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View Full Version : Classify T. Cruise and P. Cruz



Jkl
Friday, June 20th, 2003, 05:23 PM
I still don´t understand why people want to put Penelope Cruz and other Spaniards in that third world label """Hispanic""" or """Latino""". She is a white western European Spaniard. She has nothing to do with mestizos, amerindians, central americans, south americans. She is just European by culture and race; she is neither """Hispanic""" nor """Latino""". Why don´t people (mostly americans) start to understand it?.

mav0ric
Friday, June 20th, 2003, 05:31 PM
While I agree that most spaniards I have met are White, I look at Penelope Cruz and I do NOT see a White girl. She is not White in my eyes. Thats my dividing line for the most part.

Jkl
Friday, June 20th, 2003, 05:45 PM
Probably to your eyes she is not white because she is constantly put in the media as "latina" and We all know what is "latina" in the US (thirdworld mestizo race and culture). If the media is bombing everyday saying the "LATINA actress Penelope Cruz...", people will indentify her as some kind of non-white person.

She can´t say in the US media "I´m not latina I´m a white European Spaniard" because all the so-called "latinos" would start to hate her and think she is racist. That is why she can´t say anything about it.

I don´t know what other people on this board would say but antropologically she is as white as any other European. She is not nordic, she is not alpine, but she is a white mediterranean woman. She is white (look at the picture, does it looks that she has any non-white feature?).

mav0ric
Friday, June 20th, 2003, 05:52 PM
I rarely see media entertainment reports. My observation of her being non White is from pictures and her movies that I have seen. She looks middle eastern to me. I would not breed with her as I feel she is not White.

hardcorps
Friday, June 20th, 2003, 08:04 PM
I think she certainly looks white, obviously of the gracile, insular Med etc type.

I've seen many of her features in Irish girls. In particular there's a certain subtle facial morphology (forgive my imprecision!) I've observed in Irish women that Cruz possesses. Presumably this is the result of some shared distant Iberian heritage.

I agree that she lies at the borderline of acceptability, but for me falls inside it. (From what I've seen her facial features are very neat and regular, not at all exaggerated and hawkish like the Middle Easterners of the same colouring.) J-Lo is well past that line for me, she’s quite unacceptable.

(Unless you're breeding from the blondest, blue-eyed Halstatts, statistically certain offspring will ‘luck out’ in receiving all of the less distinctively white characteristics. What if a curly-haired, 'golden-skinned' Norwegian Nordish has children with a black-haired, brown-eyed, shorter-statured Irish Nordish person? One would expect that they would produce a certain proportion of offspring who are curly-haired, golden skinned, black-haired, brown-eyed, shortish and mesocephalic. The latter might not be the ideal, but would be 100% white, if not eligible for phenotypic nordishness.)

My point: a darkened phenotype will always be thrown up from time to time in even the whitest populations, excepting artificially created SS-style breeding programs. I accept that Cruz might not be preferred 'breeding stock,' but she is white. The inheritance of a preponderance of darker genes, through the lottery of gene recombination, does not invalidate the majority of other genes, such as those that influence character and affect IQ. Even if she looks a lot like some Middle Easterner, her character and IQ genes underwent very different selection pressures in Spain than some Leb goat-herder daughter’s genes which were matured in the backward Levantine desertlands for thousands of years.

I fully respect that people will draw the line at different points, but I would be interested in what exactly people consider non-white about her.

Archangel Michael
Friday, June 20th, 2003, 08:47 PM
Originally posted by mav0ric
While I agree that most spaniards I have met are White, I look at Penelope Cruz and I do NOT see a White girl. She is not White in my eyes. Thats my dividing line for the most part.

In which case you need to change your glasses! She is white - mediterennean type. :)

Scáthach
Friday, June 20th, 2003, 08:48 PM
she does seem white to me.i think shes pretty too!

Archangel Michael
Friday, June 20th, 2003, 08:51 PM
Originally posted by mav0ric
I rarely see media entertainment reports. My observation of her being non White is from pictures and her movies that I have seen. She looks middle eastern to me. I would not breed with her as I feel she is not White.

LOL!! :lol I think there are a lot more people who would prefer to breed with Cruz than with YOU!! :lol

Grimr
Friday, June 20th, 2003, 09:06 PM
LOL!! I think there are a lot more people who would prefer to breed with Cruz than with YOU!!

Why are you creating a homosexual implication? Thats quite odd.

Archangel Michael
Friday, June 20th, 2003, 09:10 PM
No homosexual implication was intended - it was a generic comment!

mav0ric
Friday, June 20th, 2003, 11:29 PM
Originally posted by Archangel Michael
In which case you need to change your glasses! She is white - mediterennean type. :)

I have met and seen Iranian women that look whiter that her. They are no more White than she is in my eyes. She looks middle eastern to me. Also I do not wear glasses.


Originally posted by Archangel Michael
I think there are a lot more people who would prefer to breed with Cruz than with YOU!!

I do not doubt this but there are more people that would breed J-Lo or Hale Berry as well. Does this make them White? lol The only person I care that wants to sleep with me is my wife. A committed racialist herself. Thats the only one whose opinions matter in that department.

Archangel Michael
Friday, June 20th, 2003, 11:37 PM
You're missing the point. Your racialism is ridiculous - who do you consider white? Only British, Irish, Dutch, Germans and Scandinavians? And yes, many Iranians ARE white! :)

Archangel Michael
Saturday, June 21st, 2003, 12:11 AM
Yes, I think you've made your point. You're an oddball, for sure! :erm

mav0ric
Saturday, June 21st, 2003, 12:12 AM
Well if you were with her I and many would consider you a race traitor. That is what you are advocating here.

Stríbog
Saturday, June 21st, 2003, 12:20 AM
Well if you were with her I and many would consider you a race traitor. That is what you are advocating here.

Maybe you should calm down and stop using tired clichés. "Your eyes" are the ultimate judges of who is white? Who are these 'many others' that would consider him a race traitor for dating Penelope Cruz? I consider her Insular Mediterranean and it's understandable how some find her attractive. I prefer girls of my own or similar subtypes, though. I'm not attracted to Meds, Dinarics, or Alpines.
@Prospero: you post some really strange and irrelevant stuff

mav0ric
Saturday, June 21st, 2003, 12:21 AM
There is now this poll to get the majorities thoughts on this White or Not question

Poll - Penelope Cruz - White or Non White? (http://forums.skadi.net/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3232)

mav0ric
Saturday, June 21st, 2003, 12:32 AM
Originally posted by Fionn mac Cumhaill
[B]Maybe you should calm down and stop using tired clichés. ]

I am completly calm. Just amused at the acceptance here of her as White. I expect posts like this at Stormfront but not here.


Originally posted by Fionn mac Cumhaill
[B]"Your eyes" are the ultimate judges of who is white? ]

Yes for me they are. I expect most use "their" eyes to determine Whiteness for themselves. Don't you?


Originally posted by Fionn mac Cumhaill
[B]Who are these 'many others' that would consider him a race traitor for dating Penelope Cruz?

Well since this came up I have been taking an imformal poll over msn and on irc and so far you and him are the 2 that see her as White.

Over 20 others seeher as NOT White. I also polled my wife and another Skinhead that lives with us.

Result 2 more votes for NON White.

I also started a poll here on AD to see the overall concensus among us here.

Poll - Penelope Cruz - White or Non White? (http://forums.skadi.net/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3232)

Stríbog
Saturday, June 21st, 2003, 12:44 AM
If you consider her non-White, that's fine. I really don't care. I think it should be up to the Meds to decide more than anyone else, since they know their own kind best, and since she is a potential mate for them. I don't consider her a potential partner either way, so it's irrelevant to me.

Jkl
Saturday, June 21st, 2003, 01:32 AM
I believe that you have done your polls with Americans and Canadians, so probably they believe in the "Hispanic-Latino" stupidity and that conditions their answers to the poll.

You should do the same polls with these to women:

Catherine Zeta Jones:

http://forums.skadi.net/attachment.php?s=&postid=24185

The Corrs:

http://forums.skadi.net/attachment.php?s=&postid=24186

or with this Welsh lady:

http://forums.skadi.net/attachment.php?s=&postid=24183

or with Kevin Rowland:

http://forums.skadi.net/attachment.php?s=&postid=24184


Do they look different than Cruz?. Just for the fact that they have an English surname makes them whiter than Cruz, independently of their phenotype?. Would your fellows breed with Catherine Zeta Jones or the corrs?. It would be good to have an answer to these questions also.

mav0ric
Saturday, June 21st, 2003, 01:40 AM
Originally posted by JKL
I believe that you have done your polls with Americans and Canadians, so probably they believe in the "Hispanic-Latino" stupidity and that conditions their answers to the poll.

I did my quick polls with anyone who was online. I did not ask their personal country of origin. Thats one of the reasons I also made a poll here because here we have a much wider world profile than most sites.


Originally posted by JKL
Do they look different than Cruz?.

Yes they all look Whiter than Cruz to me. One still picture is harder to tell though.

Jkl
Saturday, June 21st, 2003, 01:45 AM
Yes they all look Whiter than Cruz to me. One still picture is harder to tell though.

I respect your opinion but you clearly have a double standard. I´m absolutely sure that Kevin Rowland or that Welsh lady (or many others) look as white (or even less white) than Penelope Cruz.

mav0ric
Saturday, June 21st, 2003, 01:51 AM
Your 'Welsh' lady looks a little off White (possibly a little Romanian gypsy look to her) to my eyes but she does not stand out like the sore thumb that Cruz does in every movie I have seen her in. I never even considered she was White. Thats one of the reasons I polled as many as I could to see if I was somehow off base. It seems you are the minority in your view. Not me.

Archangel Michael
Saturday, June 21st, 2003, 01:56 AM
Originally posted by mav0ric
Well if you were with her I and many would consider you a race traitor. That is what you are advocating here.

Don't give me this 'race traitor' crap. I'm white and proud of it, but a moron is a moron regardless of his race - and that is what you ARE!

It is dorks like you who give the white nationalist movement a bad name. So you think only blondes are white? What scientific basis do you have for this?
WHEN WILL YOU GET THIS THROUGH YOUR THICK SKULLS: MEDITERRENEANS ARE WHITE - WHETHER YOU LIKE IT OR NOT!!!

You guys are uneducated morons :mad

Stríbog
Saturday, June 21st, 2003, 02:06 AM
He is Christian Identity. It's odd that he argues that Nordic people originated in the Middle East, because Nordic phenotypes tend to not do well in burning deserts...

mav0ric
Saturday, June 21st, 2003, 02:09 AM
Originally posted by Archangel Michael
Don't give me this 'race traitor' crap. I'm white and proud of it, but a moron is a moron regardless of his race - and that is what you ARE!

I have seen little in your postings to elevate your views above anyone elses. So far you are in the minority on this issue on here and from my in life and IM poll. Don't get mad about it just accept it.


Originally posted by Archangel Michael
It is dorks like you who give the white nationalist movement a bad name.

'Dork'? lol How old are you? I certainly hate that term 'White Nationalist' The only way I am any sort of nationalist is is we consider our race our nation. Most nationalists are more for country than race and that is not for me.


Originally posted by Archangel Michael
So you think only blondes are white? What scientific basis do you have for this?

I never said only blondes were White. Nowhere and never have I made a comment that could even be construed as such. I am married to a brunette and very rarely do I find blondes to my personal taste.


Originally posted by Archangel Michael
WHEN WILL YOU GET THIS THROUGH YOUR THICK SKULLS: MEDITERRENEANS ARE WHITE - WHETHER YOU LIKE IT OR NOT!!!

Some are. Some are not. Just like saying someone from Ireland is White. They might be and they might not be.


Originally posted by Archangel Michael
You guys are uneducated morons :mad

Somehow I doubt you are on my level but if it makes you feel better you have my permission to think this way.

mav0ric
Saturday, June 21st, 2003, 02:13 AM
Originally posted by Fionn mac Cumhaill
He is Christian Identity. It's odd that he argues that Nordic people originated in the Middle East, because Nordic phenotypes tend to not do well in burning deserts...

I am? WOW! lol I am not CI although I do feel that it explains alot about the bible that I grew up reading as an Irish Catholic.

Archangel Michael
Saturday, June 21st, 2003, 02:15 AM
Mavoric,

I'm tired of arguing - let's just agree to disagree on this one. x_zzz

Goodnight..........

Stríbog
Saturday, June 21st, 2003, 02:20 AM
In a thread in Suggestions and Complaints, you complained when CI was attacked by Irish Nationalist and others, and said that it was a genuine religion for white people. I took that to mean that you were at least partly CI in your beliefs.

mav0ric
Saturday, June 21st, 2003, 02:27 AM
Originally posted by Archangel Michael
Unfortunately it's people like that who give the racialist movement a bad name. We can do well without skinheads!

Really? I highly doubt that they are 'like' me. I am a Skinhead. Proud, honorable and totally giving to my race. I am educated, work full time at a damn good paying job and am in the process of starting my own business. Four kids, married and one of the most stand up guys you ever want to have your back if trouble starts. Skinheads ARE the backbone of the movement We live our beliefs every day out in the open unlike many. No one looking at me can mistake my views on politics or race.



Originally posted by Archangel Michael
I cannot believe that there are still those who insist on the Nordic as the only white type. Maybe they should travel more.

I don't believe that nordic is the only White type. I just do not think Cruz is White. Stop typing to spin your arguement into something bigger. It has nothing to do with nordic / non nordic.

Stríbog
Saturday, June 21st, 2003, 03:08 AM
so far you and him are the 2 that see her as White.

I never actually said I saw her as 'white' since it's too vague a term IMO. I break things down to the subtype level, since to me drawing the line of 'white' seems fairly arbitrary. She still strikes me as predominantly Insular Med but I could be wrong. Can I post more pictures of Hallstatt and Neo-Danubian models instead? :halo

Sigrun Christianson
Saturday, June 21st, 2003, 02:47 PM
I'm so not shocked that this thread turned into insults and ***-slinging. I agree with mav0ric - she doesn't appear white to me, but do I call the rest fo your nasty names because you think she is? No.

According to Archangel Michael, that makes me a moron. According Thorburn, I have a herd mentality. Well, I am just one of those horrid Americans so that surley explains my ignorance, huh?

I'm so outta here.

Loki
Sunday, June 22nd, 2003, 12:52 AM
Originally posted by Archangel Michael
Don't give me this 'race traitor' crap. I'm white and proud of it, but a moron is a moron regardless of his race - and that is what you ARE!

It is dorks like you who give the white nationalist movement a bad name. So you think only blondes are white? What scientific basis do you have for this?
WHEN WILL YOU GET THIS THROUGH YOUR THICK SKULLS: MEDITERRENEANS ARE WHITE - WHETHER YOU LIKE IT OR NOT!!!

You guys are uneducated morons :mad

Archangel Michael, I have just noticed your post.

You seem to be new here on P.E. I hope you are enjoying it here with us. There is just one word of warning I would like to give you:

We here at Pantheon Europa don't like profanity and character insults. Although we champion the cause of free speech, there are common laws of decency that apply to these message boards. I would like you to refrain from using such abusive language in the future. Both mav0ric and Sigrun are moderators here, and it is not advisable to address them like that. Or anyone else here for that matter.

Please take heed to this warning. If you disregard this, there may be consequences for you.

Regards,

Loki

Nordhammer
Wednesday, June 25th, 2003, 08:40 AM
Originally posted by JKL
I still don´t understand why people want to put Penelope Cruz and other Spaniards in that third world label """Hispanic""" or """Latino""". She is a white western European Spaniard. She has nothing to do with mestizos, amerindians, central americans, south americans. She is just European by culture and race; she is neither """Hispanic""" nor """Latino""". Why don´t people (mostly americans) start to understand it?.

What Americans have a problem with this? I'm American and I don't. The triracial mongrels from South America unfortunately have coopted a lot of the identity of Spaniards, which is really the fault of Mediterraneans for mongrelizing themselves during their conquests.

For Cruz to be nonSpanish or nonwhite, one must prove she is significantly atypical for the population. I don't see that.

Nordhammer
Wednesday, June 25th, 2003, 08:46 AM
Originally posted by Thorburn
Correct, I agree with you on Penelope Cruz.

Apparently, there is now a poll on her:
http://www.forums.skadi.net/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3232

6 votes for "non-white", 1 for "white" (that was me), so far. ;)

"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect." — Mark Twain ;)

- Thorburn

Great quote.:cool

For me, it depends on the situation, the context of how white is being used. When asked which groups are "white" by American standards or by my standards for America, then I exclude Spaniards and all Mediterranean groups as a standard, however a minority within those populations is Nordish or semi-Nordish and preferably assimilable.

When one asks a broad question such as which groups are white, as in anthropologically or historically, of course Meds are white, etc.

Again I don't see anything that excludes Cruz from the Spanish population. Is she Nordish? No. Would I want her type to be widespread among American females? No. I don't find her attractive at all. Tom should be ashamed of himself, what a step down.

Saoirse
Wednesday, June 25th, 2003, 12:20 PM
Cruise is a dirty homosexual.

Scáthach
Wednesday, June 25th, 2003, 01:10 PM
oh so penelope is not only non white in peoples eyes but she is actually a HE? :rolleyes: