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Ediruc
Friday, April 16th, 2010, 04:54 AM
After looking at my Aragorn/Historical figure thread in the literature section, looking at what Thusnelda posted, and thinking some of it over. I just want to know what Hermann did was really that big of an impact on Germanics?

The Romans were accustomed to sending different ethnic soldiers to different and far away territories of the Roman Empire. Since Rome had conquered parts of Africa, they would most likely send Nubian troops onto the frontiers in the North, but, correct me if I am mistaken, why hasn't a Black African skeleton ever been discovered, in, let's say, Britain? Or, Gaul from that time period?

Did Hermann's victory in the Teutoberg Forest really had that huge of an impact on our people? What if Hermann lost? Would it really have led to the integration and mixture of foreign ethnic groups with the Germans?

Bernhard
Friday, April 16th, 2010, 01:19 PM
Did Hermann's victory in the Teutoberg Forest really had that huge of an impact on our people? What if Hermann lost? Would it really have led to the integration and mixture of foreign ethnic groups with the Germans?

If it wasn't for Hermann's victory a large part of Germania would have probably become something like France: assimilated into Roman society and thus adopting its culture and language. Germania till the Elbe river was already a part of the Roman empire military speaking. They only had to conquer it culturally, a process which had already begun. The victory at the Teutoburg Forest made the Romans turn back and create their Limes at the Rhine.

Of course it is rather speculative to say that without this battle things would have turned out to be different. Someone else could have taken up arms against the Romans and considering all the Germanic tribes that came from Scandinavia and regions to the east of the river Elbe during the migration period, this could have turned the tide as well at a later stage. But this is not the case. Hermann was the one to chase away the Romans and thus it makes him an important figure and true hero for us Germanics. And since the origins of the Franks are at the Rhine, they were most likely to be assimilated into Roman society (think of the Ubians who where moved into the Roman empire by Julius Caesar) and history would have been very different. The Franks after all have laid the fundaments for the German nation.

But again, we can speculate all we want, the only thing we know is that Hermann was the one who made the Romans leave and saved Germania from Roman occupatian.

I recommend the second part of the series posted by Hauke Haien in this thread: http://forums.skadi.net/showthread.php?t=131398

Ocko
Friday, April 16th, 2010, 02:30 PM
The reasons why Varus forayed into germanic lands was to secure the land to the river Elbe for the romans. His job had been to find places where it would be strategically a good place for fortresses. The idea were to make strongholds to control the area and find out how much taxes would be able to squeeze out of Germany.

Germanics didn't want the romans in Germany for a reason.

There were of course factions who wanted the romans to succeed for their own power gains and of course they admired the cultural prowess of the romans.

Flavus, the brother of Hermann, fought all the time on the side of the romans, even if they attacked germanic tribes. The father in law of Hermann was a romanist. He abducted his own daughter Thusnelda and his grandson and handed them over to the romans who enslaved them.

Through Hermanns leadership the germanic tribes united (rare occasion) and destroyed the legions of the romans totally.

The romans were economically thinking that the costs to control the germanic lands were bigger than the (tax-) gains and dropped the idea, as soldiers were urgently needed at other parts of the empire.

For the romans it has been like a Stalingrad. They backed off.

The romanizing faction came to a halt and lost its vigor.

OneWolf
Friday, April 16th, 2010, 05:31 PM
The story of the massacre of the Romans in the Teutoburgerwald is one
the greatest events in History.Not only was Hermann more intelligent than
Varus,he and the united German tribes destroyed an army that was at the
height of it's power.Think about that for a moment.
The first century A.D. saw the Roman Empire near it's height.It's capital,Rome
was not just the center,but the envy,of the known world.
Rome had just conqured Gaul and it's newest target for imperial expansion was
the wilderness region beyond the Rhine known as Germany.
Then in A.D.9,twenty-two years into pacifying,civilizing the "Barbarians"-Rome
suffered a reverse,due to the brilliance of Arminius,from which it never really recovered from.
The defeat caused the Romans to withdraw and left the "Furor Teutonicus"
unmolested by the Roman way of life and free to continue and evolve their
way of life.
Why the victory is so important to Germanics and me is this.The course of
European History,and the worlds,would have been very different if Rome would
have won that day.The Roman Empire would have been saved from ruin,
there would have been no Saxon invasion of England,no English language,
no United States,no Protestant reformation,no Fredrick the Great,no Kaiser
Wilhelm,no Hitler and everything and everyone would be Roman.:thumbdown
Rome would probably still be ruling the world today in Hermann The Cherusker
had not won the day 2,000 years ago.