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Digitalseal
Thursday, June 1st, 2006, 04:55 AM
Historians and anthropologists among other groups, all agree that only the Mongolid and the Europid races were the only ones that had created civilizations without being influenced by anyone.

But what about the pre-Europid population of India? did not the original Dravidian peoples who were Weddid in race(related to Australids) create the Vedic Civilization? or was that also influenced by the Europid Indo-Aryans?

Cnooc
Thursday, June 1st, 2006, 05:32 AM
it can be argued that the Dravidians were themselves an early Caucasoid people. I have noticed that many South Indians, other than their skin color, have surprisingly very well defined Europid features.

http://img80.imageshack.us/img80/7205/tamil0in.jpg

Oswiu
Thursday, June 1st, 2006, 06:14 PM
it can be argued that the Dravidians were themselves an early Caucasoid people.
Absolutely. Consider the Brahui of Iran/Pakistan/Afghanistan, the last Dravidian speakers of Northern India, and those living closest to the Mohenjo Daro and Harrapa archaeological sites;
http://www.ksafe.com/profiles/images1/0243.jpghttp://www.joshuaproject.net/profiles/photos/p101653.jpghttp://www.ksafe.com/profiles/p_maps2/7.gif

SuuT
Thursday, June 1st, 2006, 08:25 PM
did not the original Dravidian peoples who were Weddid in race(related to Australids) create the Vedic Civilization? or was that also influenced by the Europid Indo-Aryans?[/quote]

http://india_resource.tripod.com/aryan.html

http://www.genomenewsnetwork.org/articles/05_01/Indo-European.shtml

http://www.genome.org/cgi/content/abstract/13/10/2277

...pieces to your puzzle. There is no doubt that Vedic civilisation was affected by Aryan invasions. The question really is, to what extent was the vedas vedic prior to the invasions that show themselves in the genetic evidence and resultant caste systems. I.e. who made the civilisation more psychically complete. The answer is, to use your words, "the Europid Indo-Aryan".

Oswiu
Thursday, June 1st, 2006, 09:11 PM
The question really is, to what extent was the vedas vedic prior to the invasions that show themselves in the genetic evidence and resultant caste systems. I.e. who made the civilisation more psychically complete. The answer is, to use your words, "the Europid Indo-Aryan".
Oh Gods, I didn't see that Digital Seal was asking if the Vedic civilisation was Dravidian or not. I would say decidedly not. I understand Vedic as being the Indic speaking civilisation that arose after Indo European invaders had built a new and more familiarly Indian civilisation on the ruins of the Harappan Indus Valley one, that of the Rig Veda. Of course, as in most such scenarios, we are by no means suggesting a total genocide of the predecessors, nor that the Aryan invaders were totally responsible for the collapse of the urban system that that may have already found in crisis, but the creative genius of the new culture was undoubtedly of the northwest.

Agrippa
Friday, June 2nd, 2006, 12:14 AM
Dravidians themselves were mostly Europid (Protomediterranid/Indid) with just minor Weddoid contribution. Weddoid themselves being rather diverse with subtypes approaching Europoids at least and others which are going in an Negritid direction (Malid) - having Negritid admixture.
Not to forget the intermediate racial type which is already more Europoid than anything else, the Indomelanids, which are dominant under todays culturally higher developed Southern Indians/Dravidians.

Weddoids themselves, especially their more progressive forms, had civilisations on their own, but they can't be equated with Dravidians. F.e. Cambodcha/Khmer had much more Weddoid influence than the Indus civilisation.

Klegutati
Tuesday, July 18th, 2006, 11:18 PM
They are obviously of Y-chromosome haplogroup K, which Haplogroup O, N, R, and another one stemmed from.. The R (proto-Europoids) were minorly affected by climate, and didn't have as many mutations as O or N..:D