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celticviking
Wednesday, November 30th, 2011, 10:34 PM
Horses could soon be butchered in the US for human consumption after Congress quietly lifted a five-year-old ban on funding horse meat inspections, and activists say slaughterhouses could be up and running in as little as a month.

Slaughter opponents pushed a measure cutting off funding for horse meat inspections through Congress in 2006 after other efforts to pass outright bans on horse slaughter failed in previous years. Congress lifted the ban in a spending bill US President Barack Obama signed into law November 18 to keep the government afloat until mid-December.

It did not, however, allocate any new money to pay for horse meat inspections, which opponents claim could cost taxpayers US$3 million (NZ$3.8m) to US$5 million (NZ$6.4m) a year. The US Department of Agriculture would have to find the money in its existing budget, which is expected to see more cuts this year as Congress and the White House aim to trim federal spending.

The USDA issued a statement yesterday saying there are no slaughterhouses in the US that butcher horses for human consumption now, but if one were to open, it would conduct inspections to make sure federal laws were being followed. USDA spokesman Neil Gaffney declined to answer questions beyond what was in the statement.

The last US slaughterhouse that butchered horses closed in 2007 in Illinois, and animal welfare activists warned of massive public outcry in any town where a slaughterhouse may open.


Read more here
http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/americas/6066870/Horses-could-soon-be-slaughtered-for-meat-in-US

karolvs
Wednesday, November 30th, 2011, 10:41 PM
My mistake, I guess people want horse.....haha, them eat horse...I don't have any objections, sometimes I should shut up and think longer I guess. Being from Kentucky, I generally don't think of horses as food...

Schneider
Wednesday, November 30th, 2011, 10:42 PM
We need the horse slaughter houses to reopen.

Since their closing, old, dangerous and injured horses have been going to waste.

Many have simply been released as owners could no longer afford to feed them. Often starving in our cold northern winters.

These animals are being wasted. Their meat,bone, etc, are used for many things other than human consumption.

P.S. I have no problem with eating horse. If you are not a vegetarian, why would you not eat horse?

SpearBrave
Wednesday, November 30th, 2011, 10:51 PM
The pleasure horse market is based on the kill price of horses. Since they quit killing horses here the horse business has been at a huge loss. Often times the horses that are killed are either permanently lame, old, or crazy. These animals need to be put down anyway so why not put them to good use.

There is nothing wrong with horse meat, I have had horse meat in stew and in salami it tasted fine.

Sigurd
Wednesday, November 30th, 2011, 10:57 PM
But this is a good example of trying to alienate the U.S., to make it seem like we eat horse meat.

Sometimes it's better to look beyond the Anglosphere as well. When Iceland was Christianised, one of the concessions for peaceful conversion was that they could continue eating horse meat. In Austria/Bavaria, Pferdeleberkäse is considered a speciality, and specific horse butchers exist all across Germany. ;)

Even in Italy, the areas more influenced by Celtics and Germanics (i.e. the North) is more prone to consuming horse meat, whilst it is generally frowned upon in Southern Italy. The "best salami" is traditionally made either from donkey or horse meat, having salami down as a pork sausage is a rather recent phenomenon and a by-product of the over-domestication of the swine making it a cheaper meat.

As for the so-called "alienisation", remember that horse meat is forbidden for Jews and is disputed amongst Muslims (Turks and Persians usually eat it, Arabs don't). It is taboo also in the Balkans.

I'm not saying it's a good practice, and am myself rather indifferent - not particularly liking it, nor particularly condemning the practice - but do mention that the horse is usually a noble animal and that if it is slaughtered for food then it should be slaughtered with the dignity it deserves, without pain, and preferably when it would have had to be put down to begin with (such as when it has broken a bone, or is old, etc. pp.). :)

So much as I understand your bewilderment and offense, please inform yourself first before you speak. Just because you may think amongst Europeans, only the French --- renowned for their awkward culinary tastes --- eat it, doesn't mean it's true. :P

Thorolf
Wednesday, November 30th, 2011, 10:57 PM
I don't see the issue with eating a horse. Plenty of animals are smart. I guess since we see them as pets so much we forget they can still be food. If it's not raised as a pet, I don't see it as any different than a pig, cow or any other livestock. Our ancestors ate horses didn't they?

karolvs
Wednesday, November 30th, 2011, 10:57 PM
I'm not saying it's a terrible thing to eat horse meat. I've just never heard of much of a market for it. If there is...open them up, I have no problem with it...

Patrioten
Wednesday, November 30th, 2011, 10:59 PM
This is a ridiculous story. There are not enough people willing to eat horse meat in the U.S. to make the butchering even viable. But this is a good example of trying to alienate the U.S., to make it seem like we eat horse meat. Maybe in a chinese restaurant, or Arabs or something might be willing to eat horse, but even blacks wouldn't and Whites are still 70% of the pop, while blacks are about 11 and hispanics are about 14%.From what I have read anglo saxon countries have a particular distaste for horse meat whilst in mainland Europe there exists other traditions. Horse meat is pretty uncommon on the whole here but can be found in certain cold cuts and sausages. I don't think much about it, I've eaten it and it's not a big deal. A couple of generations ago the worn out work-horses would be eaten by my family.

Hersir
Thursday, December 1st, 2011, 12:57 AM
Horse meat is good, and it has been accociated with heathen customs, so the christians banned it in Norway.

It's not too uncommon here to eat mostly, usually as a dark sausage you slice and put on your bread. I've had horse for dinner, and it was very good. Dark meat, almost like moose/elk.

I think eating horse was also banned in Sweden when christianity came to power, maybe that's why the tradition mostly died it. I didn't know Iceland not had that law.

Fun fact: In the viking age they would sometimes let male horses fight on the ting to decide over a matter.

AutymnMoone
Sunday, December 25th, 2011, 01:16 AM
We need the horse slaughter houses to reopen.

Since their closing, old, dangerous and injured horses have been going to waste.

Many have simply been released as owners could no longer afford to feed them. Often starving in our cold northern winters.

These animals are being wasted. Their meat,bone, etc, are used for many things other than human consumption.

P.S. I have no problem with eating horse. If you are not a vegetarian, why would you not eat horse?

I agree. It is a neccessary "evil" for lack of better words. I've worked in the horse industry for nearly 25 years and see things quite differently now than I did when I first started and was horrified at these creatures being slaughtered.

I know people who had horses turned loose at friends farms by people who couldn't feed them anymore. They'd come in during the night and turn them loose and in the morning, the farm owners had "extra" horses that they now had to take care of for the time being.

I'd rather see them go to the slaughter house than starve to death in a field or locked in a barn without food.

I've not tried eating horse meat, but if given the chance I would try it.

Rothhammer
Monday, December 26th, 2011, 04:19 AM
As for the so-called "alienisation", remember that horse meat is forbidden for Jews and is disputed amongst Muslims (Turks and Persians usually eat it, Arabs don't). It is taboo also in the Balkans.

I didn't have a problem with it BEFORE this statement, but after that I'm thrilled at the thought. ;)

Mvix
Monday, December 26th, 2011, 05:22 AM
I've often eaten horse meat and there is nothing wrong with it. I've probably eaten most of the horse meat when eating "Bjúgu" (one type of icelandic sausages) and it's delicious.
http://www.kjarnafaedi.is/myndir/mos/Bjug_utfl2.jpg
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_qMCnEpA1Tzs/SkzeXtFCPZI/AAAAAAAAEJ4/bdRsNpXDwi8/s1600/Picture+067.jpg

Frostbite
Monday, December 26th, 2011, 08:28 AM
I get the 'taboo' feelings about it because people see horses as companions like cats and dogs. But if you'll eat a cow or a pig you should be able to eat horse. Pigs are supposed to be quite smart, about as smart as many dogs.

Wychaert
Monday, December 26th, 2011, 11:24 AM
I really like horse meat, I eat it 2or 3 times a week. ''Paardenrookvlees'' on bread, Horsestew, Horse steak, horse saucages and even the most of our famous ''frikandellen'' contains horse meat.

But I dont eat sheep or goat, thats unclean meat.;):D


Every culture has its own ''meat taboos''. For example I wouldnt eat whale because I think they're beautiful creatures and the fact that the whale population is getting smaller fast. but I think Norwegians and Japanese dont agree with that:D
And I know the Dutch hunted down thousands of whale's too. but that has nothing to do with it:D

Mvix
Monday, December 26th, 2011, 01:52 PM
Every culture has its own ''meat taboos''. For example I wouldnt eat whale because I think they're beautiful creatures and the fact that the whale population is getting smaller fast. but I think Norwegians and Japanese dont agree with that:D
And I know the Dutch hunted down thousands of whale's too. but that has nothing to do with it:D

I'm not sure about Japan but Iceland and Norway are not hunting endangered species and their numbers are closely watched and only few animals can be hunted. Now Obama is going to to start to try to press Iceland into stop hunting whale through some Pelly amendment even though more whales are hunted by the USA of the so called Indigenous people of Alaska:thumbdown.

Iceland served it's 20 year long ban of whaling and in that time a generation has been born that doesn't know this part of our culture.
I am one of those people but many young people have started to eat it again. I love whale meat but it isn't a day to day food here. It's more of a fancy food that you eat a few times a year.
And yeah if you hear some environmentalist yapping about that there is no market for the meat here. It's been sold out a couple of times and I went to a restaurant that offered the meat and the queue came many meters out of the doors of the restaurant and everyone ordered minke whale.

Sindig_og_stoisk
Tuesday, December 27th, 2011, 11:15 AM
I have eaten horse meat once or twice. It is quite tasty with a soft and moist texture to it.

There is no sound reason why one should eat beef, pig or chicken but have problems with eating horse.

Eating horse meat was a part of the Odin worship in pagan times. As one of the most overt parts of this worship, it was quickly and forcibly banned when the Germanic lands became Christian and was all but completely forgotten in the span of a few generations.

Catterick
Tuesday, November 29th, 2016, 06:02 AM
The English have a mysterious taboo on horse meat. People like Hutton tried to trace it to Christianisation but always fail to explain why it is particular to the English. Anthropologically it probably has its roots in horse totemism (the Divine Hero Twins). There is a similar mysterious prohibition on consuming eels in Norway, Denmark and their overseas colonies but it is discussed far less in English. In Sweden people eat eels but in Norway they do not. For what its worth the eel is seen as the kinsfolk of the snake and snake imagery surrounds the early history of the Norse and Danes but not the Swedes. In IE languages words for eel and snake are often cognates and are often subject to taboo replacements. There seem to be no eel taboos independent of those surrounding snakes.

Horses had a positive aspect in IE myths but were also seen as connected to the underworld for example as psychopompic animals. The idea of a demonic horse is not post-Christian but rather pre-domestication and it is seen in the IEs and Uralics. The same demonisation happened elsewhere to dangerous game species such as the tapir and bison in the Americas. For the Turkic and Mongol oral traditions the horse was not demonised so presumably it was not hunted in the east before domestication was borrowed. Horses also have a folkloricic connection also to water and may be man eaters, both lingering motif of Scottish kelpies and such. (A memory of hunting dangerous horses at watering holes?) Though the domestication of riding horses itself led to the equine psychopomp it scarcely explains entirely the horse being regarded as a demonic being despite its high regard and usefulness to man. With domestication the hunter/hero and his adversary became twinned together as partners or even their attributes blurred. (Certain Gr. myths about Zeus and Poseidon may reflect the heavenly and infernal/chthonic aspects of the horse in IE myths.)

Wulfaz
Tuesday, November 29th, 2016, 06:09 AM
In Hungary the Hungarian eat horse meat. 1000 years ago when the evil Church has token his step in Hungary, they wanted to ban the horse meat eating but they failed like as they failed many in the history. The Hungarians basically do not eat the horse meat as like as a beefsteak, they eat horse sausages. Maybe I ate horse sausage too, but I am not sure about this and I do not know about its taste.

Catterick
Tuesday, November 29th, 2016, 06:28 AM
In Hungary the Hungarian eat horse meat. 1000 years ago when the evil Church has token his step in Hungary, they wanted to ban the horse meat eating but they failed like as they failed many in the history. The Hungarians basically do not eat the horse meat as like as a beefsteak, they eat horse sausages. Maybe I ate horse sausage too, but I am not sure about this and I do not know about its taste.

Hungarians are steppe people. Horse is their traditional subsistence same as it is for the Turks.

Catterick
Tuesday, November 29th, 2016, 07:25 AM
If you want a summary of the aquatic/chthonic horse in folklore read Eiichiro Ishida's paper on the Japanese kappa. Although his conclusion is somewhat different. He found folklore associating horses and oxen with water to be found not only in Japan but nearly the entire extent of the Eurasian continent with the exception of the Arctic region. He interpreted the water-horse had supplanted the water-ox when horse culture moved south and horses were used to pull ploughs. Ishida says the (lunar, storm-bringing) ox had chthonic connotations because it was used in ploughing and the horse took over this function later.

Ishida was at least correct to contrast the ox-based plough agriculturalists of the New Stone Age against the horse economies of the steppe from which arose the ideas of celestial horses and gods descending vertically from the sky mounted on horseback. But Chinese legends of iron oxen quelling floods come close to the thunder god conquering the chthonic dragon and according to the Vedic idea both the horse and the bull were "that which pours out" and "that which makes fruitful". He did not suggest why the horse was ever considered demonic on the western steppe.

Berezkin suggests the replacement of the horse by the cow - not the other way around - looks logical in at least one instance. Among the Mongolian and Turkic people of Siberia, Kazakhstan and Central Asia as well as the Mordvins the horse has an almost sacred status and cannot have any negative associations, while the bull or the cow (and the mammoth) can.

Among the Baltic Finns and IEs of Europe, the Northern Caucasus and Central Asia as well as in the Avestan tradition the horse is considered to be the adversary of God. This is often dismissed as post-Christian (ie. it is connected to Hiisi in the Finnish-Estonian tradition: compare to the parentage of Sleipnir) but Christian folklore built upon an earlier horse-ox dualism. The opposition between the horse and the bull was used in folktales about the birth and travels of Christ seeking to cross a river. The bull tried to cover the baby Christ with a hay or straw while the horse pulled it off making him visible for potential persecutors; the horse refused to help Christ to cross a river while the bull helped him. Across most of Baltoscandia as far as as Tajikistan we find direct claims that the horse was the only animal created by the devil or that it is the incarnation of the devil himself.

Just food for thought why the English might not eat horse meat. But totemism seems most likely because of Hengist and Horsa and their identity as the Alcis twins mentioned by Tacitus. Like the Christianisation explanation there are problems with explaining the English taboo by more widespread symbolism.

Hersir
Friday, December 2nd, 2016, 12:17 AM
Horse is very good, I once made a stew with horse meat and dark beer. Delicious. It was only forbidden when Christianity arrived here in Scandinavia. Eating horse was associated with blot and myth and heathenism. These days we can order horse meat at the butcher. A famous Norwegian chef (Hellstrøm) said that when he started in the business, the best steaks came from horse and not cows.

Leliana
Friday, December 2nd, 2016, 09:20 PM
I once tried Horse salami. It felt odd to eat but the taste was fine. Really fine. :)

Catterick
Saturday, December 3rd, 2016, 11:39 AM
Horse meat is taboo only in England and lowland Scotland. Saint Boniface condemned it as unclean food but this is scarcely explicable by Jewish dietary law and in Italy 900g of horse meat were eaten per person per year. Returning to Germanic speaking countries and those such as France with extensive Germanic heritage it is commonly eaten for example in Switzerland. Despite Boniface Germans and Scandinavians continued to hunt and eat horses with ambivalence but not in England. In Europe the taboo is sporadic for example it is present in ancient and modern Asturias. The taboo against eating horse is not a pan-Germanic taboo nor a Christian one but where the taboo exists it appears indigenous.