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Thorburn
Tuesday, August 24th, 2004, 10:06 AM
Red Army Raped Every German Woman, Says Author


Dave Eberhart, NewsMax
Thursday, May 2, 2002

"They raped every German female from eight to 80," says Antony Beevor, author of the newly released "Berlin: The Downfall 1945."

Beevor describes how Natalya Gesse, a close friend of the scientist Andrei Sakharov, observed the Red Army in action in 1945 as a Soviet war correspondent. "The Russian soldiers were raping every German female from eight to eighty. It was an army of rapists," she said.

"The subject of the Red Army’s mass rapes in Germany has been so repressed in Russia that even today veterans refuse to acknowledge what really happened," says Beevor.

The author describes how the German women learned to disappear during the "hunting hours" of the evening. Young daughters were hidden in storage lofts for days on end. Mothers emerged into the street to fetch water only in the early morning when Soviet soldiers were sleeping off the alcohol from the night before.

Remembering the Screams

"Sometimes the greatest danger came from one mother giving away the hiding places of other girls in a desperate bid to save her own daughter. Older Berliners still remember the screams every night," Beevor describes.

Beevor estimates that rape victims from Berlin's two main hospitals ranged from 95,000 to 130,000, one doctor deducing that out of approximately 100,000 women raped in the city, some 10,000 died as a result, mostly from suicide.

"The death rate was thought to have been much higher among the 1.4 million estimated victims in East Prussia, Pomerania and Silesia," Beevor says, maintaining that at least 2 million German women are thought to have been raped, and a substantial minority, if not a majority, appearing to have suffered multiple rape.

In Berlin, says Beevor, many women were simply not prepared for the shock of Russian atrocities, however much horror propaganda they had heard from Goebbels. Many reassured themselves that, although the danger must be great out in the countryside, mass rapes could hardly take place in the city in front of everybody.

Strengthandhonour
Wednesday, August 25th, 2004, 12:54 AM
terrible..not surprised though, i never hear many positive things about Russians..

Evolved
Wednesday, August 25th, 2004, 05:32 AM
Does anyone have ethnic/national origin statistics of the Soviet Army during WWII?

"Russians"?:

http://www.iremember.ru/infantry/zimakov/01.jpg
http://www.osa.ceu.hu/galeria/sites/siege/tablo1kep5.jpg
http://www.iremember.ru/artillerymen/kolesnik/kolesnik_01.jpg
http://www.magma.ca/~nebogato/J66-10966_31_L_Solgers.jpg

More non-Russians listed: http://www.iremember.ru/index_e.htm

WestPrussian
Wednesday, August 25th, 2004, 02:29 PM
Good point, lg. Some of my ancestors are from Landsberg/Warthe in East Brandenburg (currently under Polish occupation). Red Army units there consisted of both Russians and Uzbeks. Whereas the Uzbeks behaved like civilized soldiers in their treatment of the women (i.e., they did not bother the women), the Russians behaved like … well… Russians, as described in the article posted by Njörd.

Evolved
Wednesday, August 25th, 2004, 02:38 PM
Uzbeks tend to prefer men and boys.

Grimr
Wednesday, August 25th, 2004, 02:58 PM
terrible..not surprised though, i never hear many positive things about Russians..

Russians are Slavs, Slavs are good people.

Prussian
Wednesday, August 25th, 2004, 03:25 PM
Russians are Slavs, Slavs are good people.Tell that to the German women that were violated during this time and to the millions of Germans forced by the red army's advance to leave their homelands in the true east germany.

Though I might add that isolated instances did occur where wehrmacht soldiers did break conduct on the russian front nothing happened to the extent or scale that the red army unleashed.

Grimr
Wednesday, August 25th, 2004, 03:58 PM
Tell that to the German women that were violated during this time and to the millions of Germans forced by the red army's advance to leave their homelands in the true east germany.

You could argue that this proves the evil of Communism, any body under the state of Communism even good, honest Slavs can commit vile acts.

Prussian
Wednesday, August 25th, 2004, 04:06 PM
You could argue that this proves the evil of Communism, any body under the state of Communism even good, honest Slavs can commit vile acts.Well to a certain extent this could be said as true but in the end it comes down to one's ethics & morality on such issues seriously intercourse with an elderly women is disgusting it makes me feel like vomiting & considering the fact that a male must be aroused for intercourse to take place I believe that it was not only on the grounds of order alone but more so being a willing to take part in such a despicable act, a woman of this age or any age for that matter should be respected & treated accordingly, there is no justification for mass rampant acts of rape nor is there for singular acts either.

Grimr
Wednesday, August 25th, 2004, 04:21 PM
Well to a certain extent this could be said as true but in the end it comes down to one's ethics & morality on such issues seriously intercourse with an elderly women is disgusting it makes me feel like vomiting & considering the fact that a male must be aroused for intercourse to take place I believe that it was not only on the grounds of order alone but more so being a willing to take part in such a despicable act, a woman of this age or any age for that matter should be respected & treated accordingly, there is no justification for mass rampant acts of rape nor is there for singular acts either.

Ethics and morality are obscured in Bolshevism and indeed in military action thus you cannot blame the Aryan Slavic ethnicity.

Prussian
Wednesday, August 25th, 2004, 04:37 PM
Ethics and morality are obscured in Bolshevism and indeed in military action thus you cannot blame the Aryan Slavic ethnicity.I don't blame the overall slavic family for such an occurance but the blame can be placed upon the russian armed forces & it's leadership of the time for such dispicable behavior.

Grimr
Wednesday, August 25th, 2004, 04:55 PM
I don't blame the overall slavic family for such an occurance but the blame can be placed upon the russian armed forces & it's leadership of the time for such dispicable behavior.

I agree.

Strengthandhonour
Wednesday, August 25th, 2004, 08:49 PM
Russians are Slavs, Slavs are good people.
I never said Slavs are bad people..I said I never hear good things about Russians, and from personal experiences, most Russians I know, are a bunch of proud Russians,which isn't bad, but they take great pride as the ones who defeated "The fucking nazis".

Grimr
Wednesday, August 25th, 2004, 08:54 PM
I never said Slavs are bad people..I said I never hear good things about Russians, and from personal experiences, most Russians I know, are a bunch of proud Russians,which isn't bad, but they take great pride as the ones who defeated "The fucking nazis".

Great.

WestPrussian
Wednesday, August 25th, 2004, 09:50 PM
Russians are Slavs, Slavs are good people.
You could argue that this proves the evil of Communism, any body under the state of Communism even good, honest Slavs can commit vile acts. lol So if you were to live in a Stalinist country like North Korea country you would turn into a rapist and would still consider yourself to be “good folks”? Well, I sure am glad that you are not of my kind.

Do you seriously suggest that rape is an intrinsic attribute of the Bolshevik belief system? I doubt people in Bolshevik countries are indoctrinated to be rapists while they are in grade school so by what pathways does adherence to the Bolshevik ideology transform upstanding citizens into human scum? Maybe there are no such pathways and rapists are just scum to begin with.

Here is an incident which occurred in Neidenburg in East Prussia in January 1945 which was witnessed by Alexander Solzhenitsyn and which he recounts in one of his poems (post the source for this in a separate post if you want...I couldn't make it out--+Suomut+) : " Herringstrasse no. 22. The house was not burned, just looted. From inside came a half-choked whimper. The injured mother, hovering between life and death. The young daughter lying on her bed, dead. How many had defiled her sheets? A platoon? Maybe a whole company? A little girl transformed in an instant into a woman, and a woman into a corpse ... The mother pleads: `Soldier, kill me!' ."

This is one of MILLIONS of such incidents. So you can see yourself as an actor in one of them?

The Blond Beast
Wednesday, August 25th, 2004, 10:25 PM
Though I might add that isolated instances did occur where wehrmacht soldiers did break conduct on the russian front nothing happened to the extent or scale that the red army unleashed.

The Wehrmacht spent three full years in Russia, and I guess they were fighting a war in between razing villages, stealing foodstuffs, and raping women. Only God will ever know the extent of German iniquity.

Prussian
Thursday, August 26th, 2004, 06:55 AM
The Wehrmacht spent three full years in Russia, and I guess they were fighting a war in between razing villages, stealing foodstuffs, and raping women. Only God will ever know the extent of German iniquity.Actually they were fighting a war and though there were isolated instances of rapes occuring as is to be expected though not justified in such a situation nothing can be compared to the field day the red's made of mass rape upon a civilian population.

I don't deny the fact that my side did commit some isolated unruly acts such as rape but to violate the female population to such a degree on a massive scale that is not comparable by any other this is something the red army did with professional expertise, no more then uniformed rapists.

Unlike the Red army the Wehrmacht was not known in the historical context for being mass rapists, Soviet propaganda of the time is hardly a source for historical objectiveness however I believe that historical knowledge made available by modern day historians supports the fact that the red's did commit such despicable acts of sexual criminality, simply due to the fact that the source is objective and has no biased view between the two conflicting ideologies as it is not Soviet nor National Socialist.

Remember german forces of the time are known for the objective of creating lebensraum & driving the soviets out of power in the region not to carry out an agenda of mass rape from pre-pubity girls to eldery women unlike the opposition.

xakep
Thursday, August 26th, 2004, 08:07 AM
Whatever, wherever, whenever happened in the past was not the decision of our generations. It most likely did happen on both sides, but not in such massive numbers. Antony Beevor has no evidence to support his claim, so I am really skeptical about this.

Prussian
Thursday, August 26th, 2004, 08:28 AM
Whatever, wherever, whenever happened in the past was not the decision our generations. It most likely did happen on both sides, but not in such massive numbers. Antony Beevor has no evidence to support his claim, so I am really skeptical about this.Yes a very good point it is not reflective of the current generations actions on either side of the fence, though I am not so skeptical about it as I have heard of this occurance of the red army's actions for many years now and it is still very much alive in the conciousness of german women of the period that survive today.

The Blond Beast
Thursday, August 26th, 2004, 09:24 AM
I don't deny the fact that my side did commit some isolated unruly acts such as rape but ...

Replacing "isolated unruly acts" with "untold thousands of brutal acts" makes the above more accurate.


... to violate the female population to such a degree on a massive scale that is not comparable by any other this is something the red army did with professional expertise, no more then uniformed rapists.

Indeed, such behaviour was disgraceful.


Remember german forces of the time are known for the objective of creating lebensraum & driving the soviets out of power in the region ...

Hitler always intended the war in the east to be one of annihilation:

The war against Russia will be such that it cannot be conducted in a knightly fashion. This struggle is one of ideologies and racial differences and will have to be conducted with unprecedented, unmerciful and unrelenting harshness. All officers will have to rid themselves of obsolete ideologies. ... Russia has not participated in the Hague Convention and therefore has no rights under it.

To say that the Wehrmacht fought in the east for quixotic goals in an ascetical fashion is laughable. German soldiers fought with unmitigated brutality just as their Führer had instructed; barbarism/brutality -- rape, forced starvation, and murder -- was part of the order of battle, the rule of the day, not the exception.

Grimr
Thursday, August 26th, 2004, 07:33 PM
lol So if you were to live in a Stalinist country like North Korea country you would turn into a rapist and would still consider yourself to be “good folks” ? Well, I sure am glad that you are not of my kind.

The Aryan Slavic people where mentally raped by Communism so that they could perform vile acts, it's not their fault...


Do you seriously suggest that rape is an intrinsic attribute of the Bolshevik belief system?

Yes.


I doubt people in Bolshevik countries are indoctrinated to be rapists while they are in grade school so by what pathways does adherence to the Bolshevik ideology transform upstanding citizens into human scum?

Yes.


Maybe there are no such pathways and rapists are just scum to begin with.

No, many elements create men who commit such crimes, it's mainly enviroment and belief system and that's what Communism controls with an iron grip thus Communism is to blame not the Aryan Slavic people.


Here is an incident which occurred in Neidenburg in East Prussia in January 1945 which was witnessed by Alexander Solzhenitsyn and which he recounts in one of his poems (post the source for this in a separate post if you want...I couldn't make it out--+Suomut+) : " Herringstrasse no. 22. The house was not burned, just looted. From inside came a half-choked whimper. The injured mother, hovering between life and death. The young daughter lying on her bed, dead. How many had defiled her sheets? A platoon? Maybe a whole company? A little girl transformed in an instant into a woman, and a woman into a corpse ... The mother pleads: `Soldier, kill me!' ."

This is one of MILLIONS of such incidents. So you can see yourself as an actor in one of them?

Highly emotive however Marx should take most of the blame.

Stríbog
Thursday, August 26th, 2004, 07:50 PM
The Aryan Slavic people where mentally raped by Communism so that they could perform vile acts, it's not their fault...


No, many elements create men who commit such crimes, it's mainly enviroment and belief system and that's what Communism controls with an iron grip thus Communism is to blame not the Aryan Slavic people.


So do you believe that Negro rapists are only products of a system and would cease to be criminals if they were given a better environment and educated in 'traditional values'? In the United States, they are already supposedly more "religious" and "spiritual" than whites, and they read the Bible more, pray more, etc., but this does not change the fact that the probability of a given American Negro committing rape is something like 10 to 20x higher than it is for a given white American.

Prussian
Thursday, August 26th, 2004, 09:44 PM
Replacing "isolated unruly acts" with "untold thousands of brutal acts" makes the above more accurate.You seem to be concerntrating on the overall sense of acts on the general scope where as I am talking of rape itself, though wehrmacht members did in some instances rape it was not to the extent the red army carried out, that was my point, however from both sides of the picture it is sickening, no matter where one's loyalties are.

Indeed, such behaviour was disgraceful.Agreed.

Hitler always intended the war in the east to be one of annihilation.Again I am focusing the arguement in the comparision of rape itself between the two forces, no doubt you are correct in the overall sense that cannot be denied but again the focus is on the practice of rape at a massive level within a paticular force.

Grimr
Thursday, August 26th, 2004, 11:25 PM
So do you believe that Negro rapists are only products of a system and would cease to be criminals if they were given a better environment and educated in 'traditional values'? In the United States, they are already supposedly more "religious" and "spiritual" than whites, and they read the Bible more, pray more, etc., but this does not change the fact that the probability of a given American Negro committing rape is something like 10 to 20x higher than it is for a given white American.

Rape is a product of environment and the Negroes when left to their own devices create bad environments, these environments lead them to commit vile acts! If you place a Negro in an artificially good environment he will not cause crime or rape.

The situation with the good Aryan Slavs was that they were placed in an artifically bad environment, which then leads them to commit vile acts, in contrast with the Negroe if the Slav is left to his own devices, and then he will create good environments that will lead him to do good things.

Prussian
Thursday, August 26th, 2004, 11:54 PM
Rape is a product of environment and the Negroes when left to their own devices create bad environments, these environments lead them to commit vile acts! If you place a Negro in an artificially good environment he will not cause crime or rape.

The situation with the good Aryan Slavs was that they were placed in an artifically bad environment, which then leads them to commit vile acts, in contrast with the Negroe if the Slav is left to his own devices, and then he will create good environments that will lead him to do good things.Well I heard of an instance a while back now, where a Negroe politician in Washington was caught hitting the crack pipe is this a product of a good environment considering the guy was out of the ghetto but what I think it comes down to is behavioral patterns which overrule belief systems in this instance, because the negro may have been out of the ghetto but the ghetto was still in him.

Grimr
Friday, August 27th, 2004, 12:04 AM
Well I heard of an instance a while back now, where a Negroe politician in Washington was caught hitting the crack pipe is this a product of a good environment considering the guy was out of the ghetto but what I think it comes down to is behavioral patterns which overrule belief systems in this instance, because the negro may have been out of the ghetto but the ghetto was still in him.

Negroes will eventually destroy good environments like they destroyed the Egyptian empire and they will also destroy western civilisation.

In contrast with Negroes Aryans such as Slavs have the capacity to make a bad environment better like after the very large animals died out in Europe the Caucasians turned from hunters to farmers to survive and ultimately create a better way of life though struggle. Like uncle Adolf said "Struggle is the farther of all things."

Prussian
Friday, August 27th, 2004, 12:16 AM
Negroes will eventually destroy good environments like they destroyed the Egyptian empire and they will also destroy western civilisation.

In contrast with Negroes Aryans such as Slavs have the capacity to make a bad environment better like after the very large animals died out in Europe the Caucasians turned from hunters to farmers to survive and ultimately create a better way of life though struggle. Like uncle Adolf said "Struggle is the farther of all things."So you are stating that Negroes regardless of environment or belief system are programmed in their behavioral patterns to act in such a manner?

If so why would it come down to impact on negroes alone as every singular race has it genetic behavioral programming in the group sense of course there can be exceptions in the individual sense.

I agree in the sense that the european seems to have through an historical perspective an ability to adapt to a changing situation in order to survive, though all creeds have the instinct to survive there is some truth in the fact that on an overall view that europeans seemed to have greater success at the initial adaption.

Though I still do not think that such instances of come down to the blame of ideological doctrine alone furthermore I believe in my opinion it is blend of a lot of different factors to create such events, though we as europeans have the capacity to create much good we also have the capacity to do much destruction also.

I think another thing is also not more so the ability itself but potential to create thus becoming an ability, potential comes down to deciding to act and following through alone, as we have the inherent potential to further ourselves & survive the current situation as Europeans though the question remains we will succeed or not, that comes down to potential.

GFM Schörner
Tuesday, August 31st, 2004, 02:06 PM
Ethics and morality are obscured in Bolshevism and indeed in military action thus you cannot blame the Aryan Slavic ethnicity.
I agree with you very much.
We have to understand, that in war almost everyone can become a monster.
Only the best ones, will not.
Then cumulate the bolshewik propaganda of people like Ehrenburg, and things become understandable - not excusable.
The overall better behaviour of the german soldier, was not because he is a better human.
We have to keep in mind, that the overall discipline and morale in the german nation was very high.
The jewish-propaganda (at the western or the eastern alliied countries), aimes directly to the lowest human-feelings. It tries to create real hate about the enemy, while german-propaganda was always more about stiffening own morale.
As example i want to take the US-propaganda against the Iraqis in Kuwait. Or the well known propaganda in WWI, as we Germans eating children or gassing 6 million jews.
Unitl WWI, we Europeans always treated the loser with a certain amount of respect. Unconditional surrender was unthinkable. There was an oponent, an enemy, but not eternal hate.
Since the jews took over total control of the western plutocraties (jewish Bolshevism anyway), the defeated enemy is not an honorable enemy anymore, but a criminal without any ethics.
From that time on, the western world always fights against the pure evil. Not for certain economic or national interests, no just against the evil and for the good.
And this kind of propaganda, leads to soldiers full of hate against the enemy.
In oposition to that, the german propaganda, in good european tradition, only slightly tried to turn the enemy in a non-honorable oponent.

And last but not least, the german-military tradition and the german military-courts, were the strictest of all armys.

So i would really plead, not to blame the Slavs in that case, but even more the system, which is celebrated in Germany as liberator!
Our hate should focus directly on the system, not the nations or people.

Especially we NAtionalists have to prepare for the future: when the plutocratic system will fall way deeper into it's own crisis, it will do everything, to seed hate between the nations again. And it is really easy to do so. Especially in mass-media times.
We Nationalists will have to be extremely prepared to use our mind, to discover the real enemy and not let us not distract from him, with the artificial fog-clouds of the system.

Hail white race!

GFM Schörner
Tuesday, August 31st, 2004, 02:33 PM
Rape is a product of environment and the Negroes when left to their own devices create bad environments, these environments lead them to commit vile acts!
Following your argumentation, we Germans after the war, must have been mass-rapers. :)
You surely heard about the crisis in Sudan. Do you know what happenes in the camps? Mass rapes.

Can you imagine that in a camp of whites? Me not. The rapers would be immedeately killed.

Have you heard of mass-rapes of white men in South Africa? No, but since Apartheid liberated the Negroes, it has become quite usual - ofcourse not commited by the Whites. ;)

The answer to this lies, as so often, in the genes: Negroes have a higher level of Testosteron and Adrenaline. They are biologically different. Well adapted for Africa, but not for the highly developed civilization of the white and yellow race.

As i tried to show earlier, the 'Russians' did, with the mass-rapes something, that lies out of their normal being.
Although the Slavs have not such a highly productive culture like all the germanic nations - i guess because of the isolation during the last ice-age, the germanic and celtic people became that efficient and looking forward - they are highly civilized nations with beautiful cultures and are not that much different from germanic people, that we could not understand them and vice versa.
But one thing is clear: the Slav will only respect a proud German nation and not what we have today and he will never help us Germans, to become free again. This is our part and not the part of the Slavs.
But if our nordic brothers would someday finally wake up from their centuries lasting winter-sleep, they could help us Germans please? ;)

Marius
Tuesday, August 31st, 2004, 03:02 PM
Yes, in this matter, I have testimonies of my grand-parents. The Russian soldiers used to rape the women on the conquered teritorries. My grandmother stayed, in NW Romania, hidden for four days, until the Russians passed the town.

And yes, also, every Germanic woman which was caught (I refer to the Saxons in Transylvania or the Schwabs in Banat) was in this situation. But, as I said before, it was not only them, but also the Romanian women, too. This, inspite of the fact Romania went on the Allied side on August the 23rd 1944.

Nehaj
Tuesday, August 31st, 2004, 06:03 PM
Rape, torture, murder: where there is life, these are hardly to be considered foreign concepts. Everyone did it, everyone does it.

And yet, until recently I thought Jews were the only ones to complain about it.

No longer. But if the complaint has something to do with Dresden, and the air strikes by allied forces; well, I might pretend to show some sympathy. For, Nazis, shamelessly, did their utmost to be acknowledged (this stolen from Naruto :D) by the English.

Slavs, on the other hand were declared sub human, to be annihilated, enslaved, exploited. Millions upon millions died. 50 for a wounded, 100 for a killed german soldier.

Now, when it turned out that Germans, in spite of all the deceit and cruelty they learned from their masters, ended up as untermen, wtf? 50 for wounded, 100 for a killed, no?

Look, this might be hard for you to accept. But Germany you believe in died with Hitler. Forever. What remained, and was salvaged by the infinite grace of the Slavic peoples (Russians first and foremost), was sown with and by the stronger and better.

What makes one believe that all is not lost, and the Reich might yet arise, well whatever that is, I am certain it has nothing to do with the "Russians were raping every German female" and such effeminate bulshit.

At this point I am tempted to write something about the reputation German women enjoy in the world, or their affinity (to put it mildly) for Gypsy men, or ... but I will not because it will probably end up being blamed on Russian soldiers.

GFM Schörner
Tuesday, August 31st, 2004, 06:49 PM
Rape, torture, murder: where there is life, these are hardly to be considered foreign concepts. Everyone did it, everyone does it.

Can you provide some facts, where German or Axis-soldiers were allowed to rape, or where mass-rapes of German soldiers took place?
Not even at the Nürnberg-trials, shuch a bullshit was claimed.

We Germans have to live with the Holohoax lie now and with the 'crime', of taking the power of the jews in Europe away and deporting them out of Europe into the east (there are times to come, when we will be honored for that fight against jewry).
WWII was hard and cruel. But our soldiers were not even in the bolshevik propaganda rapers. :)


Slavs, on the other hand were declared sub human, to be annihilated, enslaved, exploited. Millions upon millions died.
Do you mean the 11 million under Lenin?
Or the millions in Stalin's Gulags?
Or do you think we Germans are even guilty, for the tactics of red army officers, that used own soldiers as meat-stocks?

How comes, that you lament about a quite small amount of victims, but do not lament the slaughtering of the Communists and the idea of the communistic world-revolution, that was the reason for the german preemtive strike?

Nehaj
Tuesday, August 31st, 2004, 07:27 PM
"Rape has never been the concern of the international community," Justice Goldstone said in an interview in an early stage of the investigations. (http://www.pixelpress.org/bosnia/context/0628warcrimes-tribunal.html)

If you come to my house with a gun in your hand, you kill my father and my brother, (in some cases rape my mother and my sister), burn my barn down, start calling yourself a master, treating me like I am less then a human, like a slave, you better make sure you know what you are doing, and you better make sure you win. For if you don't, oh man, if you don't...

When a lion takes over a pride, first thing he does, he kills all the cubs and inseminates all the females. Cute little cubs, he, the noble king of animals. What do you expect a bunch of monkeys to do?

Don't get me wrong. I am not supporting rape or murder. And I think Germans to be noble, courageous, exemplary soldiers. But when I see you display character traits you so despise in others (i.e. Jews), I start wondering if the opinion of my ancestors might have been wrong.

Prince Eugen
Tuesday, August 31st, 2004, 08:23 PM
Every german soldier who was arrested to rape was hunged by the German military authorities at the occupied countries!

Zyklop
Tuesday, August 31st, 2004, 08:31 PM
If you come to my house with a gun in your hand, you kill my father and my brother, (in some cases rape my mother and my sister), burn my barn down, start calling yourself a master, treating me like I am less then a human, like a slave, you better make sure you know what you are doing, and you better make sure you win. For if you don't, oh man, if you don't...


So you want to tell us you are some kind of a tough guy?

Nehaj
Tuesday, August 31st, 2004, 09:31 PM
'Us'? You suffer from multiple personality disorder? Or you only dare open you rmouth when there is a mob to back you up? But hey, you are free to come and find out (you are welcome to stay at my place as a guest).

There is a reason why the Third Reich failed. And the rapes by Russian soldiers are not it.

The situation brings Russians and Germans and others, especially of the views the posters of this forum exhibit, together. In spite of who are/were. Other nations do not necessarily see Germans in the same light they see themselves--go ask Dostoevski, for example. But take some pride in who you are, both in your good and your evil.

Did you ever read the story of Atreus? IE mythology is full of them. The culpirts: Our gods and heroes. So why acting surprised, apologetic, as a victim?

But if you find yourself offended when I say I am tired of people constantly looking backwards, of accusations, of my father hated your father shit, fine: That big negro, he ain't gonna rape your little girl; he be making love to her softly.

Zyklop
Tuesday, August 31st, 2004, 09:51 PM
'Us'? You suffer from multiple personality disorder? Or you only dare open you rmouth when there is a mob to back you up? But hey, you are free to come and find out (you are welcome to stay at my place as a guest).

Oh, so tough! :-O
Don´t your parents get upset when you invite people without their consent?

The Blond Beast
Tuesday, August 31st, 2004, 10:00 PM
One cannot expect rationality and compassion from someone who has had to march past the bodies of his wife and children, especially when that someone is put in a position to exact revenge.

Nehaj
Tuesday, August 31st, 2004, 10:19 PM
I very well know what it means to lose someone, and to suffer grave injustice by the hand of the 'victor' (in 1st person). And I am not even Russian, nor do I really care much for them. Not that I am amazed by Germans, either, but I do find German culture closer to my heart. And so on...

The thing is, lately all I see is an enless wave of German apologists, of people with 'Germans were victims too' attitudes, etc. You guys are turning into the people you profess to despise. Maybe in some secret underground base in Bavaria, the Hitler's dream is still alive, and the alien-like technology awaits. Let's hope. And, and I am no expert, but if the Reich is to come for the 4th time, hmm, you will have to reinvent yourselves. And likely form alliances.

You once paid a steep price for your image. If you are guilty of anything, it is of being naive.

Nehaj
Tuesday, August 31st, 2004, 10:24 PM
Don´t your parents get upset when you invite people without their consent?
Not really. But if you insist, I'll ask them first. :D

GFM Schörner
Tuesday, August 31st, 2004, 11:44 PM
If you come to my house with a gun in your hand, you kill my father and my brother, (in some cases rape my mother and my sister), burn my barn down,
And what if, i come to your house, because your father was just preparing to invade my house and all i did was just running out of my house and being faster than your father?
It is essential, not to neglect the historic facts, because only they let us understand action and reaction.

Your conclusion is right, if it is the reality the propaganda tells you. Then you'll think, i come to your house to rob it.
And nevertheless, it says nothing, about the reasons.
History is always a sequence of action and reaction.

And it is an interesting historic fact, that the german attack was a preemtive strike. So how about the evil Slavs, that tried to conquer Europe?
You see, your example with the house doesn't work.


start calling yourself a master,
Such an argument is ridiculous. You seem to forget, that it was war.
What would have happened after the war, after a peace-contract, you don't know. But if you take a look at Vichy-France, you see, how 'bad' we Germans behaved as 'occupants'.
The german soldier had to leave the sidewalk, before a french citizen had to leave it!
Can you imagine, that a russian soldier, after the war, goes to a german dentist and when a german citizen comes, the german comes first?
Well, a norwegian girlfriend told me that about the 'evil' german occupants in Norway. And this behaviour took place during war!

And what you call german 'master' in the east: what else should the german soldier have done? Let the partisans operate freely?
Do not confiscate war-necessary things?
Don't you know, that the german soldier usually had to pay and was not allowed to plunder?
You have obviously no clue about the initial behaviour of the german soldier.

Yes, with the unbelievable massacres of russian partisans and some units, the war became rougher. But the escalation was a fierce concept of the communists.
And it worked.


treating me like I am less then a human, like a slave, you better make sure you know what you are doing, and you better make sure you win.
Examples and facts please! My grandparents had polish foreign-workers, today called 'slave-workers' on their farm.
Well, while the german youth was dying on the battlefields, they could work on farms.
And do you know what? Those poor 'slaves', kept the contact alive even after the war, because they were treated from my germanic Übermenschen-grandparents as Untermenschen! :D
And this was not unique. Many of them claimed later, that it was the best time in their life. Compared to the standard of living in Russia or east Poland, the german level was like in paradise.
It's like today (although our country was completely destroyed, all machines and patents were robbed and we paid enourmous amount of money to the winners).

There were also people, who treated the workers not like normal workers. Some treated them really bad. Bad characters. Untermenschen. But nevertheless it had nothing in common with the anti-german propaganda.

Ofcourse there were real slave-workers, too. But mostly jews were used for that tasks.
And i can't follow your strange logic: why should i become a rapist of children, if hear from my propaganda bad things about the enemy?
A certain amount of being out of healthy normality is necessary, to be able to rape children or 80 year old women, isn't it?
And the 'Russians', better the Red Army acted even worse (well this will become an interesting field for historians, to find out, how massive Slavs commited that or Mongolian/Asians).
What i know from certain witnesses, is that the officers mostly looked white, and often enough were the rescue for women, while the normal soldiers looked mongolic, at least not really white like europeans.

If you can explain such a bestial behaviour with revenge, then i definately cannot understand you. I can imagine killing civilians as revenge. But mass raping children or old women? Never! Only real Untermenschen do that.

The german soldier saw with his own eyes, how his comrades had to die, how they looked like without eyes, cutted down genitals, or without intestines. Normal partisan activity.
But the german soldiers or anti-partisan special commandos, nevertheless didn't imitate that and compared with the bestiality of the partisans, i even wonder, that the discipline could have kept under control and no stronger actions were taken against partisan-activity.
Because of the unbelievable fierce partisan-activity the war in the east and in Yugoslavia escalated that much!
This activity is well documented but the german documents, which fell completely into the hands of the winners, are mostly still kept secret.
Wait, until the whole truth about the war in the east will come out.
No one will be talking about the 'evil' germans anymore and the Russians themselfes will become shocked, how 'their' Red Army behaved...

And the german soldier didn't start to cut of genitals, too.
No, he started sometimes to burn down whole villages, which were used as bases for partisans. A crime? Depends on the ratio.
1:10 was allowed by the Haager Landkriegsordnung (HLO) and German soldiers in the West never executed more civilians, than allowed by it.
But the USSR didn't sign it. So what is claimed a crime, could be no crime at all.
Bestiality? IMO no!
The cutting out of eyes or cutting down of tongues of wounded soldiers?
Definately. No matter, if he is called 'winner' or 'liberator'.
Because of the absolutely bestiality of the partisans, the ratio was set sometimes higher than 1:10 (the US, as HLO signing state, and the good ones praying equality, used 1:80(!) without any partisan bestiality).

To me it sounds really ridiculous, if Russians or Serbs are lamenting about the brutal Germans, but on the other hand are praising their partisan activity.
Either you don't really know, how the partisans behaved, or you must be sick, too.
And it doesn't speak for your integrity, if you are not able to differenciate between raping and bestiality and an execution.
Well the red hordes prooved, they didn't know about the difference, too.

Maybe this is one of the differences between Slavs and germanic people: it takes some time, but once the furor teutonicus is in action, the birds fall down from the sky, but he doesn't take a bath in blood. He kills his enemies fast and efficiently while the Slavs maybe like to see the enemy suffer and are able for bestialities, a german can hardly imagine.
Indeed the history gives us several examples.

I hoped i were wrong, but the comparison of apples and bears, shows me some incompetence to see the fundamental difference between bestiality and sadism on one side and vengeance and fast killing on the other side.

And finally we have another evidence, that the german soldier behaved quite decent: the former occupied countries and what their people have to tell. Not the jews and plutocrats that came back after war and what the mass media tell. No, the normal people, who lived under the german occupation.
And this i compare to what people can tell about the 'russian' occupations (not only in WWII).
Two different worlds.

Nehaj
Wednesday, September 1st, 2004, 05:33 AM
And what if, i come to your house, because your father was just preparing to invade my house and all i did was just running out of my house and being faster than your father? Well, if Germans made it straight for Russia, I would fully agree with your statement. But please do list the names of 'liberated' countries at the outset of 'Barbarossa'. (Some quite reknown historians claim it was the delay in Balkans that cost Hitler the victory.) Now, most of those countries had significant pre-war German populations, with considerable economic and political prestige within the society. So, on the one hand there is a bunch of countries in love with their German minorities, German generosity, German magnificence, etc, and on the other hand there is a pressing need to conquer them all, because, well, they are all scheming dogs ready to invade and pillage and rape?

But if you argue it was a concerted plan that all the Slavic countries were a part of-- :D--I know you Germans have high opinion of yourselves, but this is even out of Jahweh league.

Partisans, hmm, there were partisans in Germany (however few), and in Italy, and many other countries beside Russia. While there was definitely some degree of coordination and cooperations, these Bandits (first you call them bandits, then you make them pay) were hardly more than a cross section of the local populations. Some where gay, many were Jewish, many more extremely brutal--but as you said, it was war, they mellowed down down the road--there were no mass rapes going on in the DDR in the 80s.

Go to most any ex-communist country. And talk to the people--to your noble peasants, for example. Many a person will tell you how good people had it during the communism. How their lives were never better etc, etc. Even in Romania. Chaushesku's Romania.

The more you describe Germans during WWII, the more I have a feeling: Man, it sounds just as US occupation of Irak. Please tell me it isn't so.

Millions upon millions died. Brothers killed brothers (literally), raped the mothers. All over the Europe. Terrible shit went on during those years. And Germany, whether you want to admit it or not, was one of the main players on the stage. If you want points for style, sure, the death never looked as sexy as in a SS uniform.

If you were playing Greek gods during those years, thinking you were reenacting a part in a Bayreuther Festspiele, remember, you are also responsible for your dogs' behavior. And your dogs were running rampant, with testicles hanging from their bloodied mouths. Russia, England, China, any of them great empires on the Earth, it was not the charity work, their humanity that made them so. From Indra to Stalin and Mao: rape, torture and murder.

You went to play with the big kids, you got your asses handed to you. You are still cool. Just stop crying already.

GFM Schörner
Wednesday, September 1st, 2004, 12:38 PM
Well, if Germans made it straight for Russia, I would fully agree with your statement. But please do list the names of 'liberated' countries at the outset of 'Barbarossa'.
This leads us to a long history-discussion, but only a few facts:
1. Rheinland - not german?
2. Sudetenland - not german?
3. Deutsch Österreich - do you know, that ALL parties in Austria, even the Socialists were pro Anschluß (the unity with the Reich)? You know, who forbid the self proclamed name 'Deutsch Österreich? So we weren't even allowed to choose name ourselfes.

The lie from the independent Austrian nation was established after the lost WWII, initially by the Communists.
Today in Austria we have a funny situation: people - except Vienna - look german, the children still mostly are blonde and have blue eyes, the names of the villages are german, we speak german, we have by law protected national minorities like Hungarians, Croatians, Poles, Gypisis :~( but guess what ethnic group in Austria doesn't exsist... ;(
And our 'great' state even has in it's constitution(!) a law, that forbids political parties to demand the unity with Germany. But what is more shocking: the masses feel free.
Yep, the principle of bread and games. It really works.
This country today is maybe one of the most scizophrenic in the world: our 'great' Kaiser, Maria Theresia or Franz Josef are celebrated everywhere and politians trie to profit from the glamour, but that the Habsburger where over several hundred years German Kaisers and always said loud, to be Germans? This fact, you will not find in a single schoolbook. Germans do simply not exist in Austria, today. Claiming on TV to be German, means the immediate outlawing.
If you are a jew, a gipsy, gay or pedophile - that's ok. But a german in Austria?
And this is really possible, after the only real genozide, that happened after 1945, in peace, although all are stating the jewish bullshit: 'Never again'. Your argumentation, that things need to be well known, if they were a fact, doesn't hold.

The western system has the best propaganda-system ever. Because there is no hard censorship (except only a few dangerous topics), people believe in the story-tale of the 'free-press'. That capitalism controls everything without weapons, just by the power of money, they don't see. The soldiers for the plutocrats, are the managers. Yes, these people have more blood on thier hands, than the worst invented KZ-butcher. And those who are damning the NS, are the best supporters for them. Funny, eh?

And additionally the USA have the best developed psychological warfare, ever. Goebbels was a NOBODY, compared to the US-system of psychological warfare.
People even don't know, that Hollywood, is part of that. They even defend Hollywood, if someone tells them, how Hollywood is used to manipulate the masses.
And what is really frustrating is, that sometimes self-confident politicians even admit that, but no one listens.

Black becomes white and vice versa.
You don't believe that?
Simply turn on TV. Look at the multicultural brainwashing program from Hollywood, over MTV to the advertisement and then take a look at reality.
That should be enough, to realize, that it is pure fiction, the western system tries to create in peoples minds.

And the whole power of misinformation and propaganda, which is not easily to expose as propaganda for the people, rolled over Europe after WWII.
Never before, that many books were burnt. To make it even more ridiculous, the jewish system shows us always the evil Germans, that burnt the jewish books! HAHAHA! Yes we burnt them (and i'm really proud of that!) and we showed the whole world why.
The one with the clean conscience, has nothing to hide!
The other one can only act secretly. The Jew.

12 millions of expelled germans but Germany turned into a 'liberated' country! What a great work of propaganda. Even the victims believed, they were liberated!
A whole nation kept in mental-disorder. And with it, all european nations are believing the jewish lies and therefore ofcourse are not capable to choose the right solutions for the problems, too.
Indeed, with Germany, whole Europe is kept in the chains of the jewish lies and they know, the key for the awakening of aryan Europe lies in Germany and no where else.

Millions of raped women, simply don't exist, because the documents are in the archieves of the winners and the mass-media, which are the key, are under control of the winners, the internationalists, too.
But on the other hand, therfore we have the embarrassing Holohoax lie.
We have awful movies showing mountains of corpes and the voice claims, they were gassed. The movie can't tell the truth. The masses simply believe, what it is told to them. They don't see, that deseases like Typhi or Cholera make people look like that after a few weeks.
They don't know, that there are photos from the real liberations of the KLs in the soviet archives hidden very well...
The masses see what comes from the authorities and believe.
Especially the blue eyed Germans. Like Napoleon said: there can be no lie stupid enough, that not a German is willing to believe it.

Ofcourse the masses are also not able to use their mind and make their own conclusions, by counting 1+1 together. Masses believe every lie, no matter how stupid it is: if the sories about the KZs were true, how comes it, that the majority freely went with the SS-guards torwards the west? Doesn't that fit perfectly into the fact, that over 800 SS-members were sentenced to death by SS-courts, because they abused prisoners? How many US-soldiers are senteced to death, becasue of what they do in Iraq?
That the commander Hoess was removed from Auschwitz and was replaced? And that the last commander of Aufschwitz, didn't confess any gassings and today we have the Hoess-papers only, but this last commander, randomly died before a was put to a trial?
That Simon Wiesenthal and friends survived 5 death campsover years?

How is it possible, that a trial against Eichmann takes place, and everyone believes, this tortured man told the truth, although he was talking about blood-fountains coming out of the earth, because so many jews were buried?
How is it possible, that the whole world is tricked into the biggest lie - and, btw, not a good one, because it's full of typical jewish exaggerations - in history, although the weapon for the murder and the corpse are missing?
Yeah, the perfect murder is possible. And the German SS-Übermenschen even did it with 6 millions! A case for inspector Columbo! :D
But that's the next strange thing: the only scientific chemical examinations even prooved, that the gas-chambers never saw Zyklon-B!

If such a lie is possible, what else is possible, if the inventors of the lie, have all original documents of the loser stolen and control the media?

But back to the 'liberated' countries:
so you really believe, what you think to know about evil Germany, is the truth, without reading the arguments from the other side and afterwards building your own opinion?

4. Poland: take a look at the German offers. Only a small corridor with a Autobahn and a railway-connection to the 90% german city of Danzig.
No giving back of the other robbed land.
You know what Hitler said, about the generous offers torwards Poland? No other German politician could dare to make such an offer. He would be driven away immediately.

Each single war has mostly a very interesting cause, that has nothing in common with the resons published for the masses and you guess right: the REAL cause for German intervention, was never the one, told by the winners.

5. Norway: only a few hours faster than Britain. Absolutely war necessary becasue of Germany's geostrategic position. Another unwanted, but necessary war.

The interesting facts about the reasons, simply do not exist in the schoolbooks or mass-media of the internationalists and therefore it's like they never existed. There you always read the same stupid stereotype of the mad Hitler and the evil, imperialistic Germans. That's good for Hollywood, but not good for understanding history and politics.
But who has an interest, that people understand the real reasons and connections? The USA, with their 180 wars since 1945?
The eastcoast-jews, with their enourmous profits? Israel? The plutocratic systems in Britain and France and everywhere in the world established by the same forces, that won WWII?
Not really.

And you surely know, that it's easy to turn the meaning of a text into it's opposite, just by leaving certain words.
It's not even necessary to invent lies. It's enough to keep silence over certain facts. And this happens with the reasons, that led to WWII.
All pro-german facts, are suppressed with the whole power of the system. Why?

Because those forces who won the war, are the same, who rule the whole world today, and they did what was necessary to get Germany, as carrier of a new idea, the idea of racial-idealism in oposition to jewish materialism and as first biopolitical-system in mankinds history, into a war and completely destroy it and get the idea out of pleoples brains again.

Many people blame Adolf Hitler, that he should have avoided the conflict and he were too aggressive. A closer look at the historic facts, the numerous german offers and compromises, prooves clearly the oposite.
Hitler was extremely pragmatic.
Have you never asked yourself, why on earth, do we always hear the story of Lebensraum in the east from a book written as an arrested opposition politician, but we hear nothing about the diplomatical measures or initiatives taken by the German or several Alliied governments? Are there no papers and documents, so that we really need a 16 year old book of an arrested opposition politician?
Shouldn't that fact, make a critical citizen distrustful enough, to search for the withheld facts himself, if no one in the 'free', 'democratic' system with his 'free press' and 'free media' has obviously interest, to tell him about?

Show me any other government, that would have accepted such provocations from the USA, as the german government accepted?

IMO the only way to avoid the war with the Plutocrats would have been, that the old economical system would have been restored in Germany. But the elimination of the jewish interest-slavery, was THE key to break the jewish power (just now look into Iraq and you see, that they make war for much less!).
Yes, the real cause of WWII lies in the invention of a new, far superior economical-model, which combined the positive effects of private initiative, social responibility stiffened with the enourmous motivation of Nationalism, without the negative effects of planned-economy, that wasn't built on interests and a look on today's universities prooves it: only the jewish interest-slavery is thought, everyone repeats the bullshit of necessary economical growth, but no one asks: why do we teally need endless growth in this system?

You are a nationalist, but do forget, that the Internationalists have won the war?
The lost WWII for Germany, was - i only can repeat it always - a lost war for the European nations, for all Nationalists.

It was a fight of political systems, not between nations. But it was a fight of the internationalists in New York and Moscow against all Nations (except one, ofcourse).
60 years ago, only few wise people were able to understand, what forces were acting and what targets they have.
And they became even less, because many ate the jewish lies afterwards.
But today, as it's obvious and they even can allow to say it loud, already: to try to biologically destroy the aryan nations, that 'never again' things like in WWII are possible?
Everyone not completely brainwashed should be able to see, what is going on in our countries.
Wake up, my friend!
That a nationalist today, as the white aryan race is already strongly threatened even in it's nordic gene-pool, still believes in the jewish lie about the dangerous Germany, is hard to understand.
Our women can't go out tonight anymore, parents live in danger that their children become junkies and we lose our countries to the millions of dark-skinned, racially different immigrants, but Nationalism and Germany was the enemy for the nations! Oh, god.

Today we see clearer than ever before: every brave soldier fighting against the New Germany, was nothing more than a useful idiot for the jews on their way to world-domination.

From the point of view of the plutocrats, the german economics with it's barter-system were a absolutely deadly threat for Capitalism (hey, they lost almost whole South-America as trade partner - these states preferred to trade for a correct price their goods, instead of giving the goods away for almost nothing, like today. In the 1930s it was the gold-dollar, today it is because of debts and interests, thanks to 'helping institutions' like World Bank, IWF or UNO.

And on the other side, Marxism as winner, as the natural enemy of all nations and cultures, becasue it want's to destroy all cultures and traditions to build afterwards a 'new human' and 'a better world'.



Now, most of those countries had significant pre-war German populations, with considerable economic and political prestige within the society. So, on the one hand there is a bunch of countries in love with their German minorities, German generosity, German magnificence, etc, and on the other hand there is a pressing need to conquer them all, because, well, they are all scheming dogs ready to invade and pillage and rape?
The germans always were admired by one part and hated by the others.
You forget, that those people who were german-friendly in Great Britain, in France, in the eastern european countries, were removed from power from the winners, the Internationalists and were made shut up with the same Holohoax-propaganda like the Germans themselfes.

Everyone believes a Jew Simon Wiesenthal with his ridiculous soap-story more, than the German government, the german soldiers and the non-german volunteers. Ok, so far non Germans can follow, but you must know, that we Germans today even believe the Wiesenthals more, than our own grandparents or parents!
Imagine the damage this lie causes in a nation.
A nation that believes their parents were liars and that believes everything that comes from the jews and it's 'liberators'.
This is the biggest cultural destruction in history and one of the most severe crimes ever.
But as everyone can easily understand, what will happen, once the german Fritz will discover, he was betrayed and that his justice-fanatism was misused by the Jews, to increase their power, keep himself down and ashamed and even to destroy europe biologically that it never again will be able to brek the jewish chains?
Then maybe the jews will discover, what a self-fullfilling-prophecy really is!

White turned black and the lie turned into truth.
That's the reason, why 'denying' the Holocaust, is if not forbidden in general, then at least prosecuted with the whole power of the system, everyone is tried to become ruined, if he simply doesn't believe the earth is flat.
On this biggest lie of all times, hangs the whole reputation of the Jews and the Alliies. If this lie collapses, then all the answers given from the winners of WWII, will be asked again.
And this is extremely dangerous for the Internationalists.
Becasue if the nations discover, that it was not 'evil' Nationalism, that lead to this war, but the Internationalists with their will to squeeze the whole world and all nations und their universal power, then they would lose everything.

But before that can happen, they try to remove the roots of Nationalism: to destroy the nations biologically or at least, to create everywhere 'multicultural' populations, to make it impossible for national-forces, to reach power again. And they even admit that in the meanwhile, becasue they feel so safe and close to the finish.



But if you argue it was a concerted plan that all the Slavic countries were a part of-- :D--I know you Germans have high opinion of yourselves, but this is even out of Jahweh league.
As i tried to explain, politics is way more complicated. The masses don't count. They are manipulated, where they shall go.
But politics uses certain wishes or aversions, or if necessary, creates them, to get the masses where they shall move.

If you are really interested to understand the REAL principles politics, besides the propaganda phrases for the masses, I can highly recommend you a few books:
Gustave Le Bon, Psychology of the masses (this is a shocker - after this book, you will see politics through other eyes, guaranteed).
Niccolo Macciavelli, Il Principe (Der Fürst)
Victor Ostrovsky, Geheimakte Mossad (don't know the english title) - Another shocker - this book reveals to everyone the importance of secret services and how tremendously useful they are for the system and how they make real politics



Partisans, hmm, there were partisans in Germany (however few), and in Italy, and many other countries beside Russia. While there was definitely some degree of coordination and cooperations, these Bandits (first you call them bandits, then you make them pay) were hardly more than a cross section of the local populations. Some where gay, many were Jewish, many more extremely brutal--but as you said, it was war, they mellowed down down the road--there were no mass rapes going on in the DDR in the 80s.
This is correct, but those who made the bestialities, were not the same people, that took power. That's nowhere the case.
The difference lies in those who have the power: do they use Untermenschen and their bestiality to reach their targets, or do they try to keep the killing as clean as possible.
And additionally, after a system has reached power and eliminated the opposition, it would be counter-productive, to allow the Untermenschen to continue with the bestiality. Then they are no longer 'necessary'.
And as German i have to say, that i'm proud, that Germany did not follow these 'effective' principles to reach it's targets.
In this war it always tried to stay german.
On one hand i'm sad, that it didn't pay the enemies back with the same coin. Way too much jews and plutocrats survived the KZs or came back from abroad to contiue with their dirty business (hey, i heard after Switzerland, Austria, now Poland comes into the visor of the eternal jew - they want 'their' houses in east-poland back; although they all were murdered in the Holocaust, as we all know. :D But as we know, too from honorable persons like Eli Wiesel: the Holocaust cannnot be understood with the human mind - it is way too awful), where they were stopped 1933, but i'm sure, that at least with the collape of captialism, the truth will come out and then Adolf Hitler will be seen (again), as one of the biggest leaders, political prophets and protector of all aryan nations.



Go to most any ex-communist country. And talk to the people--to your noble peasants, for example. Many a person will tell you how good people had it during the communism. How their lives were never better etc, etc. Even in Romania. Chaushesku's Romania.
I agree with you!
The reason of the cold war was, that Stalin wasn't willing to pay his lend-and-lease bills to the jews.
During the war against Germany he already recognized, that not the 'International solidarity' stiffens the morale, but only nationalism. The great war for the father land was invented. Suddenly the communists turned into panslavic nationalists. Ofcourse they never meant it honest, but the trick worked.
And with the lost world revolution (that was destroyed by Adolf Hitler, right when the red wave should have started to roll over Europe), Communism was already defeated. From that time on, it was in the defensive and it had to give the masses what they wanted, instead of creating the 'new human'.
Therefore the real communism left more and more the marxistic way and it even strenghtend nationalistic feelings, to make the people stay behind the iron-courtain.

Due to that development, indeed, Communism did not destroy the nations culture that much, as the western liberalism did. Well, people unlearned to labour, but their whole orientation stayed more intact, than in the west.
A good example is middle-germany and west-germany. The people in middle-germany are way more german and want to stay german, than in west-germany.
The same with the Slovakians or Poland.
Ofcourse these nations receive now the same brainwashing program of the international capitalists.


The more you describe Germans during WWII, the more I have a feeling: Man, it sounds just as US occupation of Irak. Please tell me it isn't so. What do you mean with that?


Millions upon millions died. Brothers killed brothers (literally), raped the mothers. All over the Europe. Terrible shit went on during those years. And Germany, whether you want to admit it or not, was one of the main players on the stage.
Ofcourse! Germany, or better the New Order in Germany, was a deadly threat for Capitalism. And sadly in the east, they dreamt from world revolution.
The war against Germany was already decided, when the New Germany arised during the year 1933.
The international jewry declared war on Germany in 1933 and it took some time, to get the stupid Goy running for them. But they did.



If you want points for style, sure, the death never looked as sexy as in a SS uniform.
Then there is hope for you: at least you recognize, that they looked fantastic. This means, your sense of taste is still somewhat aryan and not perverted by the jew and his dictatorship of the ugly.


You went to play with the big kids, you got your asses handed to you. You are still cool. Just stop crying already.
We Germans are not cool anymore. We are the dirt on the shoes of the Jews.
Our chancellor visits Poland to tell them, that he will do everything, that no German will receive recompense.
I don't want financial recompense. This is something for jews. But a 'german' chancellor doing that, is a mirror of us Germans today.
So, no we are not cool.
But wait until the plutocratic polit-criminals show a weak moment: then we will remove them and maybe afterwards, there will be a cool Germany, as the first protector of a white aryan Europe again.
But for that times to come, we have to tell the people now, how Germany really was and really fought for.

Prussian
Wednesday, September 1st, 2004, 01:37 PM
There is a reason why the Third Reich failed. And the rapes by Russian soldiers are not it.I believe your missing the point of the whole thread, the point is to give discussion about the immoral actions of mass rape upon german and other populations during the advance of the red army.

Failed you call defeat failed? defeat and failure are to seperate concepts if the economy collapsed during peace time that would indeed be a failure of the governemnt, defeat whilst being outnumbered by oppossing forces is hardly failure but just simply defeat, on the ideological stance it was also not a failure the physical manifestation of the tool for implementing ideology and foreign policy that being the wehrmacht was defeated.

On a final note though not preferable there is honour in being defeated by the rest of civilised world in a war, name one country that lasted almost six years under such circumstances against a coalition of allied forces even comparable to what the german nation faced back then, fact remains no one has faced this but germany alone.

Ross
Friday, September 3rd, 2004, 05:07 PM
Slavs, on the other hand were declared sub human, to be annihilated, enslaved, exploited. Millions upon millions died. 50 for a wounded, 100 for a killed german soldier.

Now, when it turned out that Germans, in spite of all the deceit and cruelty they learned from their masters, ended up as untermen, wtf? 50 for wounded, 100 for a killed, no?

Look, this might be hard for you to accept. But Germany you believe in died with Hitler. Forever. What remained, and was salvaged by the infinite grace of the Slavic peoples (Russians first and foremost), was sown with and by the stronger and better.



Yes, the infinite grace... I've mixed feelings about that. I surely am worse than those Russians... I don't feel I could forgive Germans, pardon them and feed them at the expense of starving Russia...

Ross
Friday, September 3rd, 2004, 05:16 PM
German Mass Rape Orgies in Russia: Sadism, Murder, Paedophilia

http://forums.skadi.net/showthread.php?t=16352

Zyklop
Friday, September 3rd, 2004, 05:23 PM
Propaganda of the victorious. Useless for historical reflection.

Ross
Friday, September 3rd, 2004, 06:16 PM
It's the statement of the Soviet government issued in the beginning of January, 1942.

I'm looking currently for German atrocities commited from 1941 to 1944 in Russia...

Praetorianer
Saturday, October 4th, 2008, 10:52 PM
Antony Beevor, author of the acclaimed new book about the fall of Berlin, on a massive war crime committed by the victorious Red Army.

"Red Army soldiers don't believe in 'individual liaisons' with German women," wrote the playwright Zakhar Agranenko in his diary when serving as an officer of marine infantry in East Prussia. "Nine, ten, twelve men at a time - they rape them on a collective basis."

The Soviet armies advancing into East Prussia in January 1945, in huge, long columns, were an extraordinary mixture of modern and medieval: tank troops in padded black helmets, Cossack cavalrymen on shaggy mounts with loot strapped to the saddle, lend-lease Studebakers and Dodges towing light field guns, and then a second echelon in horse-drawn carts. The variety of character among the soldiers was almost as great as that of their military equipment. There were freebooters who drank and raped quite shamelessly, and there were idealistic, austere communists and members of the intelligentsia appalled by such behaviour.

Beria and Stalin, back in Moscow, knew perfectly well what was going on from a number of detailed reports. One stated that "many Germans declare that all German women in East Prussia who stayed behind were raped by Red Army soldiers". Numerous examples of gang rape were given - "girls under 18 and old women included".

Marshal Rokossovsky issued order No 006 in an attempt to direct "the feelings of hatred at fighting the enemy on the battlefield." It appears to have had little effect. There were also a few arbitrary attempts to exert authority. The commander of one rifle division is said to have "personally shot a lieutenant who was lining up a group of his men before a German woman spreadeagled on the ground". But either officers were involved themselves, or the lack of discipline made it too dangerous to restore order over drunken soldiers armed with submachine guns.

Calls to avenge the Motherland, violated by the Wehrmacht's invasion, had given the idea that almost any cruelty would be allowed. Even many young women soldiers and medical staff in the Red Army did not appear to disapprove. "Our soldiers' behaviour towards Germans, particularly German women, is absolutely correct!" said a 21-year-old from Agranenko's reconnaissance detachment. A number seemed to find it amusing. Several German women recorded how Soviet servicewomen watched and laughed when they were raped. But some women were deeply shaken by what they witnessed in Germany. Natalya Gesse, a close friend of the scientist Andrei Sakharov, had observed the Red Army in action in 1945 as a Soviet war correspondent. "The Russian soldiers were raping every German female from eight to eighty," she recounted later. "It was an army of rapists."

Drink of every variety, including dangerous chemicals seized from laboratories and workshops, was a major factor in the violence. It seems as if Soviet soldiers needed alcoholic courage to attack a woman. But then, all too often, they drank too much and, unable to complete the act, used the bottle instead with appalling effect. A number of victims were mutilated obscenely.

The subject of the Red Army's mass rapes in Germany has been so repressed in Russia that even today veterans refuse to acknowledge what really happened. The handful prepared to speak openly, however, are totally unrepentant. "They all lifted their skirts for us and lay on the bed," said the leader of one tank company. He even went on to boast that "two million of our children were born" in Germany.

The capacity of Soviet officers to convince themselves that most of the victims were either happy with their fate, or at least accepted that it was their turn to suffer after what the Wehrmacht had done in Russia, is striking. "Our fellows were so sex-starved," a Soviet major told a British journalist at the time, "that they often raped old women of sixty, seventy or even eighty - much to these grandmothers' surprise, if not downright delight."

One can only scratch at the surface of the psychological contradictions. When gang-raped women in Königsberg begged their attackers afterwards to put them out of their misery, the Red Army men appear to have felt insulted. "Russian soldiers do not shoot women," they replied. "Only German soldiers do that." The Red Army had managed to convince itself that because it had assumed the moral mission to liberate Europe from fascism it could behave entirely as it liked, both personally and politically.

Domination and humiliation permeated most soldiers' treatment of women in East Prussia. The victims not only bore the brunt of revenge for Wehrmacht crimes, they also represented an atavistic target as old as war itself. Rape is the act of a conqueror, the feminist historian Susan Brownmiller observed, aimed at the "bodies of the defeated enemy's women" to emphasise his victory. Yet after the initial fury of January 1945 dissipated, the sadism became less marked. By the time the Red Army reached Berlin three months later, its soldiers tended to regard German women more as a casual right of conquest. The sense of domination certainly continued, but this was perhaps partly an indirect product of the humiliations which they themselves had suffered at the hands of their commanders and the Soviet authorities as a whole.

A number of other forces or influences were at work. Sexual freedom had been a subject for lively debate within Communist party circles during the 1920s, but during the following decade, Stalin ensured that Soviet society depicted itself as virtually asexual. This had nothing to do with genuine puritanism: it was because love and sex did not fit in with dogma designed to "deindividualise" the individual. Human urges and emotions had to be suppressed. Freud's work was banned, divorce and adultery were matters for strong party disapproval. Criminal sanctions against homosexuality were reintroduced. The new doctrine extended even to the complete suppression of sex education. In graphic art, the clothed outline of a woman's breasts was regarded as dangerously erotic. They had to be disguised under boiler suits. The regime clearly wanted any form of desire to be converted into love for the party and above all for Comrade Stalin.

Most ill-educated Red Army soldiers suffered from sexual ignorance and utterly unenlightened attitudes towards women. So the Soviet state's attempts to suppress the libido of its people created what one Russian writer described as a sort of "barracks eroticism" which was far more primitive and violent than "the most sordid foreign pornography". All this was combined with the dehumanising influence of modern propaganda and the atavistic, warring impulses of men marked by fear and suffering.

The novelist Vasily Grossman, a war correspondent attached to the invading Red Army, soon discovered that rape victims were not just Germans. Polish women also suffered. So did young Russian, Belorussian and Ukrainian women who had been sent back to Germany by the Wehrmacht for slave labour. "Liberated Soviet girls quite often complain that our soldiers rape them," he noted. "One girl said to me in tears: 'He was an old man, older than my father'."

The rape of Soviet women and girls seriously undermines Russian attempts to justify Red Army behaviour on the grounds of revenge for German brutality in the Soviet Union. On March 29 1945 the central committee of the Komsomol (the youth organisation of the Soviet Union) informed Stalin's associate Malenkov of a report from the 1st Ukrainian Front. "On the night of 24 February," General Tsygankov recorded in the first of many examples, "a group of 35 provisional lieutenants on a course and their battalion commander entered the women's dormitory in the village of Grutenberg and raped them."

In Berlin, many women were simply not prepared for the shock of Russian revenge, however much horror propaganda they had heard from Goebbels. Many reassured themselves that, although the danger must be great out in the countryside, mass rapes could hardly take place in the city in front of everybody.

In Dahlem, Soviet officers visited Sister Kunigunde, the mother superior of Haus Dahlem, a maternity clinic and orphanage. The officers and their men behaved impeccably. In fact, the officers even warned Sister Kunigunde about the second-line troops following on behind. Their prediction proved entirely accurate. Nuns, young girls, old women, pregnant women and mothers who had just given birth were all raped without pity.

Yet within a couple of days, a pattern emerged of soldiers flashing torches in the faces of women huddled in the bunkers to choose their victims. This process of selection, as opposed to the indiscriminate violence shown earlier, indicates a definite change. By this stage Soviet soldiers started to treat German women more as sexual spoils of war than as substitutes for the Wehrmacht on which to vent their rage.

Rape has often been defined by writers on the subject as an act of violence which has little to do with sex. But that is a definition from the victim's perspective. To understand the crime, one needs to see things from the perpetrator's point of view, especially in the later stages when unaggravated rape had succeeded the extreme onslaught of January and February.

Many women found themselves forced to "concede" to one soldier in the hope that he would protect them from others. Magda Wieland, a 24-year-old actress, was dragged from a cupboard in her apartment just off the Kurfürstendamm. A very young soldier from central Asia hauled her out. He was so excited at the prospect of a beautiful young blonde that he ejaculated prematurely. By sign language, she offered herself to him as a girlfriend if he would protect her from other Russian soldiers, but he went off to boast to his comrades and another soldier raped her. Ellen Goetz, a Jewish friend of Magda's, was also raped. When other Germans tried to explain to the Russians that she was Jewish and had been persecuted, they received the retort: "Frau ist Frau."

Women soon learned to disappear during the "hunting hours" of the evening. Young daughters were hidden in storage lofts for days on end. Mothers emerged into the street to fetch water only in the early morning when Soviet soldiers were sleeping off the alcohol from the night before. Sometimes the greatest danger came from one mother giving away the hiding place of other girls in a desperate bid to save her own daughter. Older Berliners still remember the screams every night. It was impossible not to hear them because all the windows had been blown in.

Estimates of rape victims from the city's two main hospitals ranged from 95,000 to 130,000. One doctor deduced that out of approximately 100,000 women raped in the city, some 10,000 died as a result, mostly from suicide. The death rate was thought to have been much higher among the 1.4 million estimated victims in East Prussia, Pomerania and Silesia. Altogether at least two million German women are thought to have been raped, and a substantial minority, if not a majority, appear to have suffered multiple rape.

If anyone attempted to defend a woman against a Soviet attacker it was either a father trying to defend a daughter or a young son trying to protect his mother. "The 13-year old Dieter Sahl," neighbours wrote in a letter shortly after the event, "threw himself with flailing fists at a Russian who was raping his mother in front of him. He did not succeed in anything except getting himself shot."

After the second stage of women offering themselves to one soldier to save themselves from others, came the post-battle need to survive starvation. Susan Brownmiller noted "the murky line that divides wartime rape from wartime prostitution". Soon after the surrender in Berlin, Ursula von Kardorff found all sorts of women prostituting themselves for food or the alternative currency of cigarettes. Helke Sander, a German film-maker who researched the subject in great detail, wrote of "the grey area of direct force, blackmail, calculation and real affection".

The fourth stage was a strange form of cohabitation in which Red Army officers settled in with German "occupation wives". The Soviet authorities were appalled and enraged when a number of Red Army officers, intent on staying with their German lovers, deserted when it was time to return to the Motherland.

Even if the feminist definition of rape purely as an act of violence proves to be simplistic, there is no justification for male complacency. If anything, the events of 1945 reveal how thin the veneer of civilisation can be when there is little fear of retribution. It also suggests a much darker side to male sexuality than we might care to admit.

guardian.co.uk (http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/2002/may/01/news.features11)

:censored

Kriegersohn
Sunday, October 5th, 2008, 05:05 PM
While mentioned in other threads before, I will mention it here. There is another book by Alfred-Maurice de Zayas called "A Terrible Revenge: The Ethnic Cleasnsing of the East European Germans, 1944-1950". It covers quite alot of room in a short space. "Silesian Inferno" covers the subject well, though I haven't seen the book available in a while.

DanseMacabre
Monday, November 24th, 2008, 10:08 PM
It greatly pains me that my country was allied with these slavic scum.

Teutonic
Tuesday, November 25th, 2008, 02:05 AM
I dont like Russians, and I never will. It is hard for me to even be friends with some girls that I know because they are from Russia. I talk to them, but it will never go past that.That is me being nice, and I feel as though I am over extending myself by just talking to them.I dont care for anything Slavic, and I am not sorry in the least bit for the way I feel.

Anfang
Tuesday, November 25th, 2008, 07:26 AM
It greatly pains me that my country was allied with these slavic scum.

There were people living in the United States, who were not really Americans that made Sure the USA and England went to war with Germany.


guardian.co.uk (http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/2002/may/01/news.features11)

:censored

My Great Uncle fought in Russia with the Wehrmacht 250 division. I read the post above, and want to comment about it, but I do not want to paint things in a dramatic pro-german light only for the purpose of going with the group.

The Nat Soc ideology and the discipline of the German Army and waffen ss had a policy that was officilaly against raping, In part because of concerns about mixing blood and because also it was bad for moral. They had ideological zeal when going through Russia and their actions were tailored around the NS ideology, rape was not part of that. The Soviets on the other hand were a motley group of barbarians given the green light to pillage and rape not seen in Europe since the previous Mongolian invasion of Europe. It was of course their policy to rape as many German Women as they could. It was disgusting and a form of terror tactic.

But war is war, and although I am probably known here as a feminazi(lol)
when you launch a war with 3 million soldiers against Russia, You should know what you are getting into. You cannot expect them to act any other way than the way that they are. To give an analogy, If you walk aroend in East LA sporting your blond hair and you are white, wearing a nice conservative suit and glasses, gangbangers are going to attack you and rob you or worse..
I would point out that many of the Russian civilians killed were part of the overall effort to conquer the land and population. Gang raping women was not a Nazi practice by the German army nor the Waffen SS. My relative said that his unit was not involved with rapes of russian Women . But he also said that other units did. And that "anything that was not Wehrmacht could be shot at."

After the war, we all know that the Soviet had a systematic policy to liquidate the German population from the Baltics and East Prussia. What bothers me is that we are not consider here the responsabilty AH has here.
By trying to be the military comander of the armed forces he doomed the German war effort. Even as late as Nov 1942 he Could have ordered a strategic Withdrawal from stalingrad and saved 260,000 *experienced* German soldiers and officers. The Me-262 Schalbe was the World's first jet fighter. it was he fastest thing in the air, allied planes seemed to be "motionless" to the Luftwaffe pilots who finally were able to use it as such. Hitler decreed that it should be deployed as a light bomber. It could have wiped the allies from the sky in 1942. What was a former corporal of the reichswehr donig making this decision?
These and other major mistakes have to be considered for what they were,
egocentric manouvers on the part of the supreme Leader. And the supreme
Leader should have been thinking about those 2 million Women raped and 7,000,000 men plus who died, about the possible end to Germany as a nation.

So yes my guts turn over when I read about sisters who went through hell and were victimized, brutalized and killed, but I caution us about viewing the
events in an emotional way instead of an historical one. Wars should be fought by soldiers and lead by generals, not by political leaders.

Mueller Lite
Tuesday, November 25th, 2008, 01:43 PM
The wholesale rape of German women and girls by soviet troops gives us a clear picture of what happens to defeated, defenseless, gentile peoples when jews are in control of the victors.

And unless we White Americans free ourselves from jewish control and unite and organize our people for mutual defense, our women will suffer the same fate as those millions of German women, after our economy collapses and welfare checks cease being delivered to the ghettos and barrios.

DanseMacabre
Tuesday, November 25th, 2008, 07:48 PM
The wholesale rape of German women and girls by soviet troops gives us a clear picture of what happens to defeated, defenseless, gentile peoples when jews are in control of the victors.It also gives us a clear picture of the barbarity slavic nations would unleash upon Germanics given the chance. They are on par with jews in my opinion.


There were people living in the United States, who were not really Americans that made Sure the USA and England went to war with Germany.

Indeed, but American ignorance about the Third Reich allowed them to be seduced by international jewry.

Mueller Lite
Tuesday, November 25th, 2008, 11:34 PM
=DanseMacabre;911381]It also gives us a clear picture of the barbarity slavic nations would unleash upon Germanics given the chance. They are on par with jews in my opinion.

I strongly believe that had there not been such overwhelming jewish influence inside the Soviet Union and it's military, the number of rapes of German women would not have been remotely as great as it was. What's the name of that Jewish general who gave the order to Soviet troops before they entered Germany, to: "Break the wills of their women. Take them as your booty, you great and mighty red Army" (words to that effect).




Indeed, but American ignorance about the Third Reich allowed them to be seduced by international jewry.

Very true. And that American ignorance continues. But how could it be otherwise, considering jewish domination of the American media then and now? Those who control the media, control the minds therefore the actions of the people. It's really as simple as that. Henry Ford Sr, in his "The International Jew" said that jews gained domination of the American media and government around 1900. And I believe it.

Oswiu
Tuesday, November 25th, 2008, 11:59 PM
I strongly believe that had there not been such overwhelming jewish influence inside the Soviet Union and it's military, the number of rapes of German women would not have been remotely as great as it was.
I can't really see it happening back in 1914, had the Russians been more successful militarily then. Brusilov's offensive back in the Great War brought for a while a considerable extent of AustroHungarian territory under Russian occupation, and I don't think anything so terrible happened then. And I don't think the Russian troops in the west under Suvorov or during the Napoleonic Wars carried on like such beasts either. What was the difference? These were the same Slavs many here love to bash.

The Revolution, Terror, Civil War, Collectivisation, Famine and Bolshevik Propaganda had brutalised them, I think it's fair to say. For young men at the time, they'd never really lived freely, and this one moment of license brought out the very worst in them. Germans may have behaved better in their occupied zones (I have the personal reminiscences of one old Ukrainian women as proof, when she said it was only the Hungarian troops who you had to fear), but it wasn't hard for the Soviet authorities to spread horror stories about the activities of the Wehrmacht to motivate such absolute hatred against Germans.

Honorable leaders would have controlled their men, and never let them get anywhere near this state in the first place, but such men had largely been driven out or shot by this point. It's interesting to consider Stalin's personal responsibility here; was he behind it, and did he know of the true scale of what went on. I don't know.

Not for one second am I condoning a single act of rape. I can think of nothing more evil, especially regarding some more sadistic things allied to it that you hear rumour of (mostly occuring on the way to Berlin, I believe).

What's the name of that Jewish general who gave the order to Soviet troops before they entered Germany, to: "Break the wills of their women. Take them as your booty, you great and mighty red Army" (words to that effect).
I don't know, but perhaps it was the propagandist writer Ehrenberg. Indeed I find it hard to envisage a Jewish military commander, outside of Israel where they've had to be so, and Trotsky where the political aspect was paramount anyway.

Mueller Lite
Wednesday, November 26th, 2008, 12:46 AM
I can't really see it happening back in 1914, had the Russians been more successful militarily then. Brusilov's offensive back in the Great War brought for a while a considerable extent of AustroHungarian territory under Russian occupation, and I don't think anything so terrible happened then. And I don't think the Russian troops in the west under Suvorov or during the Napoleonic Wars carried on like such beasts either. What was the difference? These were the same Slavs many here love to bash.

The Revolution, Terror, Civil War, Collectivisation, Famine and Bolshevik Propaganda had brutalised them, I think it's fair to say. For young men at the time, they'd never really lived freely, and this one moment of license brought out the very worst in them. Germans may have behaved better in their occupied zones (I have the personal reminiscences of one old Ukrainian women as proof, when she said it was only the Hungarian troops who you had to fear), but it wasn't hard for the Soviet authorities to spread horror stories about the activities of the Wehrmacht to motivate such absolute hatred against Germans.

Honorable leaders would have controlled their men, and never let them get anywhere near this state in the first place, but such men had largely been driven out or shot by this point. It's interesting to consider Stalin's personal responsibility here; was he behind it, and did he know of the true scale of what went on. I don't know.

Not for one second am I condoning a single act of rape. I can think of nothing more evil, especially regarding some more sadistic things allied to it that you hear rumour of (mostly occuring on the way to Berlin, I believe).

I don't know, but perhaps it was the propagandist writer Ehrenberg. Indeed I find it hard to envisage a Jewish military commander, outside of Israel where they've had to be so, and Trotsky where the political aspect was paramount anyway.

Thanks for your input, Oswiu. Very well said.

And you're right. His name WAS Ehrenburg - Llya Ehrenburg. And he was a jew and also "the Soviet Union's TOP propagandist" during WWII. I found a short biography of him at this link:

www.rense.com/general75/ehr.htm

Here's a quote from the link:


But it wasn't only the ordinary German soldier Ehrenburg was talking about, whom he accused of the very atrocities the Communists were themselves committing. Ehrenburg's incendiary writings were, in fact, a prime motivating factor in the orgy of murder and rape against the civilian population that took place as Soviet troops rampaged into the heart of Europe. Appealing to the lowest, most subhuman instincts of this Bolshevik horde, he reiterated his genocidal message:

"Kill! Kill! In the German race there is nothing but evil; not one among the living, not one among the yet unborn but is evil! Follow the precepts of Comrade Stalin. Stamp out the fascist beast once and for all in its lair! Use force and break the racial pride of these German women. Take them as your lawful booty. Kill! As you storm onward, kill, you gallant soldiers of the Red Army."

The crowning achievement of Ehrenburg's career came on December 22, 1944, when this hate-crazed fiend became the first person to mention the kabbalistic figure of Six Million alleged Jewish victims of National Socialism, and then proceeded to introduce that figure into Soviet propaganda.

DanseMacabre
Wednesday, November 26th, 2008, 09:26 PM
I strongly believe that had there not been such overwhelming jewish influence inside the Soviet Union and it's military, the number of rapes of German women would not have been remotely as great as it was.

I disagree. The Jew is not responsible for the barbaric nature of slavs. He is the puppet master.



What's the name of that Jewish general who gave the order to Soviet troops before they entered Germany, to: "Break the wills of their women. Take them as your booty, you great and mighty red Army" (words to that effect).

Again, Jews are clever, they know what strings to pull. The more primitive the people they control the more barbaric the crime against Germanics. For example negroes.

Ossi
Thursday, November 27th, 2008, 04:57 AM
The Russian rapist scum should have been castrated as punishment for their disgusting crime. If they got lucky. If I had caught Russian scum molesting the women in my family, I'd have hung them by their privates.

OneEnglishNorman
Thursday, November 27th, 2008, 12:44 PM
It also gives us a clear picture of the barbarity slavic nations would unleash upon Germanics given the chance. They are on par with jews in my opinion.

Did the Germans not invade Russia first? Or is that forgiveable. What eventual future for Slavs under the Third Reich?

Jäger
Thursday, November 27th, 2008, 01:05 PM
These were the same Slavs many here love to bash.
That's exactly why it reveals their primitive nature, you cannot steer higher men like this, be it to the "good" or to the "bad".

DanseMacabre
Thursday, November 27th, 2008, 04:06 PM
Did the Germans not invade Russia first? Or is that forgiveable.

War between Germany and Russia was inevitable. Germany struck before the judeo-bolshevist beast struck first. Why should they seek forgiveness?


What eventual future for Slavs under the Third Reich

Their future was to be pushed further east.

Sissi
Thursday, November 27th, 2008, 04:19 PM
Did the Germans not invade Russia first? Or is that forgiveable. What eventual future for Slavs under the Third Reich?
Forgiveness is not what this is about in my opinion. Punishing the civillian females of a nation with rape is a primitive, savage method and it speaks for a difference in cultures. These women, these 8 year old girls and these 80 year old grandmothers were not guilty of anything. They had nothing to be forgiven for. The Russians wouldn't have been judged the same way if they aimed to punish the soldiers and politicians only.

Hauke Haien
Thursday, November 27th, 2008, 07:45 PM
We have to be careful with atrocity propaganda, because it can easily be turned into a justification for our current state of existence, which is foreign domination and eventual extinction. "Germans were raped because of Hitler", "Germans were killed through starvation because of Wilhelm II", so "just hold still and you won't get hurt" is what we hear today. The real reason why Germans were victimised is of course that it was possible and the only way out of this is to remove the ability of our enemies to continue to victimise us. The first step towards this is independence and self-determination, not adherence to universal rules only meant to chain us, not protect us.

Mueller Lite
Monday, December 1st, 2008, 02:41 PM
Forgiveness is not what this is about in my opinion. Punishing the civillian females of a nation with rape is a primitive, savage method and it speaks for a difference in cultures. These women, these 8 year old girls and these 80 year old grandmothers were not guilty of anything. They had nothing to be forgiven for. The Russians wouldn't have been judged the same way if they aimed to punish the soldiers and politicians only.

An excellent, hard-hitting point, Sissi.

Everytime the media brings up "The Rape of Berlin" which is seldom, they always excuse the rapes by implying they got what they deserved because of Germany's invasion of and actions in Russia. The media always "neglects" to mention however, that German soldiers raped very few Russian women.

And truth be known, German soldiers were the most humane of all combatants who fought during WWII.

It is the victors who write history. And in Germany's case, the victors write the laws as well. Any German today who even questions the so-called holocaust in public, much less denies it ever happened, is a criminal and subject to imprisonment, under "German" law. 15,000 Germans were prosecuted last year, alone.

How then, one must ask, can any sane person believe holocaust attrocity allegations, when it's a criminal offense to even question or deny the allegations ?? It's the same as a defendant in court not being allowed to speak in his/her own defense. Is it not ??