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Von Braun
Monday, April 21st, 2003, 03:44 AM
In terms of racial characteristics, what is the "in" group that is to be the nucleus for carrying Western civilization forward, if and when all obstacles (particularly the zionists) are overcome? It is clear that being accepted as white is not good enough for the vast majority of people in our "movement," judging by the amount of time many devote to portraying other non-Nordic white groups as inferior.

Is it a Nordic-centric issue, in which all individuals allowed into the new racially conscious country are a certain number or less on the McCulloch scale? Or is it less about group membership and more feature-based: would an Alpine-Nordic mix with blonde hair be let in to the country and a pure Halstatt Nordic with brown hair be rejected?

It seems that the "movement" is about ""whites" fighting for a new "aryan" homeland." Granted, many people do think that "white" and "aryan" are identical, but others have a more exclusive defintion of "aryan." In this light, ""whites fighting for an "aryan" homeland" could be taken to mean "white people who are not 100% Nordic sacrifice time, energy, and money and fight for a homeland that only people who are pure Nordics AND who have blonde hair and blue eyes are allowed into (darker pure Nordics of course do not count as aryan, same for blonde people who are not 100% Nordic)." This sounds unfair. I want people to share their true thoughts and feelings with me on this issue.

Azdaja
Monday, April 21st, 2003, 10:09 AM
<< It is clear that being accepted as white is not good enough for the vast majority of people in our "movement," judging by the amount of time many devote to portraying other non-Nordic white groups as inferior. >>

I think right away 2 things need to be kept in mind:
1) The most knowledgeable and racially pure Nordicists that I've come across - such as Northstar, Volksdeutsche, and Fion mac Cumhaill - do NOT look down upon or deride non-Nordic Europid sub-races. It is always the borderline/questionable "Nordics" that engage in the hostile behavior. The "Nordicism" of such borderline cases is an outgrowth of egotism and a sign of mental problems. Such people - I doubt - would ever rise to any position of importance in any "white homeland". Their opinions, though humorous, are of no real worth.
2) The fascination with Nordics in our movement is largely the result of Nordicists going out into the world and promoting that fascination. If people of other sub-races went out and created "SNPA" type sites which focused on their own sub-race, then maybe so many people would not feel the need to identify themselves as 'nordish' or 'partially nordish'. Racialism - at least in part - should be about being proud of who you are. Nordicism is an outgrowth of that principal..for Nordics. I would also like to see "Alpinism" and "Mediterraneanism" and "Dinaricism".

<< Is it a Nordic-centric issue, in which all individuals allowed into the new racially conscious country are a certain number or less on the McCulloch scale? Or is it less about group membership and more feature-based >>

Well if we are talking about a "Nordish" homeland, as opposed to a more generalize Europid homeland (and I don't see why we cannot have the former, once we've got the latter), I would say that the first option you give makes far more sense. I say this because by "features", you seem to mean only hair and eye colour. The McCulloch scale is "feature" based, after all.

<< "whites fighting for an "aryan" homeland" could be taken to mean "white people who are not 100% Nordic sacrifice time, energy, and money and fight for a homeland that only people who are pure Nordics AND who have blonde hair and blue eyes are allowed into >>

Well judging from the true Nordicists I've met, I doubt that non-Nordics would be 'screwed' out of a homeland once such a homeland was secured. Chances are the Nordicists would simply take a peace of the greater Europid homeland and use it for their own purposes, which would certainly be fine by me. Other sub-types could do the same.

Sigrun Christianson
Monday, April 21st, 2003, 03:33 PM
Von Braun wrote:

In terms of racial characteristics, what is the "in" group that is to be the nucleus for carrying Western civilization forward...


That would be ME.

-ZoŽ

Allenson
Monday, April 21st, 2003, 04:43 PM
From a sub-racial preservationists perspective, I suppose that depends on what group is doing the defining. Personally, I'm an advocate of preserving all types....so all types are the 'in-group' for their particular group

From a 'pan-Aryan' perspective, I'd guess that the term "Europid" would be a good call for what the 'in-group' should be.

Check out Legion Europa's 'proximals' and 'distals' for a pan-Aryan view on the matter.

Von Braun
Monday, April 21st, 2003, 04:51 PM
Originally posted by Zoe
Von Braun wrote:



That would be ME.

-ZoŽ

You showed me your pictures a while back. You have red hair. Since that is a dominant trait, will the "Aryanists" accept red hair?

Sigrun Christianson
Monday, April 21st, 2003, 05:17 PM
I don't care what the 'Aryanists' accept or don't accept. My perception of myself and my worth to my race is not based soley on my hair color or classification as made by a group of amateur Physical Anthropologists.

Having said that, I've never had a problem being 'accepted' by anyone, including the Nordish Supremacists. Part of that is undoubtedly because I am in the central Nordish range (redhair is included in the central Nordish range and fully accepted by most if not all, as far as I know), and partly because of my character, values and commitment to my race (subrace-phenotype-genotype, insert the classification of your choice, I don't care).

Some call me TrÝnder, others say BrŁnn, and still many more call me an evil racist Nazi out to destroy the world. Oh, and according to a recent article from the Brits, I'm also a Neanderthal. ;)

Why do you care so much about how others would classify you?

There is no "in" group, Matt. Stop worrying about it.

-ZoŽ

Von Braun
Monday, April 21st, 2003, 05:56 PM
The paradigm seems to be "emphasize as many recessive and/or rare traits (which are not always the same) that you can find in yourself." That is why my custom title is "Proud to be A Negative." Rh negative blood seems to be highly correlated with (if not exclusively) Europids.

There are two general paths that I can choose: work with other white racialists toward a racial state in the future, or just have my own family and friends, amongst whom we are all "white enough" for each other. The latter scenario looks more and more attractive, as people continually try to lump me in with non-europid elements with their use of sloppy nomenclature.

You see, what really pisses me off is the redundant use of terminology. White Mediterraneans like Goebbels and Mengele are not like the brown-skinned mongrels that some people call "meds." I am part Dinaric via Germany, which is paritally white Mediterranean, and I am also part
Atlanto-Mediterranean via the Biritish Isles and France. If I am referred to as partially "Mediterranean," some people who have not seen me might get the wrong idea and think I am a brown-skinned Pakistani. Experts have admitted that I am fully Europid, just as true Mediterraneans like Goebbels and Mengele were fully Europid. Can you see the problem with calling wholly white people like me part Mediterranean, and then referring to brown-skinned people as far east as India as "meds"?

Sigrun Christianson
Monday, April 21st, 2003, 06:22 PM
You still don't get it.

It doesn't matter what some posters on a webboard think of you.

Von Braun
Monday, April 21st, 2003, 06:32 PM
Originally posted by Zoe
You still don't get it.

It doesn't matter what some posters on a webboard think of you.

It does matter if I spend time, energy, and money fighting for our goals and then end up being excluded from the future racialist homeland because I look "central European," or because I am a "peripheral Nordish type of rating 4" or because I have "brown hair and green eyes" or because whatever Nordic traits I have (light eyes) are too few in comparison to my non-Nordish, Dinaric traits.

Zoe, please understand that this is not about vanity, it is about the very practical concern pertaining to whether or not I will be backstabbed.

Sigrun Christianson
Monday, April 21st, 2003, 07:00 PM
So, essentially, you are saying that you're are fighting to be part of the winning group, but you don't want to fight if you're going to be excluded from that group? That's your concern? Aren't you jumping the gun a little? And honestly, that is not a trusthworthy or reliable stance, imo.

The vast, vast majority of WNs & Racialists do not subscribe to the Nordisher-Than-Thou school of thought. Perhaps your view is skewed from spending too much time on the internet. Your work with the NA should have taught you that.

Anyway, I don't think you see the bigger picture. I will gladly and ferociously defend anyone I deem white and worthy of defence, but I wouldn't marry or breed with just any old white guy. We're racists, even within our own little group. I'll work side-by-side with Alpines, Neo-Danubians, Borrebies and even those vicious Slavs (kidding!), but I'll marry and procreate within my own racial and intellectual sub-group because of my own self-centered personal agenda & preferences. I'm a racist, sue me.

Scoring a 1 or a 5 on the scale is important in some aspects, irrelevant in others. You focus too much on what will happen "after we win" and not nearly enough on what needs to be done this very day for us to "win", as you put it.

-ZoŽ

Von Braun
Monday, April 21st, 2003, 07:16 PM
Originally posted by Zoe
So, essentially, you are saying that you're are fighting to be part of the winning group, but you don't want to fight if you're going to be excluded from that group? That's your concern? Aren't you jumping the gun a little? And honestly, that is not a trusthworthy or reliable stance, imo.


I will always have my racial ideals and feelings. The issue is if I should network with others who share this with me in a WN org, or just prepare for the upcoming cataclysm with my future family and a small group of white friends.

Sigrun Christianson
Monday, April 21st, 2003, 07:35 PM
Only you can make that decision. Asking for opinions from people you don't even know is not a good way to determine your course of action.

You're not central Nordish. Big deal.

Von Braun
Monday, April 21st, 2003, 07:45 PM
Originally posted by Zoe
You're not central Nordish. Big deal.

You say that as if it is no big deal, but to the Nordicists who dominate our movement, peripheral Nordish and farther from central Nordish is unacceptable. Anyone who is not central Nordish is treated as if he is a borderline white. If I am a borderline white (for not being central Nordish), would you want me in the future racial state?

Sigrun Christianson
Monday, April 21st, 2003, 08:03 PM
The Nordicists don't dominate our movement.

Noddy
Monday, April 21st, 2003, 08:12 PM
Originally posted by Zoe
The Nordicists don't dominate our movement.

No. I do.

Allenson
Monday, April 21st, 2003, 08:22 PM
Originally posted by Zoe

I will gladly and ferociously defend anyone I deem white and worthy of defence, but I wouldn't marry or breed with just any old white guy. We're racists, even within our own little group. I'll work side-by-side with Alpines, Neo-Danubians, Borrebies and even those vicious Slavs (kidding!), but I'll marry and procreate within my own racial and intellectual sub-group because of my own self-centered personal agenda & preferences. I'm a racist, sue me.

-ZoŽ


Well said! We can all work together yet have our own personal "in-group" for mate selection, etc.

Yes, I've been classified as central Nordish but there's no way that I would turn my back on good, hard working, fully Europid folks who believe in and work toward the same overall goals that I do.

Von Braun, I've seen your pics and I would never refer to you as a 'non-white'.....

Von Braun
Monday, April 21st, 2003, 08:24 PM
Originally posted by Zoe
The Nordicists don't dominate our movement.

Sure they do. All commonly-used metrics for "whiteness" are centered around who is the most Nordish. Nordics are mentioned more often. There is a society for Nordish Physical Anthropology, but I have not heard of counterparts for other groups. Names pertaining to Nordicism are chosen on message boards, while names pertaining to other groups are rarely chosen. The term "Mediterranean" is maliciously applied to brown-skinned middle easterners by Nordicists in order to degrade perfectly white northwestern Europeans who are Atlanto-Mediterranean. You'd think that our "movement" was for pure Nordics only.

If I am so inferior because of my brown hair, then the pure Nordics can defend themselves from the zionist onslaught without me while I live in some remote part of North America with my future family and some trusted racialist (non-Nordicist) friends. Is my intelligence, perserverence, and compassion for other whites not good enough because of my classification? Since Nordic features define how white someone is, and there are partial jews with blonde hair, would you want someone like me who is less white than some jews in your future homeland?

Sigrun Christianson
Monday, April 21st, 2003, 08:35 PM
No, it's not.


I am not going to spend time trying to convince you to stay in the movement or reassure you that you are white enough, if that's what you are after. I'm not your Mommy and I'm not going to stroke your ego.

If you don't feel that you belong here or that you are accepted, then leave. What is left to debate? This is not a popularity or beauty contest.

It's this simple: If you feel inferior, unwanted, disrespected or alienated, then leave.

Von Braun
Monday, April 21st, 2003, 08:52 PM
If you don't feel that you belong here or that you are accepted, then leave.

Well, there are other whites "here" that are not 100% Nordic who could be in the same situation as I am in. I still want to network, its just that I think the accepted paradigm that "we should struggle for a 'whites-only' racialist state" could leave me and these other individuals out in the cold after serving the holier-than-thou
100% Nordics.


What is left to debate? This is not a popularity or beauty contest.

Really? Why do people like NordicPower88 spend ten posts talking about their hopes for their future children having blonde hair and blue eyes for every one post they spend talking about their hopes that their future children are intelligent and healthy (that is a rough estimate)?


It's this simple: If you feel inferior, unwanted, disrespected or alienated, then leave.

Instead of trying to refute, with evidence of your own, my claims that there is this huge Nordic bias (other than just claiming it is not there), you seem eager to have me leave. I thought we were friends last fall, and now instead of addressing my valid concerns you just encourage me to leave. This makes me even more suspicious that my claims are true.

Sigrun Christianson
Monday, April 21st, 2003, 09:01 PM
Well, hmmm.

I guess I am encouraging you to leave because I don't find that you have your head in the right place. But why do you care what I think of you? Is my opinion so important to your life? If everyone on this board told me to go to Hell and that I don't belong in the movement, I'd tell them to go to Hell and keep on doing what I'm doing.

I'd really prefer not to address personal issues in public, so if you want an explanation of what happened last Fall, then I can PM it to you, but I'd prefer that we forget it.

Glenlivet
Monday, April 21st, 2003, 10:10 PM
Braun, I'm pretty sure that you're a nice and devoted man. You have plenty of energy to discuss the same subject over and over again, at least I got that.

I doubt that there are many here (or elsewhere in the world) with what is typical for 100 % Nordid features and pigmentation. There are probably some of us who are partly or predominantly Nordid-looking. I don't think any Europid sub-race is better than the other. But we may prefer a type more than the other on a personal level when it comes to issues like mating.

NordicPower88 probably did it because she was not as Nordid as she wanted to be.

You're a guy with a sense of humour and with a lot of heart for what you consider being your kins.

Please leave personal issues personal. I recommend you to take comments from people you don't know in person as a grain of salt.






Originally posted by Von Braun
Well, there are other whites "here" that are not 100% Nordic who could be in the same situation as I am in. I still want to network, its just that I think the accepted paradigm that "we should struggle for a 'whites-only' racialist state" could leave me and these other individuals out in the cold after serving the holier-than-thou
100% Nordics.



Really? Why do people like NordicPower88 spend ten posts talking about their hopes for their future children having blonde hair and blue eyes for every one post they spend talking about their hopes that their future children are intelligent and healthy (that is a rough estimate)?



Instead of trying to refute, with evidence of your own, my claims that there is this huge Nordic bias (other than just claiming it is not there), you seem eager to have me leave. I thought we were friends last fall, and now instead of addressing my valid concerns you just encourage me to leave. This makes me even more suspicious that my claims are true.

Sigrun Christianson
Tuesday, April 22nd, 2003, 12:49 AM
I feel like a dog chasing my own tail.