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JŠnos Hunyadi
Saturday, July 23rd, 2005, 08:14 AM
I remember hearing a few times here that the Finno-Ugric Republic of Udmurtia had a rufosity rate of 14%. This would make them the most red-haired people in all of Europe. Is their any truth to this? If so does anybody have any pictures of red-haired Udmurts?

http://www.russiatrek.com/regions/udmurtia_l.gif

http://www.udmurt.ru/en/Reference/Udmurts.jpg

Gareth
Saturday, July 23rd, 2005, 11:33 AM
Finally a first indication why Eickstedt described rufosity to his unmixed East-Nordid type since red hair is quite uncommon in Scandinavia's Finland.

Good info.

Huzar
Saturday, July 23rd, 2005, 01:09 PM
I find particularly fascinating informations on ugro-finnic populations of Russia. To be sincere i have some information too from Biasutti (or better the information he reported from BUNAK). Perhaps i'll post them.

Irmin
Sunday, November 19th, 2006, 07:02 PM
It's a pity I do not have any pictures of my own, although I may report from my personal staying in Udmurtia higher frequence of rufosity among them. Attached picture I found on internet, it's from yearly Festival of Red-heads (Prazdnik Ryzhich), which takes place traditionaly in Izhevsk.

Oswiu
Sunday, November 19th, 2006, 11:23 PM
Herodotus tells of an enormous city, Gelonus (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gelonus), in the northern part of Scythia (4.108):
"The Budini are a large and powerful nation: they have all deep blue eyes, and bright red hair. There is a city in their territory, called Gelonus,

Someone's made it even more explicit on wikipedia;


A fragment by Xenophanes (http://www.reference.com/browse/wiki/Xenophanes) describes the Thracians (http://www.reference.com/browse/wiki/Thracians) as blue-eyed and red-haired, and Herodotus (http://www.reference.com/browse/wiki/Herodotus) described the "Budini (http://www.reference.com/browse/wiki/Budini)" (probably Udmurts (http://www.reference.com/browse/wiki/Udmurt_people) and Permyak Finns (http://www.reference.com/browse/wiki/Finnish_people)) as being predominantly redheaded.

Ovid
Monday, November 20th, 2006, 12:45 AM
Finally a first indication why Eickstedt described rufosity to his unmixed East-Nordid type since red hair is quite uncommon in Scandinavia's Finland.

Good info.

Red hair is indeed very uncommon in Finland, although my brother had red hair when he was a child.

Coon tells about rufosity among Udmurts: http://snpa.nordish.net/index2.htm


Parallel, in linguistic taxonomy, to the combined Baltic and Volga Finnic group is that of the Permians. These are divided into three living peoples, the Votiaks, Syryenians (or Zyrians), and Permiaks. All of these peoples live north of the Mordvins and Cheremisses, from whose general area they are said to have migrated. The most southerly are the Votiaks, who, numbering approximately half a million, live on the banks of the Kama River, a branch of the Volga, in the southeastern part of the former Viatka government. This region has been made into the Votiak Autonomous S. S. District by the Soviet authorities. Some 25,000 other Votiaks live in the Bashkir Republic, 20,000 in the Samarsk government, 1700 in Siberia, and others still in the Tatar Republic. In general, the modern destiny of the Votiaks has been to a certain extent associated with that of Turkish-speaking peoples. In their own language they call themselves Udmurt, and this language contains many loan words from Chuvash and Tatar speech. They have, however, failed to become Moslem; their religion, at the time of the Russian revolution, was officially Orthodox Christianity, which served as a cloak for the retention of much of the original Finnish heathendom.

Metrically the Votiaks resemble the Cheremisses very closely.81 A cephalic index mean of 82 is slightly higher, and reflects a slightly smaller head length. The mean stature is 162 to 163 cm. The pigment characters of the iris are similar to those of the Mordvins and Cheremisses, since between 30 per cent and 35 per cent of eyes are called brown, and the rest divided between blue, gray, and mixed colors. In head hair color however, a difference may be seen, for Maliev's series shows that but 2 per cent are black, 32 per cent dark brown, 29 per cent brown, 15 per cent light brown, and 7 per cent flaxen. Of the rest, 11 per cent are listed as reddish-brown. Chomiakov confirms this high incidence of rufosity, with 6 per cent of red hair color. Among Maliev's subjects only 15 per cent had black or brown beards; of the others 47 per cent were listed as red. These Votiaks, then, are not as blond as the Carelians, but blondism is frequent and characteristic; rufosity, notably absent from both the Carelian group and from the Iron Age Nordic race, and not important among the two tribes of Volga Finns, becomes a major factor among Permians.

I wonder how that rufosity could be explained. Is it related to Northwestern European rufosity or not?

SubGnostic
Monday, November 20th, 2006, 04:17 PM
Interesting. If I'm able to carry out my expedition plans, I'll be sure to visit Udmurtia. I wonder, should I just prance around some towns like a pixie and take pictures or should I try something more formal, eg. placing ads in newspapers to lure volunteers...

Irmin
Tuesday, November 21st, 2006, 02:33 PM
In some older literature of Soviet school I found the term "Sub-laponoid". It has been told to me that Udmurts widely belong to this type. Is there a connection to the Carleton Coon's "Ladogan type"? Is there anybody out there who could post some scans of resembling articles and some pictures of Sub-laponoids? Here comes a picture of a Hungarian who strongly reminds me of one pure Udmurt I was speaking with.
http://www.snpa.nordish.net/index2.htm

Northern Paladin
Sunday, January 2nd, 2011, 02:11 AM
Rufosity can occur in any race if I'm not mistaken. Correct me if I'm wrong. It is not a sign of Whiteness, to the least degree.

By the way, why did Skadi use to have Hungarian/Ruthenian members (like the guy who started this thread), and even Asian members?????? Thank God we cleaned up that mess lol