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Dr. Solar Wolff
Saturday, November 13th, 2004, 05:05 AM
The lead jab, left jab in boxing if you fight conventionally, is often said to be a ring tool only. By this I mean that some say in the real world it is a wasted punch. Their reasoning is that it is not a knockout punch and that any punch not designed to render the opponent helpless is a wasted punch--you just don't get that many chances outside the ring. Any comment?

Johnny Reb
Saturday, November 13th, 2004, 05:37 AM
Depends on the type of fight, and the skill-level of the opponent. If they're amateurs, it's superb. It sets them up for the straight right. I'm only good at fighting when I'm watching it on tape. If somebody hit me with a left jab, I'd be helpless. :P

The Blond Beast
Saturday, November 13th, 2004, 11:12 AM
The lead jab, left jab in boxing if you fight conventionally, is often said to be a ring tool only. By this I mean that some say in the real world it is a wasted punch. Their reasoning is that it is not a knockout punch and that any punch not designed to render the opponent helpless is a wasted punch--you just don't get that many chances outside the ring. Any comment?

In boxing, the jab is typically used to set up a combo or to maintain distance; it's used regardless because it scores points...

Though, in a stand-up street fight (obviously without gloves), all it takes is a little trauma to the nose to somewhat blind an opponent (his eyes water), so the jab is conceivably quite useful. One can imagine landing a quick, stiff jab and shattering an opponent's nose (I've seen it), or at least causing his eyes to water, and once he's panicked, reeling and somewhat blinded -- his head a difficult target -- the ordeal can be ended quickly with body blows (this I have also seen).

As Johnny Reb said, it ultimately depends on the opponent's style and ability.

Dr. Solar Wolff
Wednesday, November 17th, 2004, 06:51 AM
In boxing, the jab is typically used to set up a combo or to maintain distance; it's used regardless because it scores points...

Though, in a stand-up street fight (obviously without gloves), all it takes is a little trauma to the nose to somewhat blind an opponent (his eyes water), so the jab is conceivably quite useful. One can imagine landing a quick, stiff jab and shattering an opponent's nose (I've seen it), or at least causing his eyes to water, and once he's panicked, reeling and somewhat blinded -- his head a difficult target -- the ordeal can be ended quickly with body blows (this I have also seen).

As Johnny Reb said, it ultimately depends on the opponent's style and ability.

Have you or Johnny Reb ever used it in a street fight? By jab I do not mean a punch which would knock someone down but only confuse him momentarily. The reason I am asking is I plan to once again set up my heavy bag and I am thinking about training without a jab at all. I am thinking about a side-step left hook instead, followed by straight right, then more hooks or uppercuts as I move around the bag to the left--or--after the straight right and another left hook, switching to southpaw and using the right hook as a long-range weapon as I move to the right. In other words moving left--left lead, moving right--right lead, but neither from behind a jab.

The Blond Beast
Wednesday, November 17th, 2004, 08:52 AM
Have you or Johnny Reb ever used it in a street fight? By jab I do not mean a punch which would knock someone down but only confuse him momentarily. The reason I am asking is I plan to once again set up my heavy bag and I am thinking about training without a jab at all. I am thinking about a side-step left hook instead, followed by straight right, then more hooks or uppercuts as I move around the bag to the left--or--after the straight right and another left hook, switching to southpaw and using the right hook as a long-range weapon as I move to the right. In other words moving left--left lead, moving right--right lead, but neither from behind a jab.

Personally, I think it would be a good idea to train with the jab. Aside from being a good defense -- maintaining distance, especially if you're opponent is apprehensive/defensive -- as stated, it can easily stun an opponent; not only that, it is not telegraphed to the same extent that a hook, uppercut, or straight would be. Suffice it to say, one has to close in to make a hook, straight, or uppercut count -- the jab is your way in...

Dr. Solar Wolff
Tuesday, November 23rd, 2004, 07:27 AM
Personally, I think it would be a good idea to train with the jab. Aside from being a good defense -- maintaining distance, especially if you're opponent is apprehensive/defensive -- as stated, it can easily stun an opponent; not only that, it is not telegraphed to the same extent that a hook, uppercut, or straight would be. Suffice it to say, one has to close in to make a hook, straight, or uppercut count -- the jab is your way in...


Agreed, in boxing. Boxing without a jab is bad boxing. But fighting is not boxing. Most street fighters will take a lead jab, no problem, if they can walk in and mash you with their right. Even if they miss, you must either move away or counter punch. Sometimes, even if they miss, you are ducking or out of position for the knockout blow. I am wondering if it is possible to gain some of the advantages of a jab as a distance weapon and as a lead weapon without using a jab by using a hook and a slight side step, then coming in with the right if it misses without a break in motion.

Hey, if you think I am f---ing crazy, just say so, I will not be offended--this whole lead jab thing is just a thought.

Johnny Reb
Tuesday, November 23rd, 2004, 10:00 PM
Agreed, in boxing. Boxing without a jab is bad boxing. But fighting is not boxing. Most street fighters will take a lead jab, no problem, if they can walk in and mash you with their right. Even if they miss, you must either move away or counter punch. Sometimes, even if they miss, you are ducking or out of position for the knockout blow. I am wondering if it is possible to gain some of the advantages of a jab as a distance weapon and as a lead weapon without using a jab by using a hook and a slight side step, then coming in with the right if it misses without a break in motion.

Hey, if you think I am f---ing crazy, just say so, I will not be offended--this whole lead jab thing is just a thought.

When I boxed, I could never get a lot of power behind a lead hook. I could always snap a hard jab off though. A jab isn't just about hitting the guy though. It's also used as a range-finder, setting up for the big right (or left, if you're a southpaw). The way I see it, you're just as vulnerable using the lead hook as you are with the lead jab, but without the initial power.

There's no law that says you can't work on both though. It'll spice things up a bit on the bag, and make you a more well rounded fighter. If you find yourself in a fight, and want to rely on your lead hook, then go ahead, but I think it's silly to limit yourself in practice.

wirowlkwos
Wednesday, December 29th, 2004, 07:19 AM
Look into Jack Dempseys idea behind throwing a lead jab or as he called it a a lead jolt! I have been doing this for some time now and it is an amazing quick and powerful concept.

http://stickgrappler2.tripod.com/kbox/dempsey.html

THE BOSS
Tuesday, January 25th, 2005, 01:14 PM
The jab is used to set up power punches such as the right cross(or left cross if you're a south paw). A person with a good jab can use it effectively in any fight situation.

nordic_canadian_male
Wednesday, February 16th, 2005, 01:03 AM
the jab is very effective at the start of a street fight if followed by the right cross or other powerful punch. The jab because it is quick will have a stunning affect on your opponent allowing you to land more punches without being hit. You must practice your jab though of course, it has to be hard and fast to be effective, but once it is you have a great weapon. I myself when i hit the bag, i box southpaw most of the time just to develope my left more, in one fight i had i actually fought southpaw, and the right jab i threw knocked the guy down. In the end different punches and fighting styles are effective for different people aswell as your opponents ability, it's all relative.

Panzerboy
Monday, February 21st, 2005, 03:47 PM
solar,


you should find ways to measure the strenght and speed of your jab. if its horrible and you see no way of really improving it, you should concentrate on them other punches.

however, if you find ways to develop a continually stronger and faster jab then you should put this into your arsenal.

pople get knocked out by jabs, its fast, catch them with something they dident see coming, or as a unlikely counterpunch possebly with a sidestep.

thing with the jab on the street its a fast fucker. blind and confuse someone with a fast and possebly unsuspected punch, say to the eyes, then you follow up with your heavy guns.. straight right/feign a straight right, land a left hook, whatever..
if you attack with hooks or the right hand right away, you might be telegraphing your punching intentions, and if they know whats coming they might be able to defend themselves - unless you use outside distractions and such, that is..

in a heated argument most people watch for movement in your right arm. raise your left arm cassually and tuck your collar in with your left, and boom! boomboomboom! jump in and follw up with a combo.

Dr. Solar Wolff
Tuesday, February 22nd, 2005, 08:48 AM
solar,


you should find ways to measure the strenght and speed of your jab. if its horrible and you see no way of really improving it, you should concentrate on them other punches.

however, if you find ways to develop a continually stronger and faster jab then you should put this into your arsenal.

pople get knocked out by jabs, its fast, catch them with something they dident see coming, or as a unlikely counterpunch possebly with a sidestep.

thing with the jab on the street its a fast fucker. blind and confuse someone with a fast and possebly unsuspected punch, say to the eyes, then you follow up with your heavy guns.. straight right/feign a straight right, land a left hook, whatever..
if you attack with hooks or the right hand right away, you might be telegraphing your punching intentions, and if they know whats coming they might be able to defend themselves - unless you use outside distractions and such, that is..

in a heated argument most people watch for movement in your right arm. raise your left arm cassually and tuck your collar in with your left, and boom! boomboomboom! jump in and follw up with a combo.

As a teenager, I knocked a guy down with a jab but that certainly did not end the fight. He just scrambled back up and I had to start all over again. This is the mistake I have never wanted to repeat and so have never again used a jab in a street fight (other than as a fake). It works great in the boxing ring but there you have endless amounts of time which you don't have in a street fight. Since I began this thread, I notice that the K-1 people hardly use jabs and the total combat types almost never use it in their version of a ring.

Angelcynn Beorn
Tuesday, March 8th, 2005, 04:20 AM
Heres a simple solution: extend your fingers and aim them into the other guys eyes when you punch. Straight away your fastest punch has now become a "stopper" in its own right.

ps, i wouldnt look to K1 or UFC for examples of good punching technique, most of them have terrible hands.