PDA

View Full Version : What Are the Arabic Cromagnid Types?



Rassenhygieniker
Friday, May 22nd, 2009, 11:12 PM
CMs in the Europid spectrum are Dalofaelids, Brünns and such, but what about CMs from the Arabid spectrum? By “Arabid” I only mean populations who belong to the Haplogroup J.

Pictures as a mean of illustration would be appreciated too.

mvbeleg
Sunday, May 24th, 2009, 04:08 AM
CMs in the Europid spectrum are Dalofaelids, Brünns and such, but what about CMs from the Arabid spectrum? By “Arabid” I only mean populations who belong to the Haplogroup J.

Pictures as a mean of illustration would be appreciated too.

I have not studied haplogroups much.

Coon placed Arabs as being part of "Mediterraneans proper" which itself fell under the White Race. Lundman's system had a type he called "Arabid"; it fell under his White or Europid Race. Von Eickstedt had a category of "Orientalid" that included two types: "Iranid" and "Arabid". The "Orientalid" category fell under Europid Race. The Arabids were, however, always described as a gracile type.

Personally, I have never seen a person from a Middle Eastern country who had full Cromagnid influence. I have seen some with Alpinoid [hence Cromagnoid] influence.




Perhaps you are asking this question: "What southern Cromagnid types have typologists identified?"



Agrippa has included two southern Cromagnid types in his system.

[See Agrippa's Classification System: http://forums.skadi.net/showthread.php?t=36155&highlight=classification+system+for+euro pids]



Europid - Cromagnid - Berid

Bertil Lundman identified a type he called Berid.


Within [southwestern Europe], however, there are remnants of the still smaller Berid race. This race is broader-formed in face and nose, but very similar to the West-Mediterranean race in the other anthropological traits - such as head form and pigmentation. The Berid race is also low in the frequency of blood type genes p and q. (The Races and Peoples of Europe, Bertil Lundman)

Lundman mentioned its strongholds being in Perigord [Western France], the Sierra Nevada region [Spain], and Sardinia. He also mentioned that there was a significant presence of Berid-like forms in the Aegean Islands.


Here is a link to a thread on the Berid type:

http://forums.skadi.net/showthread.php?t=62988&highlight=berid


Agrippa has placed it under his category of Cromagnid.



On a personal note, all of the persons of Berid-like appearance that I have met in person [Italians and Portuguese] had strong Alpinoid characteristics.


Here are photos of an individual who I think is classifiable as predominantly Berid.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/olmedia/1830000/images/_1833971_madjer02300.jpg

http://blogportista.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/02/madjer.jpg

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2315/2326072637_565491ae69.jpg?v=0

Subject: Rabah Madjer
Nationality: Algerian
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rabah_Madjer





Europid - Cromagnid - Beberid

Coon mentioned that Large-Faced Paleothilic types [what we call Cromagnids] could be found among the Northern Africa Berber peoples.


A fourth is a large-bodied, large-headed type, tending to mesocephaly, with a prominent lambdoid flattening especially visible when the scalp is shaven; the face is broad, the orbits low, as one can easily discern from the narrow palpebral opening and the presence of median or external eyefolds; the nose is short, straight, or sometimes snubbed, the mouth large, the chin prominent, and the jaw heavy. The pigmentation is usually mixed, with brown or reddish hair, and light-mixed eyes. This type, without further discussion, is obviously a somewhat reduced modern survival of the old Crô-Magnon-like Afalou men. It is found principally among the oldest Ruffian families, and among tribal office-holders. It is not rare in the Rif, and its reemergence parallels in a minor sense the reemergence of the same or a similar type in northwestern Europe. (The Races of Europe, C. S. Coon)

Here is a link to photos of persons that Coon regarded as Upper Paleolithic Survivals in Morocco:

http://www.theapricity.com/snpa/troeplate10.htm (http://www.theapricity.com/snpa/troeplate10.htm)


Agrippa has included a Berberid type under his Cromagnid category to account for Northern African Cromagnids.


Personally, I have never seen a Berberid type before.


Here are photos of someone I believe may be classifiable as predominantly Berberid.


http://zidane.aliencelebrities.com/wallpapers/zinedine_zidane_wallpaper_1920x1200.jpg

http://www.thepictureswarehouse.com/d/113738-1/Zinedine+Zidane+picture+5.jpg

http://www1.pictures.gi.zimbio.com/Crossing+Gala+Event+Hosted+IWC+Schaffhau sen+w3KHfrz_afVl.jpg

Subject: Zinedine Zidane
Ancestry: Kabylie Algerian
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zinedine_Zidane

Rassenhygieniker
Sunday, May 24th, 2009, 09:03 PM
Perhaps you are asking this question: "What southern Cromagnid types have typologists identified?"

No my question only regards groups who belong majorily to the J haplogroup. The examples of Berberids (Maghrebids) CM influences that you have provided would not apply to my question as these population do not belong to an unmixed ethnicity, Maghrebids being a mix of Europids, Arabids and Negroids, even though some Kabyle are relatively unmixed compared to the rest of the Maghreb. But still they belong mostly to the V Haplogroup population:


Subhaplotype Vb, predominant in a Berber population of Morocco 63.5%, was also found at high frequencies in southern Portugal (35.9%) and Andalusia 25.4%. Subhaplotype Va, dominant in Algeria 53.9% and Tunisia 50.6%, was also found at a relatively high frequency in Sicily 23.1% and Naples 16.4%, its highest frequency in Iberia was in northern Portugal 22.8% and Andalusia 15.5%.

My question regards only unmixed (or the least mixed) subtypes-proper who belong to the J Haplotypical groups.

Here are some exemplars:
http://img188.imageshack.us/img188/92/r21r21.jpg
http://img188.imageshack.us/img188/3310/r22r22.jpg
http://img32.imageshack.us/img32/5820/r23r23.jpg
http://img40.imageshack.us/img40/2585/r24r24.jpg

Nebulus
Tuesday, June 16th, 2009, 05:23 AM
Javier Bardem. Enough said.

I believe the CMs of Northern Europe derive from Berid people, but that's just me.

Rassenhygieniker
Saturday, June 20th, 2009, 10:47 PM
Javier Bardem. Enough said.

No not enough said, Javier Bardem is not arabid and even if he was he would not apply for being arabid proper in any way.

His CM influence is probably remnant of Visigoth blood.



I believe the CMs of Northern Europe derive from Berid people, but that's just me.

It's just you.

sql-vul
Tuesday, November 10th, 2009, 06:08 PM
Those are not Arab but Berber and they do look much European, most real Arabs fall under haplogroup j, they look oriental.