageshack.us/img188/4193/lappishmixedqw5.th.jpg (http://img188.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lappishmixedqw5.jpg)

The admixture led to "broken" Lappid traits and produced more Europid phenotypes. The woman above approaches a Central European Alpinoid in a harmonious mixture, the man below (left) being a more disharmonious mixed form (Nordid-Lappid) and the right one seems to have a rather Eastbaltid phenotype (Finnish admixture).

Lappoid and Mongolised forms from Hungary:
http://img395.imageshack.us/img395/4246/lappoidod4.th.jpg (http://img395.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lappoidod4.jpg)

Extreme Eastbaltid-Lappoid:
http://img395.imageshack.us/img395/9673/eastbaltid2zr0.th.gif (http://img395.imageshack.us/my.php?image=eastbaltid2zr0.gif)

Same pattern from Russia:
http://img188.imageshack.us/img188/1343/eastbaltid20mongoloidpm5.th.jpg (http://img188.imageshack.us/my.php?image=eastbaltid20mongoloidpm5.jp g)

Mongoloid tendencies being obvious as is the reduction-infantilisation which goes beyond sheer Borealisation (cold adaptation).

Now I will try to use examples of modern Samis found on the internet for showing a basic variation in people which identify themselves with Lapps today for comparison. I'm always just going on what is visible on the image and refrain from classification in very unclear cases:

Obviously mixed:
http://www.levi.fi/pages/eng/images/205_sami_people.jpg

Stronger Lappid influenced man:
http://www.levi.fi/pages/eng/images/167_saam.jpg

Clear Lappid traits:
http://www.pilotguides.com/images/content/destination_guide/europe/norway/norway_sami_women.jpg

People in the foreground rather mixed, background more Lappid:
http://www.pilotguides.com/images/content/destination_guide/europe/norway/norway_sami.jpg

Rather (pred. but most likely mixed) Lappid woman beside a classic Europid man:
http://www.sami.uit.no/forum/bilder/stavenhagen1.jpg

Pred. Lappid people:
http://www.culturalprofiles.org.uk/Norway/Media/-146_50.jpg

Lappid woman:
http://img450.imageshack.us/img450/4818/sami2005fn6.th.jpg (http://img450.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sami2005fn6.jpg)

Typical old Lappid face, note especially the nasal profile:
http://www.mt-magda.org/Exhibits/2006/images/Inga%20II.jpg

Sami "hero" which is more Nordid/classic Europid than Lappid:
http://www.ourplanet.com/tunza/issue0202en/images/sami_image.jpg
Story behind his face:
http://www.ourplanet.com/tunza/issue0202en/pages/sami.html

Pred. Lappid:
http://library.thinkquest.org/27518/lapps.gif

Interesting group:
http://majorityrights.com/images/uploads/sami.jpg
From left to right:
Lappid, pred. Nordoid, rather Cromangoid man? (not good visible), Lappid, Lappoid mixed man approaching Alpinoid in a way again with still clearly visible Lappoid traits, same pattern with weaker Lappoid traits.

All pictures from sites from or about modern Sami people.

joseanton
Monday, August 7th, 2006, 06:14 PM
1. Unmixed or predominantely Lappid forms from anthropological works and historical photographs, this type is an Europoid contact race with the Mongoloid spectrum:


Interesting thread, but why "europoid contact race with the mongoloid spectrum", IMO the tipical lapps that you post are not europids, are tipical mongoloids, very similar to the poeple of Siberia or the Inuits, not the same with the mixed lapps who look pred. europoid.

http://img174.imageshack.us/img174/1750/lappish2pi5.jpg (http://imageshack.us/?x=my6&myref=http://forums.skadi.net/showthread.php?p=500338#post500338)

Agrippa
Monday, August 7th, 2006, 06:24 PM
There position is disputed but both if looking at their sources and typical representatives they are at best intermediate (Mongolid-Europid/Eurasian). Whats making them very Mongoloid looking is the infantile-borealised character together with the mongoliform, mixed additions. But the former can occur in Europids too, they just deviate from the (classic) Europid standard then without being truly Mongoloid.

OneEnglishNorman
Monday, August 7th, 2006, 08:30 PM
I find Lapps interesting... the reach of the Mongoloid types is very great, all the way from the Americas into Europe.

How do the pure Lapps compare to other Mongoloid sub-types? In comparison, are they especially small? Their facial features are very child-like.

Agrippa
Monday, August 7th, 2006, 09:07 PM
How do the pure Lapps compare to other Mongoloid sub-types? In comparison, are they especially small? Their facial features are very child-like.

As I said, though having Mongoloid or at least Mongoliform traits, being part-Mongolised they are an Europoid or contact race in most systems.

They being indeed very infantilised (typical Lappids, not all Lapps!), even more so than many Mongolid forms, most that infantile Eurasians live in South Eastern Asia (but there is variation too).
In comparison to the more robust build Tungid Mongolids which are the cold adapted, Borealised form, they look indeed still more reduced and infantile, both this Tungids aren't really, only their proportions shortened.
Lappoid and Lappid-mixed forms show obviously a wider range of variation and are not all that infantile.

OneEnglishNorman
Monday, August 7th, 2006, 09:37 PM
Wikipedia does not even hint that the Lapps are a contact race, this page could do with being re-written:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sami_history

One Mongoloid aspect which the Lapps have adopted appears to be their eyes "buried" within their skulls.

Some European & Mongoloid traits could have been disregarded, and those useful from an evolutionary/survival POV maintained, so in a sense they are a new sub-race?

Agrippa
Monday, August 7th, 2006, 10:29 PM
They are a racial type on their own best described as contact race of rather Europoid (than Mongoloid) character.

SubGnostic
Wednesday, November 1st, 2006, 02:24 PM
Might be of interest:

http://www.galdu.org/govat/stuorra/karta.gif

Distribution of Sami people according to

http://www.galdu.org/ --- "Resource Center for the Rights of Indigenous Peoples"

The site intro also illustrates the main directions of the racial variation of Uralid-related populations.

SubGnostic
Wednesday, November 1st, 2006, 03:03 PM
Some examples of "Koltta" -Samis from the Kola peninsula and Inari region with less mongoliform tendencies:

http://kotinetti.suomi.net/harri.nurminen/Galleria3/images/12.jpg

http://kotinetti.suomi.net/harri.nurminen/Galleria3/images/14.jpg
http://kotinetti.suomi.net/harri.nurminen/Galleria3/images/17.jpg

http://kotinetti.suomi.net/harri.nurminen/Galleria3/images/26.jpg

http://kotinetti.suomi.net/harri.nurminen/Galleria3/images/27.jpg

http://kotinetti.suomi.net/harri.nurminen/Galleria3/images/28.jpg

http://kotinetti.suomi.net/harri.nurminen/Galleria3/images/31.jpg

http://kotinetti.suomi.net/harri.nurminen/Galleria3/images/32.jpg

http://kotinetti.suomi.net/harri.nurminen/Galleria3/images/47.jpg

http://kotinetti.suomi.net/harri.nurminen/Galleria3/images/54.jpg

http://kotinetti.suomi.net/harri.nurminen/Galleria3/images/56.jpg