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TechFin
Tuesday, January 11th, 2011, 01:53 PM
I like the idea of a creator, it is interesting to me.

It doesn't have to be the creator of The Bible, it could be a strange entity or creature, for all I know, but I like the idea of creation.

I like the idea of the earth being created intentionally, and the spirits' of the dead living in another realm, possibly with the option of coming back here.

I don't know... it just gives a sense of connection... in a good way.

Any thoughts? Do you think our world was created on purpose, or not at all? Just chances?

Meister
Tuesday, January 11th, 2011, 02:28 PM
My thoughts vary, but I do find it hard to comes to terms with the idea that we are here by some cosmic accident.

I like the idea that there are spiritual forces of some sort that are probably right now looking down and think what a huge mess.

If you believe we are spiritual beings than there has to be something we will ascend or descend to, a place where we will rest or be punished.

I am also interested in the theory that we were dumped here by Aliens who saw us as some weird experiment, and the other theory that we are the aliens and the blacks were our slave race. It's far fetched but it explains so much.

Wynterwade
Tuesday, January 11th, 2011, 02:38 PM
I often wonder why people ask this question that you asked. The possibility of an external creator is still very possible. Who knows why the big bang happened- how did that matter get there in the first place?

The reason why I wonder why is that asked so often is because I have another concern that in my opinion is of even more importance; Why was I born as myself? Why am I not somebody else, Why do I even exist in the first place?

To me this question, and all the others above, will ultimately come to one simple answer. Is it possible that events and matter, over long periods of time, can form into the being of a person without any supernatural forces? Maybe. But something feels fishy to me in that situation from an emotional stand point... (but maybe it's wrong to look at that question from an emotional standpoint considering when you look out at the universe; stars, galaxies, and quantum particles; and see that so far the only intelligent life exists at such a small level compared to the whole that possibly the most simplistic answer could be that we; us and our emotions are the anomaly and that we were created by simple particles without any emotions- that feels fishy to me though because it still doesn't answer what created the big bang- meaning it is just too hypothetical at the moment to speculate on that. It could very well be that we were created by two things in another dimensional universe smashing together creating the big bang and our physics in our universe, but then what created that first universe that smashed together to create our own?)

For instance, if there are parallel universes, some with the exact same qualities as our own, and I exist in multiple universes in the exact same way, then which one do I become? Certainly I cannot live multiple lives at the same time. This to me, I want to emotionally say, is like a dagger into the heart of the question; Why am I born as myself? Surely it can't be due to chance alone in that situation- something in the form of selection would have to have been done- and our current understanding of physics cannot answer that question. I want to say this idea touches the hand of God (maybe it does), But in a way it doesn't even touch the question- It's just too speculative considering the little physics framework that exists today (we can't answer the most simple physics questions like what causes gravity, what causes quantum particle movement that behaves as probability waves, why does our physics of the quantum world differ (obey different laws) from the physics of large things such as stars etc,).

But then again we are born as simple organisms without much emotions and we grow into the being that we are. Maybe we are just simple mathematics. Could we all just be a illusion or a computer program that cannot truly exist in the reality of a main universe? Possibly, after all our matter is packaged in probability waves at the quantum level seemingly as to save space. And for that matter could a computer program create the life we see today around us? Granted it was complex and realistic looking enough to carry out virtual universe computations to the extreme level as our universe. There is actually a MIT physics professor who hypothesizes this- and at the moment we cannot rule this out.

And finally we just don't know anything- and we probably will never know these answers during our life time. And that really bothers me.

Heinrich Harrer
Tuesday, January 11th, 2011, 03:02 PM
I like the idea of a creator, is interesting to me.

It doesn't have to be the creator of The Bible, it could be a strange entity or creature, for all I know, but the idea of creation I like.

It can be fun to speculate about these things. Maybe our universe is just a simulation in another universe of a much higher complexity, then our universe/this simulation has a creator in that other universe.

But an external creator doesn't really answer the question of why there is something - since one could also ask the question who created that creator?

So I don't really see the point. All I know is that the universe and its existence puzzle me.


I like the idea of the earth being created intentionally, and the spirits' of the dead living in another realm, possibly with the option of coming back here.

I don't know... it just gives a sense of connection... in a good way.

I don't know, the known universe seems too big to me to place so much importance on our tiny planet.

Meister
Tuesday, January 11th, 2011, 03:04 PM
I have wondered about that as well Wynterwade. Why was I born as me, why was I born of German Descent etc.

This might sound funny, but when I see old pictures such as the Avatar gallery here I feel warmth, have I lived before as a Germanic person.

People have told me that one of the reasons why the world is such a mess now is because there are so many "new souls" which are here for the first time. I have been described as an old soul.

I have heard something about an Asian religion believing that the number of souls is finite and so some people do not have one, I tried googling this but didn't get anything.

Apologies to the OP if I am getting off track, I am on night shift and am wondering out loud.

SaxonPagan
Tuesday, January 11th, 2011, 03:07 PM
Why was I born as myself? Why am I not somebody else, Why do I even exist in the first place?

Isn't this something like the Anthropic Principle?

Basically, if it was not you asking these questions, it would be that "somebody else" you refer to. So, even though the chances of you being the person you are today are infinitesimally small there's an inevitability about somebody being here right now and marvelling at the huge odds of him/her being the way (s)he is.

I think the original Anthropic Principle goes along the lines of ... "if the Universe was not the way it is with me here asking why it's like it is, there would be nobody here asking the question".

... it just about makes sense if you think about it for long enough ;)

Hesse
Wednesday, January 12th, 2011, 03:59 AM
I believe in what the Bible teaches, so yes, the universe was most definitely created on purpose. No big bangs, just the infinite intelligience of our creator designed the universe, including the earth, heavens, and everything around it.

JeffSinger
Wednesday, January 12th, 2011, 04:04 AM
Im not gonna get deep, but the second law of thermodynamics kinda points to intelligent design. just look into it and stuff. its a confusing subject for me since i am both Asatru and a man of science but i think those two can fit together better than Judaism/Christianity/Islam and science tho

Thorolf
Wednesday, January 12th, 2011, 04:05 AM
I believe in the Bible, so yes, the universe was most definitely created on purpose. No big bangs, just the infinite intelligience of our creator designed the universe, including the earth, heavens, and everything around it.

Just because god made everything doesn't mean the big bang didn't happen. He had to put everything here somehow and if he knows everything past and future than he could easily just snap his fingers and BANG out comes a whole envisioned universe.

Atali
Wednesday, January 12th, 2011, 05:00 AM
i believe everything happens for a reason. nothing is coincidence. kind of an empty feeling to think we're alone here, that life is all for nothing. i believe the world was created and we're here to fulfill some purpose.

Elessar
Wednesday, January 12th, 2011, 05:25 AM
Yes, we were deliberately created. It's fruitless to ask "why", for we'll never know. Behind every machine there is an operator. Behind every action there is an origin. Behind every lineage there is a progenitor. Behind every sculpture there is a sculptor.
I'm not satisfied with: "It's a cosmic explosion with no apparent reason or explainable origin and it just so happens that some chemical reaction made life."

Ingvaeonic
Wednesday, January 12th, 2011, 06:29 AM
Was the universe deliberately created by a creator? No.

Wychaert
Wednesday, January 12th, 2011, 07:50 AM
Was the universe deliberately created by a creator? No.

Then comes the question; Who created the creator.

The age of the Earth is probably 4,5 billion years, modern humanity is probably 200,000 years old. So what makes most humans think that the earth was created for humans?

Wulfram
Wednesday, January 12th, 2011, 10:30 AM
"As Above, So Below. As Within so Without"

Maybe

We are all compelled to move forward. We must or else we stagnate.
Allegedly the universe is continuing to expand. It must keep moving so that ultimately it can ___ (fill in the blank) whenever it stops.
I refuse to think everything just exploded into existence the same way someone strikes a match...and then watches it burn out.
Usually a match will be struck in order to start a bigger fire!
If the universe eventually stops and still nothing happens only then will I consider that there is no purpose to it all.
But it keeps right on moving, just as we are compelled to keep right on moving.

Magni
Wednesday, January 12th, 2011, 10:50 AM
No.

Ingvaeonic
Wednesday, January 12th, 2011, 08:35 PM
Then comes the question; Who created the creator.

The age of the Earth is probably 4,5 billion years, modern humanity is probably 200,000 years old. So what makes most humans think that the earth was created for humans?

Quite right, DE.

Northern Paladin
Wednesday, January 12th, 2011, 08:54 PM
The Universe has what's called "tendency towards complexity"

The universe keeps growing more complex. Some believe the Universe will achieve a final form, some say this form wlll be God.

Rev. Jupiter
Wednesday, January 12th, 2011, 08:58 PM
This thread posits a strange, and false, dichotomy between intentional design and whim of circumstance.

My personal vision of creation doesn't involve causelessness or intent.
A dream is neither intended nor without cause. It happens because it is brought into existence by a consciousness.

Hersir
Wednesday, January 12th, 2011, 09:17 PM
No, and I dont think our humans mind really can understand the universe.

wivienne
Wednesday, January 12th, 2011, 09:26 PM
No, and I dont think our humans mind really can understand the univerce.

I agree. Here we just cant understand. Thats why we have such questions like "who made the creator of Universe and who made the creator of that creator ..etc. " thats just an endless number of questions and i think we will never be able to find an answers..

Rev. Jupiter
Wednesday, January 12th, 2011, 09:32 PM
I agree. Here we just cant understand. Thats why we have such questions like "who made the creator of Universe and who made the creator of that creator ..etc. " thats just an endless number of questions and i think we will never be able to find an answers..

The human brain is much too valuable to our survival for it to allow us to use up precious energy contemplating irrelevant matters. Consider that humans have a natural inclination toward that sort of speculation for a reason.

Ardito
Wednesday, January 12th, 2011, 09:35 PM
I don't know anything about how the physical world came to be, and I see the question as being irrelevant to my philosophical and religious beliefs, so I'm not concerned about the answer either. I'm certainly curious about it, but I expect it's beyond human comprehension and it seems that to pay great attention to it is simply distracting.

Elessar
Wednesday, January 12th, 2011, 09:37 PM
I think this is the fallacy, If you can't explain how the universe was made scientifically, there is no God.

wittwer
Wednesday, January 12th, 2011, 10:08 PM
The Universe exists in of itself, for itself. We are but a speck; no, not even a speck in terms of time, space or import (except in our own perception and cognition). Which can be construed as intelligent design... ;)

Wulfram
Wednesday, January 12th, 2011, 10:19 PM
...thats just an endless number of questions and i think we will never be able to find an answers..

If you feel that we can never find the answer then the very notion that we can never find an answer is also just as impossible. :P

Charles Fort wrote:


The fate of all explanation is to close one door only to have another fly wide open.

wivienne
Wednesday, January 12th, 2011, 10:25 PM
If you feel that we can never find the answer then the very notion that we can never find an answer is also just as impossible. :P

Charles Fort wrote:

:) haha true that! Ok,i will say that we cant know all .

gerlachthegrim
Saturday, January 29th, 2011, 01:49 PM
It seems too unlikely and unrealistic that some being created the universe. What seems more likely is that the deities came along, just like all life. That we were seeded on this planet (and others) by another race from another solar system also seems like a good area to explore. The deities would not need to be here for the dinosaurs, so were likely formed or arrived at some point after that. The Germanic origin myths contain mythological elements that could translate to the new world, and is also worth exploring. Teiwaz is still Father of Us all, though. Not Wotan!

Segestan
Monday, March 21st, 2011, 02:01 AM
I like the idea of a creator, it is interesting to me.

It doesn't have to be the creator of The Bible, it could be a strange entity or creature, for all I know, but I like the idea of creation.

I like the idea of the earth being created intentionally, and the spirits' of the dead living in another realm, possibly with the option of coming back here.

I don't know... it just gives a sense of connection... in a good way.

Any thoughts? Do you think our world was created on purpose, or not at all? Just chances?

Consider this......

That the Universe we see is a creative construt. That the personality is an infinite essence. That in order for the personality to express in a manner that caused a sense of freedom and self worth the personality / ies had to create a theatrical environment.
Consider that you were existing without time and space before you entered the time bound journey as a human. On the moment of birth you were for whatever length of time .... Free!!
Free from the confines of eternity. Free to ask .. Why do I exist. Free to make choices , both good and evil. You and the whole universe exist to that the never beginning , never ending soul can know Freedom.

MountainGuardian
Monday, March 21st, 2011, 02:35 AM
I believe that everything that exists is one thing... The overall consciousness that we refer to as God, is the whole or sum of everything.

I feel that we and all else are just a part of, this consciousnous.
I view us and our existence in the same way that I view the cells that make up my body.

My mind is the overall consciousness of the total of all the cells that make up my body. My mind is in basic control of all my cells, though not in total control of every action and reaction, it is more of a guide.

My cells have the ability to go their own way against my will, such as becoming cancerous and multiplying without control or guidance, using up resources neccesary for other tissues and directly interfering with other tissues.

I see "God" as the whole body and the overall concsious mind, all matter, energy, life and concsiousnes makes up the body.

I hate to say it, but I also view humanity the same as I would cancer, it multiplies without control and uses all resources to fuel that goal, even to the extent of killing off the body that allows us to exist in the first place.

How long would the body allow the cancer to continue and spread before removing it and destroying it.

I will fully admit I have very unusual take on this and I hope I do not offend anyone with my view... it just is what it is.


I seek truth, not the desire of my will... quote from Ed Ortman