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Huzar
Wednesday, August 3rd, 2005, 06:13 PM
Well, like i've said in some Agrippa's thread, now i'll post an extensive gallery of phenotypical types in the area of northern Italy.
NOTE : Northern Italy board is considered to be the Po river, and all the valley around (pianura Padana = Padan plain)


Like many of you already know, Northern Italy, (or Padania for somehttp://forum.stirpes.net/images/smilies/stirpes1/wink0001.gif ) is very mixed, since its geographical position, that makes the entire area an historical board between Central Europe and Mediterranean Europe. North-Italy is still Central-Europe, but of course the south side of it.

The three major components are : Alpinoids, Dinaroids, Nordoids (the most autoctonous, i mean. With the final "-oids" i mean these tipologies in the "wider sense" everyone) . In minor numbers there are Meds. The fusion of all these components creates modern "Padania".

By the way, i consider "Alpinoids" and "Dinaroids" the most ancient element(both, results of the Celtic invasions), while Nordoids, result of the germanic obviously, and Meds of the Roman/Italic influence.
All considered individuals are real Natives of -North-Italy or share the same origin.



Some Tv speakers to begin :


http://tinypic.com/9sb5m1.jpg

1)http://tinypic.com/9sb5ur.jpg

2)http://tinypic.com/9sb63b.jpg

3)http://tinypic.com/9sb69k.jpg

4)http://tinypic.com/9sb6ld.jpg

first two, have, imo, some dominant UP-NordAlpinid component. n.3 some phalian perhaps, while last, some Alpinid-nordid one.

I conclude this serie with the most famous Tv-conductor in my country :


http://tinypic.com/9sb9cz.jpg




Here, Some famous actors and actresses :


http://tinypic.com/9sb9zr.jpg

http://tinypic.com/9sbbs1.jpghttp://tinypic.com/9sbciv.jpg

http://tinypic.com/9sbc00.jpg

http://tinypic.com/9sbcwz.jpg


This one is a good Atlanto-Med example (192 cm height)

http://tinypic.com/9sbd45.jpg


http://tinypic.com/9sbdhv.jpg

http://tinypic.com/9sbeyx.jpg

http://tinypic.com/9sbfiw.jpghttp://tinypic.com/9sbfuv.jpg

I'd sai some Borreby here
http://tinypic.com/9sbg4n.jpg

Famous singer Gianni Morandi(from Bologna) . I couldn't classify him
http://tinypic.com/9sbgo2.jpg




Second groups of types...............


Some Tv soubrettes :

http://tinypic.com/9sc4l3.jpg

http://tinypic.com/9sc4u1.jpg

http://tinypic.com/9sc56o.jpg

She comes from Dalmatia
http://tinypic.com/9sc5jl.jpg


http://tinypic.com/9sc5sg.jpghttp://tinypic.com/9sc5xi.jpg




And now, a good Soccer players group..........


Buffon (juventus good player) Is what i call "Norid" = light Dinarid

http://tinypic.com/9sc7zm.jpg


While Zambrotta, is what i call "Adriatid" = Dark Dinarid

http://tinypic.com/9sc8t1.jpghttp://tinypic.com/9sc8xu.jpg
http://tinypic.com/9sc94o.jpg


Another pair of "Norids" = light Dinarids..........

http://tinypic.com/9scb4l.jpg
http://tinypic.com/9scbi8.jpg

And another pair of "Adriatids" = dark Dinarids............

http://tinypic.com/9scc2r.jpg
http://tinypic.com/9scdoh.jpg



Now some mixed series of various athletes and people from the show business :



http://tinypic.com/9sce2w.jpg

http://tinypic.com/9sce51.jpg

http://tinypic.com/9sce9k.jpg

http://tinypic.com/9scebr.jpg

http://tinypic.com/9scegl.jpg

http://tinypic.com/9scemo.jpg

http://tinypic.com/9sceqf.jpg

http://tinypic.com/9scew3.jpg

http://tinypic.com/9scfau.jpg

http://tinypic.com/9scfgo.jpg



http://tinypic.com/9scgso.jpghttp://tinypic.com/9scguc.jpg



http://tinypic.com/9sch29.jpg

http://tinypic.com/9schaw.jpg

http://tinypic.com/9schg3.jpg
http://tinypic.com/9schna.jpg
http://tinypic.com/9schp4.jpg
http://tinypic.com/9schtj.jpg

http://tinypic.com/9schzp.jpghttp://tinypic.com/9sci2h.jpg

http://tinypic.com/9scidv.jpghttp://tinypic.com/9scif5.jpg

http://tinypic.com/9scihh.jpg

http://tinypic.com/9scljk.jpg

Wichmann
Wednesday, August 3rd, 2005, 06:41 PM
My personal favourite. :) Whoose that girl?

By any chance, is she from Tuscany? I have seen quite similar girls in Florence. Tuscany is part of Padania, isn't it?


http://tinypic.com/9sbbs1.jpg

Huzar
Wednesday, August 3rd, 2005, 07:17 PM
My personal favourite. :) Whoose that girl?

By any chance, is she from Tuscany? I have seen quite similar girls in Florence. Tuscany is part of Padania, isn't it?

Uh, the geographical definition of Padania is controversial : Tuscany technically isn't Padania (the real board is the Po valley, and Tuscania is below this line), but although this, many consider it part of northern Italy.


Her name is Eleonora giorgi, famous actress in the seventies (sorry Wich, she is a bit mature now:P !). She is from Lombardia, from what i know. Good choice anyway;) (this forum rules don't allow me to post her, ehm.....best pics:D:D )

Southern Jarl
Wednesday, August 3rd, 2005, 07:46 PM
I see you've claimed Batistuta, a fellow Argie! That's Ok. I'm not sure about his background but if I associate an Italian surname to that phenotype I would suppose he hails from Northern Italy (I actually make those northern-southern distinctions!). It seems that, proportionally, we've received more Northern Italian immigration than the US (more Sicilian-Calabrese I suppose). Anyway, I found strange you didn't post Valeria Mazza too. No worries, still a great job!!:)

QuietWind
Wednesday, August 3rd, 2005, 08:14 PM
Interesting post. You really have some very diverse samples. :)

Huzar
Wednesday, August 3rd, 2005, 08:29 PM
It seems that, proportionally, we've received more Northern Italian immigration than the US (more Sicilian-Calabrese I suppose). Anyway, I found strange you didn't post Valeria Mazza too. No worries, still a great job!!:)
O.K. like you wish.............



VALERIA MAZZA :


http://tinypic.com/9uyz2x.jpghttp://tinypic.com/9uz18k.jpg

http://tinypic.com/9uz1c5.jpg



I LIKE this last more than the others............:)


http://tinypic.com/9uz1gx.jpg

Scholar
Wednesday, August 3rd, 2005, 10:45 PM
I have to agree, Italy in general is quite diverse, not just Northern Italy. My great grandmother lived in Northern Italy before comeing to America. She had freckles and red hair, married when she was 15 :D. From what I understand, the Northern Italians migrated to America first in places such as "The North End" of Boston but were 'replaced' you could say by the Sicilians later on. However, the Northern Italians 'replaced' the Irish and the Irish 'replaced' the English. Now sadly, the Italians of the North End are being 'replaced' by minorities. :~(

Scholar
Wednesday, August 3rd, 2005, 10:54 PM
For the interested reader the following regional breakdown illustrates the migration patterns of the southern Italian during the years 1861-1961:9 (http://www.clevelandmemory.org/italians/partii.html#note_22)

Naples area 1,105,802(27.4%)

Abruzzi and Molise 652,972(16.2%)

Apulia 300,152(7.4%)

Basilicata 232,389(5.8%)

Calabria 522,422(13.0%)

Sicily 1,205,788(29.9%)

Sardinia 14,669(.04%)

From the central and northern regions only 1,024,572 persons emigrated. Before 1860 the Northern Italian had dominated the trickle of Italian emigration. But from 1876 to 1900 only some 99,000 were from the north out of a total of some 772,792 persons.

Edward SC
Wednesday, August 3rd, 2005, 11:51 PM
I think that Camoranesi is not White, probabily "mestizo", med mixed with amerindian. In fact, he is argentinian and in Argentina there are a lot of mestizos.(and growing)

Krabat
Thursday, August 4th, 2005, 01:53 PM
Good thread man. Very Informative.

platypus
Thursday, August 4th, 2005, 03:41 PM
This is the first time i post on this site. good gallery. though not all the individuals you have posted are N Italians (O.Muti is Half Russian, Bonolis half Neapolitan, Buongiorno Sicilian etc)

Northern Italy in my experience presents the types you have mentioned, though the vast majority probably takes an intermediate form.

two of the most common are:

1. Alpino-Med (non dinaric) (see Berlusconi)

2. An intermediate 'Atlanto Med-Dinaric' type which we could identify with your 'Adriatic' (see Zambrotta, M Bellucci)

3. Individuals with suggestive Cro-Magnid-like features can appear every now and then...(Capello, R Prodi below)
http://img244.imageshack.us/img244/5857/fabiocapello4vq.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img39.imageshack.us/img39/3258/prodi5yv.th.gif (http://img39.imageshack.us/my.php?image=prodi5yv.gif)

Dr.Fausto
Thursday, August 4th, 2005, 05:24 PM
Hailsa!! Congratulations for a job well done!!:D

I´m a one of the grandchildren of North Italy in Argentina , in special my zone is full of this kind of people !! I resident on Santa Fe one of the provincias or sates most beautifoul and rich!!Sorry for my poor english language!:P

Thanks for your interesting post!!:thumbup

Northern Paladin
Thursday, August 4th, 2005, 06:17 PM
Great thread. Northern Italy has a rich variety of phenotypes. Not suprisingly really given it's history and location.

Racially Northern Italy seems to have more affinity with Central Europe than Southern Italy.

Huzar
Thursday, August 4th, 2005, 07:00 PM
Racially Northern Italy seems to have more affinity with Central Europe than Southern Italy.

Of course. For me it's an obvious thing, Paladin, but i imagine that for many strangers like you isn't the same. Italian immigration in the world in the last century was mostly form southern Italy (classic or south-Med in the majority), therefore , people from U.S.A. , Australia, South-Africa and Germany, to make some examples, usually sterotype italian people like Mediterraneans ,both culturally and racially. It's wrong.

By the way, not all agree on the fact that north Italy is really Italy. Some, here where i live, use the term "Padania".................

Scholar
Thursday, August 4th, 2005, 09:13 PM
My grandfather was from Sicily and my grandmother was from Milan :P . I think the greatest affinity for all Italian people is the language. Oh, and on the other side Grandmother came from Sparta, Grandfather from Thessaloniki.

dazed&confused
Thursday, August 4th, 2005, 09:16 PM
Zambrotta is of southern origin.

Huzar
Thursday, August 4th, 2005, 09:23 PM
Zambrotta is of southern origin.
I didn't know. Well, i'll substitute him with another one..........


http://tinypic.com/a0axvl.jpg

Dr.Fausto
Sunday, August 7th, 2005, 11:30 AM
:D !!Hello Celtic tiger!! my granfathers are of Nort of Italy.The granfaher of my father are from a little town near Genova city and his wife too.:)
And for mother side too exept i dont know the place rigth.:(
I think my folk is the lombardo o langbardtten . ¿What you think about this?
So long and racial greetings!!!:thumbup

all star
Wednesday, August 10th, 2005, 06:46 PM
Of course. For me it's an obvious thing, Paladin, but i imagine that for many strangers like you isn't the same. Italian immigration in the world in the last century was mostly form southern Italy (classic or south-Med in the majority), therefore , people from U.S.A. , Australia, South-Africa and Germany, to make some examples, usually sterotype italian people like Mediterraneans ,both culturally and racially. It's wrong.

By the way, not all agree on the fact that north Italy is really Italy. Some, here where i live, use the term "Padania".................

That's like saying in America the the northern part is not really America, the boundrys of Italy are quite obvious, look on any map.
Changing it's name does not change it's location, Northern Italy is not a country by it's self.
" A rose by any other name , will still smell like a rose"

morfrain_encilgar
Thursday, August 11th, 2005, 12:46 AM
That's like saying in America the the northern part is not really America, the boundrys of Italy are quite obvious, look on any map.
Changing it's name does not change it's location, Northern Italy is not a country by it's self.
" A rose by any other name , will still smell like a rose"

As you are aware, Celtic Tiger was questioning the national and phenotypical unity of Italy, and he was obviously not questioning wether Italy exists as a geographical location, All Star.

all star
Thursday, August 11th, 2005, 01:05 AM
As you are aware, Celtic Tiger was questioning the national and phenotypical unity of Italy, and he was obviously not questioning wether Italy exists as a geographical location, All Star.

Celtic Tiger said!


By the way, not all agree on the fact that north Italy is really Italy. Some, here where i live, use the term "Padania"

If northern Italy is not really Italy then what is it? their is no country that I know of, that is called Padania.
A 10 year old kid will tell you padania, lombard are all part of Italy, if some of you people up north don't want to be Italian, then just move to a country of your choice, and let the real Italians live there and run their country instead of playing these foolish mental games in your heads, and sounding foolish.
:blueroll:

morfrain_encilgar
Thursday, August 11th, 2005, 01:14 AM
If northern Italy is not really Italy then what is it? their is no country that I know of, that is called Padania.

It is debatable that Italy is a valid country (as in nation state), because it was cretaed only after the French Revolution. Though its questionable wether Padania would be a valid country, Celtic Tiger obviously means that the north of Italy has always been more central European, than it has been a part of the Mediterranean. But this subforum is for physical anthropology, not for discussing Padania or Italy.

all star
Thursday, August 11th, 2005, 01:24 AM
It is debatable that Italy is a valid country (as in nation state), because it was cretaed only after the French Revolution. Though its questionable wether Padania would be a valid country, Celtic Tiger obviously means that the north of Italy has always been more central European, than it has been a part of the Mediterranean. But this subforum is for physical anthropology, not for discussing Padania or Italy.

Well he should not have injected the whole North south thing in the first place.
Since when has Italy ever been questioned by any nation if it is a valid country,what do you do , make your own international laws.

Italian culture is both North and South, so stop this hair splitting about Italy, this is old hat and the majority of people in Italy do not see Italy as a split nation, they have one Government for both North and South.

morfrain_encilgar
Thursday, August 11th, 2005, 01:38 AM
Well he should not have injected the whole North south thing in the first place.

Celtic Tiger's purpose in posting this was to discuss Northern Italy (the Po river, and all the valley around) as the southern region of Central Europe. Its racial heritage is seperate from that of the rest of Italy so this is why he mentioned the differences between the north and the south of Italy. If you find a members post to be off-topic report it so that the staff can decide.

dazed&confused
Thursday, August 11th, 2005, 03:29 AM
the subracial variability among Italians is just the tip of the iceberg. Linguistic differences are important too.

Piedmontese: A l'è mej 'n' euv ancheuj che na galin a dumàn
Standard italian: Meglio un uovo oggi che una gallina domani
Sicilian: Megghiu uoji n'ovu ca rumani a jaddina

Standard italian is based at 95% on tuscanian dialect

there are also significant genetic differences. Basically, northern Italians, central Italians and southern Italians have different ancestors.

all star
Thursday, August 11th, 2005, 01:59 PM
the subracial variability among Italians is just the tip of the iceberg. Linguistic differences are important too

Their is varibility in all the countrys of Europe, not all Englishmen have the same phenotype,their are Germans with blue eyes and blond, and in other parts of Germany you have germans who are not as fair etc




there are also significant genetic differences. Basically, northern Italians, central Italians and southern Italians have different ancestors.

You can't put regions of Italy all into one stereotype, my grandparents came from Southern Italy, and myself, my grandparents and mother are fair skinned and blue and green eyes run in my family.

all star
Thursday, August 11th, 2005, 02:09 PM
beside the North-South issue, I do like the pictures celtic tiger posted.

all star
Thursday, August 11th, 2005, 02:12 PM
Celtic Tiger's purpose in posting this was to discuss Northern Italy (the Po river, and all the valley around) as the southern region of Central Europe. Its racial heritage is seperate from that of the rest of Italy so this is why he mentioned the differences between the north and the south of Italy. If you find a members post to be off-topic report it so that the staff can decide.

I have no problem with this thread.

Here
Sunday, February 19th, 2006, 07:45 PM
:D !!Hello Celtic tiger!! my granfathers are of Nort of Italy.The granfaher of my father are from a little town near Genova city and his wife too.:)
And for mother side too exept i dont know the place rigth.:(
I think my folk is the lombardo o langbardtten . ¿What you think about this?
So long and racial greetings!!!:thumbup


It's funny how many Argentines I find in the threads about Italy. I have yet to know an Argetine without Italian blood, it's a lot more easier find an Argentinian without Spanish or German blood (the other common ethnic groups) than without Italian. I was looking at the pictures and like all of them look regular Argentnes to me, well Valeria Mazza and Gabriel Batistuta are in fact Argentines lol.

Most of the immigration to Argentina come from Piedmont, Torino and Trentino. Who of those people are from that regions? I'm interested! :thumbup

Bredi
Sunday, March 12th, 2006, 09:54 AM
This is Serena Autieri, and is from Naples! :P (She also has began as theater actress in Naples, than on the soap "Un posto al sole", and THEN she's gone to north to work). I've personally seen her sometimes in the summer in Ischia.

Why you've said that she's North Italian?

http://www.claudiocaprara.it/archives/Serena%20Autieri07.jpg
http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serena_Autieri

Because supports the "Lega Nord"? Or why she' ve got blue eyes and blond hair? But in South-Italy there are many of blue-eyed and blonde-haired, and also all colours with all possibly conbinations!!! Only, we've not notice that! And, I 've never seen in North-Italy any difference.

How you think to distinguish easily from Italy Northern-Southern phisically? When there are thousands of immigrations from south to north (and, in the past, viceversa?)
And generally, how you think to deduce the "race" of a people (millions of individuals) from a few samples? (and, other samples? bonolis is from Rome, or not?)

Excuse my very bad English

This was too much:thumbdown

Weltfaschist
Sunday, March 12th, 2006, 03:56 PM
I say it everytime. Italy is a mix like all the other European Nations, from all subraces and predominantly mediterranid. You can find all subraces in Italy, and also in the south. I know a lot of Italian Comrades, who looking more Nordish, than a lot of my german Comrades. Why do you talking about that?
Never mind. Italy is a great aryan european Country and that is a fact.

All Italian Comrades from South to North must fight together for Italy and for a white Europe.

dazed&confused
Sunday, March 12th, 2006, 04:09 PM
But in South-Italy there are many of blue-eyed and blonde-haired, and also all colours with all possibly conbinations!!!
I'm aware of that.


How you think to distinguish easily from Italy Northern-Southern phisically? When there are thousands of immigrations from south to north (and, in the past, viceversa?)

you must distinguish casistic from statistic. and there were no mass migrations in the past. genetic tests confirm it.
anyway, the topic was about indigenous population of N.Italy.

Here
Tuesday, March 14th, 2006, 06:33 PM
Of course. For me it's an obvious thing, Paladin, but i imagine that for many strangers like you isn't the same. Italian immigration in the world in the last century was mostly form southern Italy (classic or south-Med in the majority), therefore , people from U.S.A. , Australia, South-Africa and Germany, to make some examples, usually sterotype italian people like Mediterraneans ,both culturally and racially. It's wrong.

By the way, not all agree on the fact that north Italy is really Italy. Some, here where i live, use the term "Padania".................
True except in Argentina where more than half of the immigration was from the North. That people you posted look so familiar and average to me. As another Argentinian already said here. That's why I don't understood when I was a child why Italians in American movies were as dark. Because there some dark Itlaians in Argentina like 30% of the Italians come from there, but most of them look a lot different. In fact, I would say they look closer to Southern Germans than to Southern Italians, most of the times, but there are very pale Italians all over Italy anyway.

But I know lots of people of Nort Italian and Southern German (Germans from Bavaria where the most numerous in Argentina), and they look very similar.

BTW, does anyone know why so many people of North Italian have many freckles specially woman over their shoulders and some on their faces, with pale skin, and with green, blue or light brown eyes. And blonde or redish brown hair. that's so common in Argentina in girls of North Italian ancestry, and most of them don't have Irish blood that explain that kind of skin. Besides, I don't see it in girls of German backgroud, for example.

Does anyone know that? Any Italian maybe? Is that so common as I see it here in Buenos Aires?

Theudiskaz
Tuesday, March 14th, 2006, 06:53 PM
When I was in Capri, Italy three summers ago, on a trip with my Latin class, I remeber meeting I very tall, blonde-haired, blue-eyed nordid-looking man. One of the kids in my group was trying to obtain some illegal substances from him. I'm not sure whether he was an ethnic Italian or whether he was from northern Europe, just working there for the summer. He could have been a descendent of the Normans I suppose.

RedJack
Tuesday, March 14th, 2006, 10:57 PM
http://tinypic.com/9sc4u1.jpg


Who is this sweetheart and when can we expect some pics of her to appear in the realm of the senses?

Herac
Monday, March 20th, 2006, 12:25 AM
In Argentina there's a few people who is southern Italian.

I think Brazil is the only country who has received only northern italian immigration - specially Venetian, a full majority here.

I am a representative of the "northern-italian" community here. I was raised inside a venetian culture, my fathers and grandfathers speak venetian, my whole ancestry is from SudTirol, Veneto and Lombardia (some oooold Bavarian blood here too) and I live in the biggest italo-brazilian city, with 500.000 inhabitants (circa 65% venetian).

Basically the phenotypical elements from in North-Italy can be found here:
http://archive.laprensa.com.sv/20021215/fama/ffam14122002arcxux01.jpg (Xuxa Meneghel)
http://models.com/oftheminute/archives/images/carolineb-t-2-3-.gif (Caroline Trentini)
http://www.terra.com.br/istoegente/159/fotos/celebridade_01.jpg (Bruna Lombardi)
http://www.rocknews-2003.blogger.com.br/Daniela%20Cicarelli%202.jpg (Daniella Cicarelli)

Just some examples. There are many more.

And for those who enjoy football (like me), I present you Luis Felipe Scolari, Felipão :D (he was born in the same city I was born, raised in the city I am living now and the brother of my granfather was his coach when he was younger hahahaha):
http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/40414000/jpg/_40414989_scolari203.jpg
http://www.gardenal.org/balipodo/archives/Felipao%203.jpg
http://ale.aquino.sites.uol.com.br/felipao2.jpg

He's considered a phenotypical stereotipe of italo-brazilians.

Jäger
Monday, March 20th, 2006, 09:15 AM
Basically the phenotypical elements from in North-Italy can be found here
:D It's a nice selection, but North Italy doesn't look like this, I have been there like 2000 times :P
So calling them phenotypical is a bit far fetched. The Atlanto-Med element is far more present.

Huzar
Monday, March 20th, 2006, 09:27 AM
:D It's a nice selection, but North Italy doesn't look like this, I have been there like 2000 times :P
So calling them phenotypical is a bit far fetched. The Atlanto-Med element is far more present.



Jager, with all due respect, i could say that the major part of pics of german people i've seen on this site are rather well selected to show a greater nordic dominance, in Germany, than in the reality................;) :P


My pics aren't particularly selected, and rapresent enough, my country.

Weltfaschist
Monday, March 20th, 2006, 09:31 AM
Just some examples. There are many more.



These Examples can you find also in South-Italy (Sicily), of course not so often like in Norh-Italy. There is a big mixture with Nordid and mediterranid subraces in Italy. That is the reason why the people in Italy looks so different.
the same Mixture can you find somewhere in France.

Weltfaschist
Monday, March 20th, 2006, 09:40 AM
@ Huzar

Thats right. In Germany we have many People who want to present, that Germany have the same nordid Dominance like Sweden. But that is shure not the reality and much overstated.

Jäger
Monday, March 20th, 2006, 10:03 AM
Jager, with all due respect, i could say that the major part of pics of german people i've seen on this site are rather well selected to show a greater nordic dominance, in Germany, than in the reality. That might be true. So now that makes it right or what?
In this thread anthropolgistic resarch would be far more helpfull than some people showing some selected pcitures, and calling them typical. :)

Huzar
Monday, March 20th, 2006, 10:26 AM
That might be true. So now that makes it right or what?
In this thread anthropolgistic resarch would be far more helpfull than some people showing some selected pcitures, and calling them typical. :)



My pics are less selected than you think.


Well, to add another kind of example/comparation, once i visited north-estern part of my country (VENETO) then i moved toward Innsbruck in Austria ; well, the somatic look of the native population was almost the same...............

Jäger
Monday, March 20th, 2006, 12:29 PM
My pics are less selected than you think.
I was talking to Herac actually.

Gesta Bellica
Monday, March 20th, 2006, 03:56 PM
:D It's a nice selection, but North Italy doesn't look like this, I have been there like 2000 times :P
So calling them phenotypical is a bit far fetched. The Atlanto-Med element is far more present.

In Northern Italy there are many Southern Italians immigrants, expecially in big/medium size towns.
It's not easy for a foreigner to care and consider about what kind of Italian he is really meeting in his travels..

Jäger
Monday, March 20th, 2006, 05:09 PM
In Northern Italy there are many Southern Italians immigrants, expecially in big/medium size towns.
It's not easy for a foreigner to care and consider about what kind of Italian he is really meeting in his travels..
Fair enough, I actually think Huzars collecion is pretty good, and he shares his experience, I trust that to an extent :P

Anyway, there are many great Italiens the best of them all would be him
http://www.welovebudandterence.com/images/biog_bud_spencer.jpg

Weltfaschist
Monday, March 20th, 2006, 08:16 PM
And the most beautiful Girl from Italy is She :)

http://hqp.free.fr/alyssa/me182@Alyssa_Milano_005.jpg

Galaico
Monday, March 20th, 2006, 10:33 PM
And the most beautiful Girl from Italy is She :)

http://hqp.free.fr/alyssa/me182@Alyssa_Milano_005.jpg


I had no idea you liked her... ;)

I also think she's absolutely gorgeous.

Herac
Monday, March 20th, 2006, 11:00 PM
Well, to add another kind of example/comparation, once i visited north-estern part of my country (VENETO) then i moved toward Innsbruck in Austria ; well, the somatic look of the native population was almost the same...............

Indeed. I really can't differ people of venetian ancestry and of austrian ancestry here. Veneto once had a mass migration of bavarians and austrians, that's why we found so much common elements on these two nations.


:D It's a nice selection, but North Italy doesn't look like this, I have been there like 2000 times :P
So calling them phenotypical is a bit far fetched. The Atlanto-Med element is far more present.

I just choose the first women I remembered, some famous ones. It was not give the impression that "northern-italian-brazilians" are lighter or something. You walk in the streets of my neighbourhood and you see those elements; you go to little towns here in the mountains and you see girls with that face.

I don't know really why, but people here of venetian ancestry looks like that. But I agree that the atlantid element is more present, for sure.

In the attachment, you can see a pic of 4 ex-classmates of mine in our graduation. These four girls are of venetian ancestry (from left to right: surname Baroni, Borghetti, Biazus and Pilau).

I've dated with them once, the four (obviously one by one, considering I've studied with them during 5 years, it's not that much... and I'm not don Juan yet :D).

Here
Tuesday, March 21st, 2006, 03:04 AM
Indeed. I really can't differ people of venetian ancestry and of austrian ancestry here. Veneto once had a mass migration of bavarians and austrians, that's why we found so much common elements on these two nations.



I just choose the first women I remembered, some famous ones. It was not give the impression that "northern-italian-brazilians" are lighter or something. You walk in the streets of my neighbourhood and you see those elements; you go to little towns here in the mountains and you see girls with that face.

I don't know really why, but people here of venetian ancestry looks like that. But I agree that the atlantid element is more present, for sure.

In the attachment, you can see a pic of 4 ex-classmates of mine in our graduation. These four girls are of venetian ancestry (from left to right: surname Baroni, Borghetti, Biazus and Pilau).

I've dated with them once, the four (obviously one by one, considering I've studied with them during 5 years, it's not that much... and I'm not don Juan yet :D).



IMO, Argentinian most important heritage is Italian, and for what I've seen here some North Italian descendents look a lot like the persons of Southern German ancestry.

As for the people of Southern Italian heritage, some look extremely mediterranean, but there are some that look like many Northern Italians. With an obvious Alpine and Nordid influence.

That's what I see, in Buenos Aires, the city with the most Italian influence in the world outside of Italy, so I think I can give my humble opinion. ;)

dazed&confused
Tuesday, March 21st, 2006, 11:47 PM
In Northern Italy there are many Southern Italians immigrants, expecially in big/medium size towns.
It's not easy for a foreigner to care and consider about what kind of Italian he is really meeting in his travels..
if you see people looking like this guy in Milan, they are most likely of southern descent

http://www.federicomancosu.com/forfun/foto2/Diego_Abatantuono.jpg


Anyway, there are many great Italiens the best of them all would be him
http://www.welovebudandterence.com/images/biog_bud_spencer.jpg

although born in Naples, that actor is surprisingly of northern origin, or at least, his surname is.

Here
Tuesday, March 21st, 2006, 11:57 PM
if you see people looking like this guy in Milan, they are most likely of southern descent

http://www.federicomancosu.com/forfun/foto2/Diego_Abatantuono.jpg



although born in Naples, that actor is surprisingly of northern origin, or at least, his surname is.


What surnames are Southern Italian and which ones Northern Italian?


Just asking because half of the surnames in Buenos Aires are Italian but I don't know the relation between the different types and the regions. Except that surnames like Palermo, Trapani, Milano are obviously from there lol.

I have some in my family too (what Argentine doesn't lol).

:D :D ;)

Gil
Wednesday, March 22nd, 2006, 01:51 AM
And the most beautiful Girl from Italy is She :)

http://hqp.free.fr/alyssa/me182@Alyssa_Milano_005.jpg


Allow me to disagree:

http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/5177/mok0tn.jpg
;)

Herac
Wednesday, March 22nd, 2006, 06:23 AM
Allow me to disagree:

http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/5177/mok0tn.jpg
;)

Well, Monica Bellucci is hour concours... :P~

Weltfaschist
Wednesday, March 22nd, 2006, 07:19 AM
Lets make a Thread with a Poll about the most beautiful Italian or South-European Woman:)

I am shure that Alyssa will win:P

Gesta Bellica
Wednesday, March 22nd, 2006, 09:12 AM
Indeed. I really can't differ people of venetian ancestry and of austrian ancestry here. Veneto once had a mass migration of bavarians and austrians, that's why we found so much common elements on these two nations.



I just choose the first women I remembered, some famous ones. It was not give the impression that "northern-italian-brazilians" are lighter or something. You walk in the streets of my neighbourhood and you see those elements; you go to little towns here in the mountains and you see girls with that face.

I don't know really why, but people here of venetian ancestry looks like that. But I agree that the atlantid element is more present, for sure.

In the attachment, you can see a pic of 4 ex-classmates of mine in our graduation. These four girls are of venetian ancestry (from left to right: surname Baroni, Borghetti, Biazus and Pilau).

I've dated with them once, the four (obviously one by one, considering I've studied with them during 5 years, it's not that much... and I'm not don Juan yet :D).


Hey guy, i was writing harsh words about the situation in (Northern) Brazil but if the South looks like that i would really love to come back in your country...
Can you suggest me some cities where people are in the biggest majority of European heritage?

Thanx ;)

Gesta Bellica
Wednesday, March 22nd, 2006, 09:15 AM
What surnames are Southern Italian and which ones Northern Italian?


Just asking because half of the surnames in Buenos Aires are Italian but I don't know the relation between the different types and the regions. Except that surnames like Palermo, Trapani, Milano are obviously from there lol.

I have some in my family too (what Argentine doesn't lol).

:D :D ;)

Give us some example of Italian surnames and we will tell you which ones are typically Northern or Southern Italians and which ones are spread nationwide :)
By the way.. in Italy people think that people that have a surname with the name of a city (like the ones you mentioned) have jewish origins..because Italian jews used to identify themselves with the city community of residence

Jäger
Wednesday, March 22nd, 2006, 10:03 AM
IYou walk in the streets of my neighbourhood and you see those elements; I don't doubt there can be people like these, I just think calling them typical was a bit far fetched, as far as it goes for northern italy at least. :)
Maybe some selected regions?
Anyway, it contradicts my experience, I would like to read some more though :)

Here
Wednesday, March 22nd, 2006, 11:42 AM
Give us some example of Italian surnames and we will tell you which ones are typically Northern or Southern Italians and which ones are spread nationwide :)
By the way.. in Italy people think that people that have a surname with the name of a city (like the ones you mentioned) have jewish origins..because Italian jews used to identify themselves with the city community of residence


Really? I didn't know that. Anyway, good date!. Ok, I gotta go in 10 minutes but I guess I could give a list of all the surnames that come to my mind in this moment, I'll add a few more when I come back:

Let's see:

Zampini, Santaniello, Frisone, Repetto, Brunetti, Benedetto, Cardinalli, Apreda, Giancarlo, Ricci (such a common surname here), Rughetti, Brusoni, Valletta, Fatinelli, Rugeri, Dal Colleto, Di Vicenzo, Merello, Vacarezza, Buzzi, Pricitelli, Romano (another common surname), Gaetani, Fabbris, Fabiani, Sanguinetti, Dello Staffolo, De Micelli, Landini, Fenoglio, Ferrari, Mazarello, Falconi, Durante and Ferrari Ferraro (so common surnames here too), Martinelli... and the list go on an on...

Gesta Bellica
Wednesday, March 22nd, 2006, 01:07 PM
Really? I didn't know that. Anyway, good date!. Ok, I gotta go in 10 minutes but I guess I could give a list of all the surnames that come to my mind in this moment, I'll add a few more when I come back:

Let's see:

Zampini, Santaniello, Frisone, Repetto, Brunetti, Benedetto, Cardinalli, Apreda, Giancarlo, Ricci (such a common surname here), Rughetti, Brusoni, Valletta, Fatinelli, Rugeri, Dal Colleto, Di Vicenzo, Merello, Vacarezza, Buzzi, Pricitelli, Romano (another common surname), Gaetani, Fabbris, Fabiani, Sanguinetti, Dello Staffolo, De Micelli, Landini, Fenoglio, Ferrari, Mazarello, Falconi, Durante and Ferrari Ferraro (so common surnames here too), Martinelli... and the list go on an on...

ok.. Repetto (really common in Genoa and Liguria), Fenoglio, Fabbris (both from Piedmont? some other Skadi member can be more accurate), Merello, Frisone, Brusoni, Dal Colleto, Dello Staffolo (the latter 2 seems Venetan) looks from Northern Italy.

Ferrari is most common in north-central Italy, excluded ?iedmont where Ferrero takes its place.. the southern variant is Ferrara. The ethimology of this family name is the same as the english "Smith".

Zampini, Buzzi, Brunetti and Martinelli are quite uncertain, they can be from everywhere in Italy

Landini and Fabiani look like Central Italian

Santaniello (from around Naples?), Cardinalli, Apreda, Giancarlo, Ricci (really common in Southern Italy) Rughetti, Valletta, Fatinelli, Rugeri, Di Vicenzo, Vacarezza, Pricitelli, Romano (really common too) Gaetani, Sanguinetti, De Micelli (Calabria?), Mazarello, Durante looks definitely Southern Italian

Huzar
Wednesday, March 22nd, 2006, 01:47 PM
I don't doubt there can be people like these, I just think calling them typical was a bit far fetched, as far as it goes for northern italy at least. :)
Maybe some selected regions?
Anyway, it contradicts my experience, I would like to read some more though :)


Jag, i don't dubt of your experience, but i suspect you aren't a good observer : i mean, perhaps your observer capability is biased by some psycological factors : for example, what you expect to see (unconsciously). It's a common phenomenon ; the major part of german people, like you, associate instinctively the word "Italy" to a distinct Mediterranean southern european scenario, latin culture and , very often, a precise somatic look, without any distinction between north and south. Therefore, when a german turist visits Italy, his perception can be slightly altered by his previous unconscious stereotypes.............this is my personal impression, at least. Could be a fascinating subject of conversation, i think.


Anyway, to be clearer, what's , exactly, your personal impression of northern Italy ? When you say that examples reported aren't objective, what you mean ? Tell us what you see objectively (or subjectively?) from your perspective...................

dazed&confused
Wednesday, March 22nd, 2006, 06:34 PM
What surnames are Southern Italian and which ones Northern Italian?

http://gens.labo.net/it/cognomi/genera.html (to take with "benefit of inventory")


Santaniello (from around Naples?), Cardinalli, Apreda, Giancarlo, Ricci (really common in Southern Italy) Rughetti, Valletta, Fatinelli, Rugeri, Di Vicenzo, Vacarezza, Pricitelli, Romano (really common too) Gaetani, Sanguinetti, De Micelli (Calabria?), Mazarello, Durante looks definitely Southern Italian
Ricci and Romano are pan-italian.

Here
Wednesday, March 22nd, 2006, 07:04 PM
ok.. Repetto (really common in Genoa and Liguria), Fenoglio, Fabbris (both from Piedmont? some other Skadi member can be more accurate), Merello, Frisone, Brusoni, Dal Colleto, Dello Staffolo (the latter 2 seems Venetan) looks from Northern Italy.


Zampini, Buzzi, Brunetti and Martinelli are quite uncertain, they can be from everywhere in Italy

Landini and Fabiani look like Central Italian

Santaniello (from around Naples?), Cardinalli, Apreda, Giancarlo, Ricci (really common in Southern Italy) Rughetti, Valletta, Fatinelli, Rugeri, Di Vicenzo, Vacarezza, Pricitelli, Romano (really common too) Gaetani, Sanguinetti, De Micelli (Calabria?), Mazarello, Durante looks definitely Southern Italian


Great dates! Really, I post some surnames of people I know, and now I know better their origins. Tho they all live together and peacefully in Buenos Aires. ;) . Without division lol, even when Buenos AIres is a litlle more North Italian. What about Brunetti is quite uncertain but what about Brunetto? and Frisone?


Ferrari is most common in north-central Italy, excluded ?iedmont where Ferrero takes its place.. the southern variant is Ferrara. The ethimology of this family name is the same as the english "Smith".

Ferrari and Ferrero are way common in Argentina, and now I know why. Many people came from Piedmont. Smith is an incredibly common name in UK, and even here where the English immigration wasn't too large, you can find a couple of hundreds in the telephonic guide of your city.

Gesta Bellica
Thursday, March 23rd, 2006, 07:26 AM
http://gens.labo.net/it/cognomi/genera.html (to take with "benefit of inventory")


Ricci and Romano are pan-italian.

hmm sorry but i beg to differ..
Now they look pan-italian but mostly because of internal migrations.
if you search Russo in that website you will have the same situation but Russo is the southern Italian version for Rossi..now it's widespread also in the North expecially in Lombardy but there's now way that one of them was there prior to 1945

Gesta Bellica
Thursday, March 23rd, 2006, 07:34 AM
Great dates! Really, I post some surnames of people I know, and now I know better their origins. Tho they all live together and peacefully in Buenos Aires. ;) . Without division lol, even when Buenos AIres is a litlle more North Italian. What about Brunetti is quite uncertain but what about Brunetto? and Frisone?


Ferrari is most common in north-central Italy, excluded ?iedmont where Ferrero takes its place.. the southern variant is Ferrara. The ethimology of this family name is the same as the english "Smith".

Ferrari and Ferrero are way common in Argentina, and now I know why. Many people came from Piedmont. Smith is an incredibly common name in UK, and even here where the English immigration wasn't too large, you can find a couple of hundreds in the telephonic guide of your city.

Ah i can imagine that in Buenos Aires you can find everything nowadays.. just like in Milan ;)

Brunetto and Frisone looks more like Northern Italian than anything else...
Moreover many surnames are used both in the North and in the South but most common in one part of the country rather than in the other..

Another interesting thing is that some surnames sound similar to some dialect words, that's a good proof of their origins.

dazed&confused
Thursday, March 23rd, 2006, 08:05 AM
Now they look pan-italian but mostly because of internal migrations.

Sergio Romano isn't southern for sure. In his biography he describes accurately his family tree and he doesn't mention any southern roots.
Ricci appears to be too common in Emilia, low Piedmont and Lombardy not to be "non autochthonous" in those places.
I guess there are even some 'Russo' among indigenous northern surnames

Herac
Thursday, March 23rd, 2006, 08:19 AM
Hey guy, i was writing harsh words about the situation in (Northern) Brazil but if the South looks like that i would really love to come back in your country...
Can you suggest me some cities where people are in the biggest majority of European heritage?

Thanx ;)

Ahh, but northern Brazil is indeed a terrible place! As a matter of fact, Brazil is not even a country, it's more like a poor and ridiculous imperium, with many countries inside of it (the dark vast north, the light deep south, f.e.).

Well, I live in the biggest city of the venetian colonies here, called Caxias do Sul (500.000 inhabitants and perhaps some 400.000 venets). Until the 80's 90% of the city was completely venetian, but now we have a lot of migration from mongrel zones and... well... you know what happens.

Cities you must visit here: Gramado, Canela, Nova Petrópolis, Montauri (became famous because their census was "100% white" and the children didn't speak portuguese, but Talian dialect), Veranópolis, Nova Milano, Nova Padova, Nova Trento, Nova Bassano, Nova Roma, Garibaldi and Carlos Barbosa. I had a friend from Padova who came to these cities and he told me "he felt in home".

http://www.carlosbarbosa.rs.gov.br/fotos/g_orquestra.jpg <-- a random pic from the Carlos Barbosa orchestra. Look the people's faces.


I don't doubt there can be people like these, I just think calling them typical was a bit far fetched, as far as it goes for northern italy at least.
Maybe some selected regions?
Anyway, it contradicts my experience, I would like to read some more though

I agree, my post seemed to show some irreal stuff, but didn't showed. I can post here pics from other people here, and they will look near like that anyway. South Brazil it's a region that for many years (since 1875) "italians" just married "italians", and this works like a guarantee about the 'purity' of the people here (well... that time Italy was nothing more than an idea). There wasn't southern italian immigration to south Brazil (zero, none, nothing, not-even-a-couple), and these folks, isolated in the mountains and in the countryside, preserved very well their (our) integral heritage.

It's clearly different from the italian-americans, for example, tooooo much different.

Gesta Bellica
Thursday, March 23rd, 2006, 08:35 AM
Sergio Romano isn't southern for sure. In his biography he describes accurately his family tree and he doesn't mention any southern roots.
Ricci appears to be too common in Emilia, low Piedmont and Lombardy not to be "non autochthonous" in those places.
I guess there are even some 'Russo' among indigenous northern surnames

Everything is possible, but surely Romano and Russo are typically from southern Italy.
Romano is a typical family name around Naples and other southern part, all the people with such a surname had origins from there.

Exceptions can always exist..but you never know too much about them
I had a co-worker in Milano with a clearly southern Italian surname (Orlando) but she claimed that all her 4 grandparents were Milanese..i was really curious so i asked more infos and after some talks she admitted that one of his ancestors came to Milano around the 1600' from Aversa..then almost 400 years ago, but still doesn't make her family name less southern..

I become really suspicious when a surname appears really common around Milano/Torino and in the south too..usually it indicates that it cames up North with the post WWII migrations

Gesta Bellica
Thursday, March 23rd, 2006, 08:40 AM
Ahh, but northern Brazil is indeed a terrible place! As a matter of fact, Brazil is not even a country, it's more like a poor and ridiculous imperium, with many countries inside of it (the dark vast north, the light deep south, f.e.).

Well, I live in the biggest city of the venetian colonies here, called Caxias do Sul (500.000 inhabitants and perhaps some 400.000 venets). Until the 80's 90% of the city was completely venetian, but now we have a lot of migration from mongrel zones and... well... you know what happens.

Cities you must visit here: Gramado, Canela, Nova Petrópolis, Montauri (became famous because their census was "100% white" and the children didn't speak portuguese, but Talian dialect), Veranópolis, Nova Milano, Nova Padova, Nova Trento, Nova Bassano, Nova Roma, Garibaldi and Carlos Barbosa. I had a friend from Padova who came to these cities and he told me "he felt in home".

http://www.carlosbarbosa.rs.gov.br/fotos/g_orquestra.jpg <-- a random pic from the Carlos Barbosa orchestra. Look the people's faces.


Impressive photo.. looks like it was taken in Veneto indeed :)

Thanx for the precious infos..
I would really love to visit such places.. and what about Florianopolis and Blumenau? Are they any decent or now they are degenerated too??

dazed&confused
Thursday, March 23rd, 2006, 06:24 PM
Everything is possible, but surely Romano and Russo are typically from southern Italy.
Romano is a typical family name around Naples and other southern part, all the people with such a surname had origins from there.

Exceptions can always exist..but you never know too much about them
I had a co-worker in Milano with a clearly southern Italian surname (Orlando) but she claimed that all her 4 grandparents were Milanese..i was really curious so i asked more infos and after some talks she admitted that one of his ancestors came to Milano around the 1600' from Aversa..then almost 400 years ago, but still doesn't make her family name less southern..

I become really suspicious when a surname appears really common around Milano/Torino and in the south too..usually it indicates that it cames up North with the post WWII migrations

in a probabilistic approach that's right. but casistics always contemplate exceptions.
my neighbour is 'Platino', which appears to be Sardinian but he has no memory of sardinian ancestry. It's way more probable his original surname was 'Platini' (rather common here) and his forefathers screwed it.
A surname might originate in a certain area in a very restricted number and at the same time might originate in a whole different area but in a very larger quantity. that does not imply the two surnames are someway related. May be the exception that confirms the rule, but anyway
exceptions are still possible.

Herac
Thursday, March 23rd, 2006, 08:38 PM
Impressive photo.. looks like it was taken in Veneto indeed :)

Thanx for the precious infos..
I would really love to visit such places.. and what about Florianopolis and Blumenau? Are they any decent or now they are degenerated too??

;)

Blumenau is a good and german city. There's a huge and famous Oktoberfest there. Florianopolis has beautiful beaches and nature - the city is good also. It was founded by people from the Açores' island, it's an universitarian and touristic island, so there you can find all kinds of people (including all kinds of euros).

An advice: if you want to visit a tropical place and find decent people, don't go to northern Brazil. :thumbup

Gesta Bellica
Thursday, March 23rd, 2006, 10:23 PM
in a probabilistic approach that's right. but casistics always contemplate exceptions.
my neighbour is 'Platino', which appears to be Sardinian but he has no memory of sardinian ancestry. It's way more probable his original surname was 'Platini' (rather common here) and his forefathers screwed it.
A surname might originate in a certain area in a very restricted number and at the same time might originate in a whole different area but in a very larger quantity. that does not imply the two surnames are someway related. May be the exception that confirms the rule, but anyway
exceptions are still possible.

That's true...we are saying the same thing as i can see ;)

just my 2 cents:
even if the Russo case is pretty typical as the Northern counterpart exists (Rossi and the like..) so i would drop out the chance that it can be somehow autoctone also in the North..while Romano doesn't have a clear Northern counterpart.
There are some special surnames where you can't be wrong like Capuozzo, Esposito, Borriello etc and some other that leaves room to uncertainty:)

We can never be sure at 100% also because of distortions or intentional surname change, that's true.. but those alternate versions are somehow "artificial" in my opinion..if tomorrow i change my family name and i become "Piras" this doesn't make my new family name "Lombard" as much as an adopted black person is not "Lombard" in the same way..i hope you got my point..

The website you posted is really good for general speculation, isn't it based on surnames found of white page phone lists?

Gesta Bellica
Thursday, March 23rd, 2006, 10:27 PM
;)

Blumenau is a good and german city. There's a huge and famous Oktoberfest there. Florianopolis has beautiful beaches and nature - the city is good also. It was founded by people from the Açores' island, it's an universitarian and touristic island, so there you can find all kinds of people (including all kinds of euros).

An advice: if you want to visit a tropical place and find decent people, don't go to northern Brazil. :thumbup

Thanx for the infos :)
and those 2 cities are still decent or they degenerated into a melting pot too?
About Northern Brazil, well i hoped to find still some people with european heritage, Portugueses maybe..but after all i think it's always interesting to see behind enemy's line sometimes.
Next time i'll touch South America it will definitely be South Brazil or Argentina :)

Here
Thursday, March 23rd, 2006, 11:32 PM
Thanx for the infos :)
and those 2 cities are still decent or they degenerated into a melting pot too?
About Northern Brazil, well i hoped to find still some people with european heritage, Portugueses maybe..but after all i think it's always interesting to see behind enemy's line sometimes.
Next time i'll touch South America it will definitely be South Brazil or Argentina :)

Do you know Argentina? You should come to Buenos Aires. ;)

Here
Thursday, March 23rd, 2006, 11:53 PM
Ah i can imagine that in Buenos Aires you can find everything nowadays.. just like in Milan ;)

Brunetto and Frisone looks more like Northern Italian than anything else...
Moreover many surnames are used both in the North and in the South but most common in one part of the country rather than in the other..

Another interesting thing is that some surnames sound similar to some dialect words, that's a good proof of their origins.

Thanks, one of that surnames is in my family (and yes my great-parents were from North Italy from Piedmont).

And the other one is of a friend of mine.

:thumbup

Herac
Friday, March 24th, 2006, 12:01 AM
Thanx for the infos :)
and those 2 cities are still decent or they degenerated into a melting pot too?
About Northern Brazil, well i hoped to find still some people with european heritage, Portugueses maybe..but after all i think it's always interesting to see behind enemy's line sometimes.
Next time i'll touch South America it will definitely be South Brazil or Argentina :)

Not yet, not yet! If you want to see people of european heritage, you will certainly find lots and lots of them here in the south.

In Brazil, the natural order will be turn all cities into melting pots. We, euros, must turn back to europe or isolate ourselves in closed communities... :(

Europe is going throught the same direction, I think... the whole world is marching towards mixing.

Gesta Bellica
Friday, March 24th, 2006, 07:33 AM
Thanks, one of that surnames is in my family (and yes my great-parents were from North Italy from Piedmont).

And the other one is of a friend of mine.

:thumbup

Oh great, so my guessing was correct :)
Your heritage is 100% italian or you have also spanish (or else) ancestors?

I'd be really glad to visit Buenos Aires...along with some other cities of your country..it must be a great experience!

Gesta Bellica
Friday, March 24th, 2006, 07:37 AM
Not yet, not yet! If you want to see people of european heritage, you will certainly find lots and lots of them here in the south.

In Brazil, the natural order will be turn all cities into melting pots. We, euros, must turn back to europe or isolate ourselves in closed communities... :(

Europe is going throught the same direction, I think... the whole world is marching towards mixing.

you're right, when the situation will definitely go downhill in Brazil you will find no shelter in Europe because we are degenerating too..there's no safe place :(

But i'm glad to see that the situation is not so negative where you live! Somehow here in Italy we have some stereotypes in mind when we think about Brazil and many people forget about many Italians moved there..

RedJack
Friday, March 24th, 2006, 09:30 PM
Sgt. Rock here is a good example from Coon of a North Italian.



http://forums.skadi.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=54834&stc=1&d=1143236053

"A North Italian from Lombardy, who, although brunet in hair
color, conforms metrically and morphologically to the Borreby standard. He comes
from typically Alpine and Dinaric territory." Coon, The Races of Europe

Here
Friday, March 24th, 2006, 09:35 PM
Oh great, so my guessing was correct :)
Your heritage is 100% italian or you have also spanish (or else) ancestors?

I'd be really glad to visit Buenos Aires...along with some other cities of your country..it must be a great experience!

no, i'm also part Spanish (Galician), Irish and Swiss-French. I'm like 32,5% Italian (three great-grandparents ;) ).

Anyway, grow in Buenos Aires, be raise by an Italian grandparent, and speak Italian. Make you feel 100%. ;)


Italian is the most common heritage here. well, I guess you should know that I mean Bastituta, Veleria Mazza, Zanetti... and the list go on... What other Argentines are famous over there?

Weltfaschist
Friday, March 24th, 2006, 10:56 PM
When i visit South-Italy, i see a lot of Alpine or Dinaric Italians there. Of course, in the North are much more Nordic, dinaric, or Alpinid Italians. Sometimes i cant see any Difference between North-Italy or Austria;)

Here
Friday, March 24th, 2006, 11:37 PM
When i visit South-Italy, i see a lot of Alpine or Dinaric Italians there. Of course, in the North are much more Nordic, dinaric, or Alpinid Italians. Sometimes i cant see any Difference between North-Italy or Austria;)

That support my view that I don't see much difference between North Italians, Swiss and South German people here. ;)

Herac
Saturday, March 25th, 2006, 02:11 AM
That support my view that I don't see much difference between North Italians, Swiss and South German people here. ;)

Indeed. I think this way too. :thumbup

Gesta Bellica
Saturday, March 25th, 2006, 11:54 AM
no, i'm also part Spanish (Galician), Irish and Swiss-French. I'm like 32,5% Italian (three great-grandparents ;) ).

Anyway, grow in Buenos Aires, be raise by an Italian grandparent, and speak Italian. Make you feel 100%. ;)


Italian is the most common heritage here. well, I guess you should know that I mean Bastituta, Veleria Mazza, Zanetti... and the list go on... What other Argentines are famous over there?

Many many Argentinians are famous here, i remember for example in sports Diego Dominguez (rugby) and Manu Ginobili (Basketball)

Sometimes is just hard to remember their names because many of them look perfectly Italian and some even opted for Italian citizenship for their sport career.

But i always guessed that Spanish is the first heritage in Argentina and that Italian came only second..i was wrong?

Gesta Bellica
Saturday, March 25th, 2006, 12:06 PM
When i visit South-Italy, i see a lot of Alpine or Dinaric Italians there. Of course, in the North are much more Nordic, dinaric, or Alpinid Italians. Sometimes i cant see any Difference between North-Italy or Austria;)

I wouldn't go that far but..still it's amazing how sometimes people are proudly pro-Nordic and/or pro-Germanic and get upset while somebody criticizes them, but in the same time they are so arrogant to think they got the right to dismiss the differences between Northern and Southern Italians...

Here
Saturday, March 25th, 2006, 01:18 PM
I wouldn't go that far but..still it's amazing how sometimes people are proudly pro-Nordic and/or pro-Germanic and get upset while somebody criticizes them, but in the same time they are so arrogant to think they got the right to dismiss the differences between Northern and Southern Italians...

Nope, Argentinians are 30 million of those 10 million have Spanish heritage (mostly Baque and Galician) and 13 million Italian. After them, without a doubt come Germans.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_people

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italian_people#Italian_Diaspora


""Argentines are a fusion of groups of various national and ethnic origins, the most predominant of these being the descendants of Spanish (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spain) (settlers from both the colonial era and 19th and early 20th century), Italian (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italy) (19th and early 20th century) and German (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germany) (19th and early 20th century) immigrants.""

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Argentina

""The majority of immigrants, since the 19th century, came from Europe, mostly from Spain (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spain) and Italy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italy), but with a substantial influx of British (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Kingdom) and Germans (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germany). Also notable were Jewish immigrants escaping persecution. Between 1860 and 1930, newcomers from Spain and Italy countries accounted for 80% of the total immigration. [1] (http://alhim.revues.org/document57.html) The total population of Argentina rose from 4 million in 1895 to 7.9 million in 1914, and to 15.8 million in 1947; during this time the country was settled by 1.5 million Italians and 1.4 million Spaniards, as well as Poles (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poland), Russians (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russia), French (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/France) (more than 100,000 each), Germans, Portuguese (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portugal), Yugoslavians (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yugoslavia), Czechs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Czech_Republic), British, and people from many other countries.""


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immigration_in_Argentina



I hope it helps you. ;) Does it?

Gesta Bellica
Saturday, March 25th, 2006, 07:24 PM
Nope, Argentinians are 30 million of those 10 million have Spanish heritage (mostly Baque and Galician) and 13 million Italian. After them, without a doubt come Germans.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_people

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italian_people#Italian_Diaspora


""Argentines are a fusion of groups of various national and ethnic origins, the most predominant of these being the descendants of Spanish (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spain) (settlers from both the colonial era and 19th and early 20th century), Italian (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italy) (19th and early 20th century) and German (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germany) (19th and early 20th century) immigrants.""

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Argentina

""The majority of immigrants, since the 19th century, came from Europe, mostly from Spain (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spain) and Italy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italy), but with a substantial influx of British (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Kingdom) and Germans (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germany). Also notable were Jewish immigrants escaping persecution. Between 1860 and 1930, newcomers from Spain and Italy countries accounted for 80% of the total immigration. [1] (http://alhim.revues.org/document57.html) The total population of Argentina rose from 4 million in 1895 to 7.9 million in 1914, and to 15.8 million in 1947; during this time the country was settled by 1.5 million Italians and 1.4 million Spaniards, as well as Poles (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poland), Russians (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russia), French (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/France) (more than 100,000 each), Germans, Portuguese (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portugal), Yugoslavians (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yugoslavia), Czechs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Czech_Republic), British, and people from many other countries.""


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immigration_in_Argentina



I hope it helps you. ;) Does it?

it definitely does :D

so Italians emigrants in Argentina were more than Spaniards.. really interesting, thanx for the links!

Tyrsson
Thursday, June 22nd, 2006, 06:38 AM
http://tinypic.com/9sc4u1.jpg


Who is this sweetheart and when can we expect some pics of her to appear in the realm of the senses?

Yeh, who is she ?...... anyone?

Huzar
Thursday, June 22nd, 2006, 07:17 AM
Yeh, who is she ?...... anyone?


Another who falled in love...........?;) :P

Rotharit
Sunday, July 2nd, 2006, 08:28 PM
Yeh, who is she ?...... anyone?

She is Flavia Vento (born in Rome, if I recall correctly - this would make her more a central Italian than a northern one).

Euclides
Thursday, July 20th, 2006, 03:08 PM
Severino is tipically Napolitanian (S), but also found in Lombardia.(N)


SEVERINO

u Il cognome è tipicamente napoletano (Napoli e Boscoreale si contendono la frequenza percentuale più alta), ma è una variante della forma principale Severi, presente maggiormente nelle regioni del centro-nord: in Emilia Romagna e in Toscana. Il cognome origina dai nomi propri Severo e Severino ed è la prosecuzione del cognomen latino Severus (imperatori romani di origine africana). Il nome - proprio perché richiamava virtù di austerità e moderazione - venne ripreso in età cristiana e promosso dalla devozione ad alcuni santi, tra cui S. Severo, vescovo di Ravenna e S. Severino, eremita del V secolo sepolto a Napoli. Particolarmente venerati nell’Italia meridionale, questi santi divennero patroni di molte località che in seguito da loro presero il nome (S. Severo in provincia di Foggia e San Severino Rota in provincia di Salerno).


u É um sobrenome tipicamente napolitano (Nápoli e Boscoreale detêm a freqüência mais alta), mas é uma variação da forma principal Severi, presente principalmente nas regiões do centro-norte: na Emília Romanha e na Toscana. O sobrenome vem dos nomes próprios Severo e Severino, originários do latim Severus (imperadores romanos de origem africana). O nome - justamente por evocavar virtudes de austeridade e moderação - é retomado na era cristã, e promovido pela devoção a alguns santos, entre eles São Severo, bispo de Ravena, e São Severino, eremita do V século, sepultado em Nápoles. Particularmente venerados na Itália do Sul, estes santos tornazram-se padroeiros de muitos lugares que, em seguida, assumiram o nome (São Severo, na província de Fogia, e São Severino Rota, na província de Salerno).¥

http://www.insieme.com.br/portal/conteudo.php?sid=202&cid=707&parent=202

Gesta Bellica
Thursday, July 20th, 2006, 06:36 PM
Severino is tipically Napolitanian (S), but also found in Lombardia.(N)

pratically every southern Italian family name can be found in Lombardia (expecially around Milan) and to a lesser extent also in Piedmont near Turin
The reason is simple: southern Italian immigration

Euclides
Friday, July 21st, 2006, 01:16 PM
Bulgari is native from Lombardia, and their origins could be related to the Bulgarian settlement.

http://forums.skadi.net/showthread.php?t=11309


-------------------------------------------------------

Euclides
Friday, July 21st, 2006, 01:49 PM
also Noth-Italian surnames are Marchesini, Borgini and Venera: