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Barreldriver
Monday, December 13th, 2010, 12:54 AM
Does anyone know the origin of this name? I've searched around and came up with nothing, everything comes up as Goethe not Gethe, I am asking mainly because my mtDNA lineage is supposedly of the Gethe family, on ancestry.com my cousins who are researching the line trace it back to Sweden (no specific region sadly), I'm more inclined to think that the ancestor was German because her husband was a German Mennonite surname Horneck and there's a German name Goethe which has a similar spelling to Gethe.

One thing though that is making me question the German origin is the Finnish mtDNA matches that I have, and my ancestral origins tab lists Finland at the very top. Were there German immigrants even to Finland perhaps that could account for this? I'm also getting some non-Finnish matches but the ancestral origins tab has Finland

These are the high resolution matches at FTDNA (no FGS matches sadly, just full matches across both HVR's), Finnish surnames in bold:

Vartiainen
Tuohineva
Goodman (English)
Carvalho (Portuguese)
Lappalainen
Nuutinen
Vick (Anglo-Norman and North German)
Velken (seems to be Norwegian)
Traxler (South German)
Ferraz (Portuguese?)

High Resolution Ancestral Origins:

Finland 6 - 6 717 0.8%
Ireland 1 - 1 2,205 < 0.1%
Portugal 2 - 2 221 0.9%
United Kingdom 1 - 1 1,798 0.1%

Also at Genetree I'm exact matches with the Christensens of Jutland and the Catani's and Wallius of Finland.

Juthunge
Monday, December 13th, 2010, 01:37 AM
Humm, doesn't sound like a typical German name to me, not surprising since there are apparently only 4 people/families with that surname in Germany (and none in Austria), making a German origin rather unlikely.

Barreldriver
Monday, December 13th, 2010, 01:45 AM
Humm, doesn't sound like a typical German name to me, not surprising since there are apparently only 4 people/families with that surname in Germany (and none in Austria), making a German origin rather unlikely.

Curious where the figures are from? I've tried searching the name on ancestry.com with the surnames origins thing and it came back with "sorry surname is not in database". I ask because I'm interested in running the figures for Sweden or surrounding regions.

This irritates me that I can't pin this name, don't know if I should trust the ancestry.com tree listing Sweden as this ancestors birth place, though my mtDNA matches are majority from areas rather close to Sweden (mostly Finland and Jutland).

Will say thanks for the reply though, glad an actual German voiced some input, adds some validity to the name not being German.

Hesse
Monday, December 13th, 2010, 01:49 AM
Have you ever heard of the German writer Johann Wolfgang von Goethe? It certainly rings to me as a German name!

I would be very proud and pleased to see this surname appear in my family tree. Maybe you're related to him. The chances of relations based on surname are unlikely, but there's somewhat of a possibility being the name is somewhat uncommon!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johann_Wolfgang_von_Goethe

As far as the "Gethe" version, I don't know where to go from there. It could just be a spelling variant.

Barreldriver
Monday, December 13th, 2010, 01:55 AM
Have you ever heard of the German writer Johann Wolfgang von Goethe?

I would be very proud and pleased to see this surname appear in my family tree. Maybe you're related to him. The chances of relations based on surname are unlikely, but there's somewhat of a possibility being the name is somewhat uncommon!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johann_Wolfgang_von_Goethe

As far as the "Gethe" version, I don't know where to go from there. It could just be a spelling variant.

Perhaps a German family that immigrated to Sweden (hence the possible German surname and the Swedish birthplace).

I still am curious though why people from Finland and Jutland are my strongest mtDNA matches (I have matches from elsewhere but they aren't of as high a resolution, I'm a perfect match with the Christensen's of Jutland, the Wallius and Catani's of Finland via Genetree HVR I, II, III, then on FTDNA a good number of my matches are also Finnish, plus the ancestral origins tab has Finland listed as the highest score). Perhaps they were German immigrants to Sweden who had relatives who later migrated to Finland or to Jutland thus causing the lineages to get lost. Despite the strong genetic matches I'm not finding a paper trail confirmation to any of the previously mentioned families.

Juthunge
Monday, December 13th, 2010, 02:01 AM
Curious where the figures are from? I've tried searching the name on ancestry.com with the surnames origins thing and it came back with "sorry surname is not in database". I ask because I'm interested in running the figures for Sweden or surrounding regions.


http://christoph.stoepel.net/geogen/v3/

It's a page which only works for Germany and Austria, it shows you both the absolute and percental distribution of names based on the phone book.

Haven't found something similar for Sweden unfortunately. That's the Swedish yellow pages though, which you probably have found yourself already: http://gulasidorna.eniro.se/

Blackeagle
Monday, December 13th, 2010, 02:18 AM
Have you ever heard of the German writer Johann Wolfgang von Goethe? It certainly rings to me as a German name!

I would be very proud and pleased to see this surname appear in my family tree. Maybe you're related to him. The chances of relations based on surname are unlikely, but there's somewhat of a possibility being the name is somewhat uncommon!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johann_Wolfgang_von_Goethe

As far as the "Gethe" version, I don't know where to go from there. It could just be a spelling variant.

It could also be a product of one of the many local German dialects. I do not have a definite answer, but it has to be either one or the other.

The western regions of Germania used to be (Much still is) under French occupation. Maybe a "hybrid name" came during the few years Napoleon ruled there.

Ocko
Monday, December 13th, 2010, 02:38 AM
The phonebook (http://www.dasoertliche.de/)

gives you 3 names, one in Berlin and two in Magdeburg

Finnish Telefonbook (http://www.phonebookoffinland.com/) gives you none with that name

the swedish phonebook (http://personer.eniro.se/resultat/Gethe) gives you 4 people with the name Gete

Gethe seems to be Saechsisch (dialekt spoken in the State of Saxon ((not related to the homeland of the tribe saxon))) for Goethe.

It is also true that the names still during Goethes time were not really fixed in the way to write it, often it was written how one speaks (spoke) it. Even Goethe himself used different ways to write his name.

In old westfalian Dialekt 'Getaa' means something like a weaving mechanism. Might be that the name Gethe is connected to that as names often were given for the profession of a man.

In old saechsisch (thats close were those 2 entries in the phonebook came from) 'getoe' means something like flatware (Geschirr in high german) or an apparatus (Geraet, could also mean an apparatus for weaving)

Hammer of Thor
Monday, December 13th, 2010, 05:04 AM
I tried searching a few places for the Gethe name, but I couldn't find anything significant.

I tried these in addition to those sites tried by others:

http://worldnames.publicprofiler.org/
http://www.houseofnames.com

Sorry, I could not contribute more. Good luck with your search.

Hammer of Thor

Barreldriver
Monday, December 13th, 2010, 04:35 PM
I tried searching a few places for the Gethe name, but I couldn't find anything significant.

I tried these in addition to those sites tried by others:

http://worldnames.publicprofiler.org/
http://www.houseofnames.com

Sorry, I could not contribute more. Good luck with your search.

Hammer of Thor

Ran it through the worldnames site. Came out German, rare but German, Sachsen-Anhalt and Brandenburg.

Barreldriver
Monday, December 13th, 2010, 04:44 PM
I'm thinking of deleting this section of my family tree, not enough primary sources to connect to much with near 100% confidence and not finding primary sources citing specific birth place is pissing me off. Gonna go through and trim the tree a bit more in other branches. Anything without a certain number of certain types of primary sources is to be deleted (not worried about using the pedigree for racial purity arguments since I've got extensive BGA DNA tests done proving just that for the past 2000 years or so).