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Grimm
Tuesday, January 6th, 2009, 08:20 PM
I have to admit that I do not support the idea of any German enclaves in otherwise unGerman areas. The US and Canada (and possibly Australia and NZ) are exceptions.

While I'm pro-German, I can't be in favor of groups who are part of a country and show no affinity for that country nor its culture and customs, and from everything I've gathered the Volkdeutsche have never tried to be a part of any of their adopted countries in anyway. I have read that historically these Volkdeutsche, while not criminals nor sponges off society, have acted as if their adopted countries don't even exist. I've read that they have been known to refuse en masse to do things as simple as filling out census forms.

Even if the ancestors of these ethnic Germans were given an open invitation by Romania or the Czech Republic or Russia or wherever, I would understand any and all animosity that the common Romanians, Czechs, Russians, etc. may have towards them.

I think the Third Reich was doing the right thing to try to remove the Jews from Germany, so it would be hypocritical of me to have any problem with any non-German country trying to rid itself of Germans. (I am not talking about any final solution. I am talking about taking administrative steps to encourage emmigration.) I think Germany is currently giving free reign to too many foreign undesirables, who don't belong there, and while the Volkdeutsche are productive and contribute to their adopted homelands, I can't help but view them in a similar light.

I don't expect any Volkdeutsche here to care what I think, but I would be interested in any and all views on the subject.

(The US and Canada are obvious exceptions due the nature of their development. Australia and New Zealand may be excepted as well, although possibly not because their history is decidedly British until relatively recently.)

Brynhild
Tuesday, January 6th, 2009, 08:41 PM
In regards to Australia, you would be right about the settlement being mostly British. However, there were also free Germans who settled here and made important contributions to our society.

I know such communities are tight knit in this country, but whether or not they refuse to assimilate, I can't really say for certain. Other Germanic enclaves, like the Dutch and South Africans for example, embrace their new country and join in wholeheartedly.

What I do know about the Germans are that they tend to keep to themselves, you never hear of them causing trouble or making waves. They'd make the best neighbours! :D

Sissi
Tuesday, January 6th, 2009, 08:59 PM
I must say, that's a pretty warped view. Then by your definition, the New World, which is a result of European settlement is hypocritical? If the Native Americans wanted to rid themselves of the colonists from the New World, it would be acceptable to you, in the name of morality? Be careful with this "don't do to others what you don't want done to yourself" morality, because you're no saint either. No one is.

My opinion is this: I don't care if it's hypocritical to support ethnic Germans. I care about my people more than about foreigners, therefore I support them anywhere and everywhere. My people are more important to me than theoretical and relativist concepts of morality. I leave the concerns about foreigners to anti-racist activists. In fact, the anti-racists always remind our countries of the "imperialist past" and use it as an excuse to give more and more benefits to foreigners while they rob us of the most basic rights.

P.S. Some of the ethnic Germans exist in countries like Russia, Poland, the Czech Republic, because where they live was originally German land. The Sudetenland for example, which was occupied. The ethnic Germans there are right not to feel any connection to their occupiers.

Siebenbürgerin
Tuesday, January 6th, 2009, 09:20 PM
Hmm, I don't care about your personal view, but I just want to clarify something: I don't know of any Romanians who have feelings of "animosity" towards Transylvanian Saxons. In fact, in my city, Hermannstadt, most Romanians voted for a German party, the Democratic Forum of Germans in Romania and for a German mayor, Klaus Johannis, who was voted Personality of the Year for a European Romania. So, the German ethnics brought positive things to Transylvania, which are appreciated by Romanians.

SwordOfTheVistula
Tuesday, January 6th, 2009, 09:43 PM
I figure anyone with any sense will go to where one can best provide for oneself and one's family, regardless of where one's relatives has resided in the past. People have moved all over the place just in the past couple thousand years of recorded history, and probably long before that as well.

Grimm
Tuesday, January 6th, 2009, 10:10 PM
I must say, that's a pretty warped view. Then by your definition, the New World, which is a result of European settlement is hypocritical? If the Native Americans wanted to rid themselves of the colonists from the New World, it would be acceptable to you, in the name of morality? Be careful with this "don't do to others what you don't want done to yourself" morality, because you're no saint either. No one is..

Native Americans would have every right in the world to try to rid Europeans from their land.


My opinion is this: I don't care if it's hypocritical to support ethnic Germans. I care about my people more than about foreigners, therefore I support them anywhere and everywhere. My people are more important to me than theoretical and relativist concepts of morality. I leave the concerns about foreigners to anti-racist activists. In fact, the anti-racists always remind our countries of the "imperialist past" and use it as an excuse to give more and more benefits to foreigners while they rob us of the most basic rights..

I'm trying to balance my support for ethnic Germans with being fair. I don't like that Germany is inundated by foreigners who don't respect the country, so I won't support any ethnic Germans who are doing the same elsewhere. In fact even here in the USA I would resent it if Germans came and closed up communities and showed no interest in learning about my country. I don't like when Mexicans do it, so I'm not going to like it when Germans do it either.


P.S. Some of the ethnic Germans exist in countries like Russia, Poland, the Czech Republic, because where they live was originally German land. The Sudetenland for example, which was occupied. The ethnic Germans there are right not to feel any connection to their occupiers.

These cases are different. I would need to know the history of the area, before making my decision. I'd likely support ethnic Germans living in Alsace Loraine, but would be less likely to support ethnic Germans from formerly German areas of Russia, as these were taken by force by Germany to begin with.

Sissi
Tuesday, January 6th, 2009, 10:28 PM
Native Americans would have every right in the world to try to rid Europeans from their land.
I guess the anti-European ideology of guilt and self-hatred has had its say on your world view. Sad.


I'm trying to balance my support for ethnic Germans with being fair. I don't like that Germany is inundated by foreigners who don't respect the country, so I won't support any ethnic Germans who are doing the same elsewhere. In fact even here in the USA I would resent it if Germans came and closed up communities and showed no interest in learning about my country. I don't like when Mexicans do it, so I'm not going to like it when Germans do it either.
You would prefer it if Mexicans lived the American way, sang your anthem, flew your flag and mixed with your people? Integration is the enemy of preservation. There's something else I don't understand, you say you wouldn't blame non-German countries if they wanted to rid themselves of ethnic Germans. You think they should go ba ck to Germany. But at the same time you want them to integrate. If ethnic Germans integrate, they will lose connection to their heritage and they won't feel at home if they're brought back to Germany. Maybe the Germans won't want them either. This is happening as a matter of fact, with some of them. The occupational forces didn't allow them to retain their heritage, so they turned into identitiless individuals. That's a really sad fact.


These cases are different. I would need to know the history of the area, before making my decision. I'd likely support ethnic Germans living in Alsace Loraine, but would be less likely to support ethnic Germans from formerly German areas of Russia, as these were taken by force by Germany to begin with.
That's not true.
http://forums.skadi.net/showpost.php?p=248489&postcount=1

But for the sake of the argument, we could go back in time long enough, and no one would "rightfully belong" where he is. I guess I should "go back" to Scandinavia since that's the "womb" Germanics emerged from, or even further, we should all go back to Africa or wherever our ancestors originally came to life. :|

Grimm
Tuesday, January 6th, 2009, 10:31 PM
Hmm, I don't care about your personal view, but I just want to clarify something: I don't know of any Romanians who have feelings of "animosity" towards Transylvanian Saxons.

Maybe this is true. Maybe your situation is different from that of other Volkdeutsche of which I've read. But what would the rank and file of this forum think about the opposite happening in Germany? A foreign group living in Germany, not wanting to learn German, not wanting to become Germans, wanting to keep all of their customs and adopt none of the Germans - what would Germans think of that?

A couple of Germans have told me that the current descendants of Polish immigrants from the 1800's have been accepted as Germans, mainly due to the fact that most have had the Polish bred out of them by mating with Germans and because they've given up all of their Polish customs. You on the otherhand have made it clear that you would never mate with a Romanian or give up your German customs. That's fine. But if it was and is ok for the Germans to resent the Jews and Roma and Sorbs and any other foreign element for being that way, then it would be ok for Romanians to resent you for being that way.

Sissi
Tuesday, January 6th, 2009, 10:44 PM
But what would the rank and file of this forum think about the opposite happening in Germany? A foreign group living in Germany, not wanting to learn German, not wanting to become Germans, wanting to keep all of their customs and adopt none of the Germans - what would Germans think of that?
I don't want foreigners to learn German and adopt my country's customs and culture. I don't want foreigners here to begin with, but if they're going to be here, they shouldn't integrate and become assimilated by my ethnos, because then it will be near impossible to repatriate them. I'd prefer ethnic enclaves of foreigners to them mingling everywhere.

Grimm
Tuesday, January 6th, 2009, 10:56 PM
I guess the anti-European ideology of guilt and self-hatred has had its say on your world view. Sad.:|

I'm not saying I want the Native American to succeed. I'm saying I would not resent him for wanting his land back. It's like sport - I want to beat you but I'm not going to be outraged that you want to beat me.



You would prefer it if Mexicans lived the American way, sang your anthem, flew your flag and mixed with your people?:|

Mexicans here should live our way. They should sing our national anthem. They should fly our flag. If one of them falls in love with one of us and vice versa, then who am I to say they shouldn't procreate? If it's infatuation due to racial differences, then it's unfortunate. But if it's true love, then it's true love. C'est la vie.



Integration is the enemy of preservation. There's something else I don't understand, you say you wouldn't blame non-German countries if they wanted to rid themselves of ethnic Germans. You think they should go ba ck to Germany. But at the same time you want them to integrate.:|

I feel that an immigrant has a responsibility to become a part of his/her new country. If not, then they shouldn't complain if the citizens resent them.




That's not true.
http://forums.skadi.net/showpost.php?p=248489&postcount=1



But for the sake of the argument, we could go back in time long enough, and no one would "rightfully belong" where he is. I guess I should "go back" to Scandinavia since that's the "womb" Germanics emerged from, or even further, we should all go back to Africa or wherever our ancestors originally came to life. :|

These lands have become Slavic. I won't say it's wrong if Germany wants to go and get them back. Every group has the right to self-determination. I just think that now that it's Russian, it's Russian, and if I were a Rusky I'd resent Germans living there and speaking German and not having any loyalty to my country.


I don't want foreigners to learn German and adopt my country's customs and culture. I don't want foreigners here to begin with, but if they're going to be here, they shouldn't integrate and become assimilated by my ethnos, because then it will be near impossible to repatriate them. I'd prefer ethnic enclaves of foreigners to them mingling everywhere.

I don't feel as strongly about separatism as you. I think it's interesting that occasionally you'll stumble across a Canaris or a Potente or a Borowski, and he or she is evidence of a longdead foreign ancestor whose legacy has become entirely German.

Siebenbürgerin
Tuesday, January 6th, 2009, 11:01 PM
Maybe this is true. Maybe your situation is different from that of other Volkdeutsche of which I've read. But what would the rank and file of this forum think about the opposite happening in Germany? A foreign group living in Germany, not wanting to learn German, not wanting to become Germans, wanting to keep all of their customs and adopt none of the Germans - what would Germans think of that?
I think Sissi is right, it's better to keep the ancestral customs than integrate. Because if you integrate you won't be able to go back to your ancestral country as easily.


A couple of Germans have told me that the current descendants of Polish immigrants from the 1800's have been accepted as Germans, mainly due to the fact that most have had the Polish bred out of them by mating with Germans and because they've given up all of their Polish customs. You on the otherhand have made it clear that you would never mate with a Romanian or give up your German customs. That's fine. But if it was and is ok for the Germans to resent the Jews and Roma and Sorbs and any other foreign element for being that way, then it would be ok for Romanians to resent you for being that way.
No, I won't give up my customs. Why should I? I'm not Romanian so it's not my duty to carry Romanian customs. Yes, you're right it would be ok for Romanians to resent me for being that way. But I don't care what others think of me. I care about my ethnic duty. Because this is where I was born, where I live, and where my people created a culture, which is our unique culture, the Transylvanian Saxon culture. We speak German of course, but we are a branch of our own, like the Bavarians, Swabians, Saxons and all other are. But the Romanians don't resent me. The situation of Transylvanian Saxons is very complicated. When our ancestors were invited here, this wasn't Romania. This land was administrated by the Hungarians. It was "Hungary" then. In it, the Transylvanian Saxons founded big cities like Hermannstadt, Kronstadt and other. So the cities in which a majority of Romanians live today, are "our" creation. Romanians took control of Transylvania after the wars and now it's part of Romania. But it wasn't always so. So the result is three major ethnicities living in the same land.

For your information, I pondered moving to Germany. Not because I'm resented by Romanians, but because there are few ethnic Germans left here. Many went to Germany and remained there. And it's not quite easy to find partners of my age of German ethnicity, I don't have lots of choices.

Sissi
Tuesday, January 6th, 2009, 11:15 PM
I'm not saying I want the Native American to succeed. I'm saying I would not resent him for wanting his land back. It's like sport - I want to beat you but I'm not going to be outraged that you want to beat me.
I have a different view from yours. I resent anyone who tries to hurt my country or my people, even if my people "deserve" it from a philosophical or moral point of view. Philosophy and morals aren't ends in themselves from my point of view. If they don't benefit my people in some way, then they're not useful to me.


Mexicans here should live our way. They should sing our national anthem. They should fly our flag. If one of them falls in love with one of us and vice versa, then who am I to say they shouldn't procreate? If it's infatuation due to racial differences, then it's unfortunate. But if it's true love, then it's true love. C'est la vie.
I beg to differ on this. I'm a nationalist and ethnocentrist, so I'm against procreation with foreigners. I want my nation to preserve its heritage, including ethnic and racial.


I feel that an immigrant has a responsibility to become a part of his/her new country. If not, then they shouldn't complain if the citizens resent them.
I don't expect the host countries should have any responsibility or positive feelings towards the ethnic Germans. It's us, Germans, who should look after our own interests, including the interests of our brothers and sisters abroad. We won't be getting anywhere if we expect others to do things for us. If we wallow in lessons of morality and theoretical concepts, we will do harm to our people.


These lands have become Slavic. I won't say it's wrong if Germany wants to go and get them back. Every group has the right to self-determination. I just think that now that it's Russian, it's Russian, and if I were a Rusky I'd resent Germans living there and speaking German and not having any loyalty to my country.
Like I said, I don't care whether they resent Germans or not. I don't care if it's hypocritical. My care is about my own kind, the German folk. It's what matters to me from a pragmatic point of view.


I don't feel as strongly about separatism as you. I think it's interesting that occasionally you'll stumble across a Canaris or a Potente or a Borowski, and he or she is evidence of a longdead foreign ancestor whose legacy has become entirely German.
Yes, that might be. We aren't pure, no one is that naive. But that doesn't mean we should assimilate even more foreigners, just because it happened in our past. We should learn from mistakes, not repeat them.

Grimm
Tuesday, January 6th, 2009, 11:21 PM
In it, the Transylvanian Saxons founded big cities like Hermannstadt, Kronstadt and other. So the cities in which a majority of Romanians live today, are "our" creation. Romanians took control of Transylvania after the wars and now it's part of Romania. But it wasn't always so. So the result is three major ethnicities living in the same land.
.

I see that point, and Sissi made a similar point regarding ever changing demographics. I guess I feel that whatever country owns the land now, is the boss. An Alsace-Loraine would be an exception, because it borders present-day Germany and is comprised almost entirely (I think) of ethnic Germans


No, I won't give up my customs. Why should I? I'm not Romanian so it's not my duty to carry Romanian customs. Yes, you're right it would be ok for Romanians to resent me for being that way. But I don't care what others think of me. I care about my ethnic duty..

I suppose I don't really feel negatively about German enclaves at all, not when the ethnic Germans are openminded enough to see both sides of it, as you obviously are. I was looking for some validation that ethnic Germans (Volkdeutsche or not) can understand and accept that some native (for lack of a better word) populations may be resentful.

Nachtengel
Tuesday, January 6th, 2009, 11:28 PM
I suppose I don't really feel negatively about German enclaves at all, not when the ethnic Germans are openminded enough to see both sides of it, as you obviously are. I was looking for some validation that ethnic Germans (Volkdeutsche or not) can understand and accept that some native (for lack of a better word) populations may be resentful.
It's certainly understandable, but why should it be acceptable? Why should ethnic Germans subscribe to the same set of morals as foreigners? Why should they let someone else dictate what they should do? Morality is relative and you'll always be able to find a justification for something because you'll always find a culture that accepts it. Some cultures accept sex between children and adults, incest, and so forth. To them it's moral. The question is, why should we subscribe to anything else but our own ideology? Ethnic Germans who stay German are preservationists. According to preservationist ideology, one must perpetuate the race, ethnicity and culture of the ancestors. That's what they're doing. No matter where. No matter the means. So from their angle, it's fair.

Grimm
Wednesday, January 7th, 2009, 12:26 AM
I mainly posted this thread to see if ethnic Germans would see both sides of the equation, and Sissi and Siebenbürgerin do. I really can't argue with either of you. I was figuring I would run into some ethnic Germans who would try to explain why Germans have the right to occupy foreign lands whereas non-Germans do not. I thought there would be some kind of moral argument, but I was wrong. You are both committed German preservationists, and you make no excuses nor do you hide behind some skewered vision of right and wrong.


I don't expect the host countries should have any responsibility or positive feelings towards the ethnic Germans. It's us, Germans, who should look after our own interests, including the interests of our brothers and sisters abroad..

Would Germany be quick to come to the aid of ethnic Germans in foreign countries? In a perfect world they would, but currently I'm not so sure.


It's certainly understandable, but why should it be acceptable?

"Accept" was a poor choice of words. I didn't mean accepting any abuse. I just meant accepting that Romanians or Russians or whathaveyou may feel the same towards you as Germans feel towards the foreign populations inside Germany.


I beg to differ on this. I'm a nationalist and ethnocentrist, so I'm against procreation with foreigners. I want my nation to preserve its heritage, including ethnic and racial.

My country is a melting pot, as they say. I don't have too much concern over who mixes. Anyone can be an American. To be a good American I really have to accept everyone, as long as they respect this country.

And I think a tiny amount of foreign (mainly Germanic) genes mixing into the ethnic German population of Germany isn't a bad thing. Foreigners have been bred into every ethnicity all over the world, and I think it's a natural occurence. But alas there is no way to keep tabs on it and control it, so in the grand scheme of things not allowing it to happen may be the only way to make sure it doesn't go too far.

Sissi
Wednesday, January 7th, 2009, 12:43 AM
I mainly posted this thread to see if ethnic Germans would see both sides of the equation, and Sissi and Siebenbürgerin do. I really can't argue with either of you. I was figuring I would run into some ethnic Germans who would try to explain why Germans have the right to occupy foreign lands whereas non-Germans do not. I thought there would be some kind of moral argument, but I was wrong. You are both committed German preservationists, and you make no excuses nor do you hide behind some skewered vision of right and wrong.
I'd be naive to think that if I suddenly speak against ethnic Germans, Muslim countries would start speaking against Muslim immigration, or if my people don't immigrate to another country their people won't either. The world doesn't work according to the principle "treat others as you want to be treated". Our history is full of wars, occupation and attempts of occupation and the important thing for me is the survival and preservation of my people. We can look at the animal kingdom. For a species to live, another has to die or be pushed out of a territory. It's not "right", of course, but it's how nature is like. It doesn't mean I want the foreigners to disappear, to an extent I care about their fate too, the European ones I mean. I don't want Romania or Russia to be invaded by non-European immigrants, because that would mean they would be closer to my country and have it easier to immigrate here. But Germans there don't bother me, it doesn't threaten my folk. Like I said in the thread about culture preservation ->> here (http://forums.skadi.net/showpost.php?p=856640&postcount=45), I just don't care for the fate of foreign cultures as much as I do for the fate of my people.


Would Germany be quick to come to the aid of ethnic Germans in foreign countries? In a perfect world they would, but currently I'm not so sure.
Not the current Germany. But I'm not talking about what it does, rather what I think it should do. In some of the old times it looked after the ethnic Germans. When ethnic Germans were persecuted in the Sudetenland and Poland right before WWII, Germany interfered to help them.


My country is a melting pot, as they say. I don't have too much concern over who mixes. Anyone can be an American. To be a good American I really have to accept everyone, as long as they respect this country.
I'm no American but I can't understand this thinking. I don't think anyone can be an American. American has a history behind it too, your country wasn't always a melting pot. It has founders, who were mostly Germanics. They took the land from the Native Americans, but they created a state there by themselves. You're not as old as the European countries, but that doesn't mean you should accept anyone. Wouldn't a "good American" defend the status his ancestors had, the principles they stood for? I doubt the founding fathers of America wrote the Declaration of Independence for Mexicans, Africans, Asians, Muslims and other foreigners. America opened its borders to this kind of immigration only later.


And I think a tiny amount of foreign (mainly Germanic) genes mixing into the ethnic German population of Germany isn't a bad thing. Foreigners have been bred into every ethnicity all over the world, and I think it's a natural occurence. But alas there is no way to keep tabs on it and control it, so in the grand scheme of things not allowing it to happen may be the only way to make sure it doesn't go too far.
I'm not against a tiny input of Germanic genes in Germany because they're compatible racially, but we were talking about something else, about racial foreigners like Mexicans, who are alien to the Germanic genepool and I can't understand why any good American would want them to integrate in his country.

Soten
Wednesday, January 7th, 2009, 12:59 AM
My country is a melting pot, as they say. I don't have too much concern over who mixes. Anyone can be an American. To be a good American I really have to accept everyone, as long as they respect this country.


Who taught you that garbage? Schoolhouse Rock?

ZWJ4udW41Ns

America is founded by the English...but also the French, Dutch, and...Germans!

Skip nearly 300 years of history and then it really kicks in with Slavs, Italians, Cubans, and Jews!

Hauke Haien
Wednesday, January 7th, 2009, 01:11 AM
Would Germany be quick to come to the aid of ethnic Germans in foreign countries? In a perfect world they would, but currently I'm not so sure.
I greatly admire our Germans who have remained loyal to Germandom despite great adversity. The only way to come to their aid is through the creation of a folkish state that expands across the territory where they reside, or at least exerts indirect control over it. Under present circumstances, there is not a single German state in existence, anywhere, and "Germany" remains an ethno-cultural concept without independent statehood on its soil.


My country is a melting pot, as they say. I don't have too much concern over who mixes. Anyone can be an American. To be a good American I really have to accept everyone, as long as they respect this country.
Then you should stop being American, or redefine American identity in such a way that this anti-Germanic obligation is no longer placed on you.


And I think a tiny amount of foreign (mainly Germanic) genes mixing into the ethnic German population of Germany isn't a bad thing. Foreigners have been bred into every ethnicity all over the world, and I think it's a natural occurence.
Yes, of course. The important thing is to make sure that our population as an organic entity is developed in a positive direction and this also concerns the individuals it encompasses, as well as cohesion between all parts.


But alas there is no way to keep tabs on it and control it
Not at the moment, but there should be systems in place that encourage beneficial outcomes.

TheGreatest
Wednesday, January 7th, 2009, 11:40 AM
Who taught you that garbage? Schoolhouse Rock?

America is founded by the English...but also the French, Dutch, and...Germans!

Skip nearly 300 years of history and then it really kicks in with Slavs, Italians, Cubans, and Jews!


It's horrible. I was talking to an Australian at the Bar on this subject. Italians converged en masse to his country in the 1950's and completely turned Australia from a Celtic nation to a Mediterranean one.
It's unfair that we took millions of these Slavs/Italians/Cubans/Jews, in addition to being parasitical (when was the last time we saw an Italian in an occupation that generated wealth?) they are non-compatible.



I can relate with Siebenbürgerin's position. I have trouble finding a compatible partner of similar ethnicity and age. At least where I live and go to school, most of the people in my age group are foreigners, mixed in ethnicity and/or otherwise incompatible.

Grimm
Wednesday, January 7th, 2009, 05:52 PM
It's amazing how much one can say and then realize that he didn't explain his position very well at all, specifically my views on immigration and integration.

For instance Sissi wanted the foreign populations of Germany to keep to themselves, and I wanted them to integrate. I should have specified that although I believe in integration, in my ideal Germany immigration would be SEVERELY restricted. It would be a trickle compared to what it is now, and the huge foreign influx (of Turks mainly) would never have happened in the first place.

I see a Germany that is maybe 3.5% non-German Germanics and 1.5% non-Germanic as being ideal. This 5% would dedicate themselves to Germany and do everything they could to become Germans and would mate with Germans (if the Germans would mate with them). After a couple or so generations, their bloodlines would be more German than not and eventually would become just about entirely German.

I know that this is in direct opposition of what many feel is Germanic preservation, but I feel I'd rather have Germany absorb a degree of foreigners than to have small enclaves of foreigners who remain loyal to their former countries. The only other answer would be to totally forbid immigration by non-Germanics, and then Germany would lose the respect of almost the entire rest of the world.

My views on the US are liberal but probably not as liberal as they seem. For instance I'm staunchly against all illegal immigration, but I do respect people of all kinds coming here and being here legally, as long as they put America first. Sometimes my views against blacks, Hispanics, and Jews are negative, but that's only when I feel like they are working against what's good for my country. When those non-Germanics work hard, fly right, and put America first I'm not going to condemn them.

Hauke Haien
Wednesday, January 7th, 2009, 06:29 PM
The only other answer would be to totally forbid immigration by non-Germanics, and then Germany would lose the respect of almost the entire rest of the world.
The world applauds us now for killing ourselves peacefully, or scolds us for not doing it fast enough, but the only nations they truly respect are the ones capable of destroying them, such as the US, Russia and China, despite their conduct. Our demographic policy is our most vital interest and foreign attempts to interfere with this are essentially an act of aggression.


My views on the US are liberal but probably not as liberal as they seem. For instance I'm staunchly against all illegal immigration, but I do respect people of all kinds coming here and being here legally, as long as they put America first. Sometimes my views against blacks, Hispanics, and Jews are negative, but that's only when I feel like they are working against what's good for my country. When those non-Germanics work hard, fly right, and put America first I'm not going to condemn them.
This is basically within the rights-based political tradition of the US, a horribly flawed tradition that has enabled the decline of Germanic Americans in the first place. In most of Europe, it is an alien concept that has nothing to do with our desire to build ethnic nations, folkish societies, tribal communities.

The worth of outsiders does not depend on their economic performance or criminal conduct, it is a question of whether they can fit in and help improve us on an individual as well as collective level and I am of the opinion that most non-Germanics can not.

Grimm
Wednesday, January 7th, 2009, 06:52 PM
The worth of outsiders does not depend on their economic performance or criminal conduct, it is a question of whether they can fit in and help improve us on an individual as well as collective level and I am of the opinion that most non-Germanics can not.

For Germany I agree entirely. I just like the fact that the world no longer hates Germany. I saw how the world came to Germany in 2006 and how Germany laid rest to ghosts that had been haunting them for the prior sixty years. This would never have happened had Germany stuck to any kind of ethnic or race-based agenda. Germany had to be more tolerant of outsiders than other countries in order to rid itself of its terrible reputation.

Of course, I'm on the outside looking in. I wasn't born in Germany, I didn't grow up in Germany, and I don't wake up each morning and go to sleep each night in Germany. I can never say that I fully understand the plight of the Germans or know what's best for them. In fact many of my feelings of wanting Germany to be accepted by the mulit-cultural world is no doubt due to me being born and raised in a multi-cultural country. I suppose I'm somewhat trapped between being a German and an American. I guess when you get right down to it I'm neither.

stormlord
Wednesday, January 7th, 2009, 08:23 PM
For Germany I agree entirely. I just like the fact that the world no longer hates Germany. I saw how the world came to Germany in 2006 and how Germany laid rest to ghosts that had been haunting them for the prior sixty years. This would never have happened had Germany stuck to any kind of ethnic or race-based agenda.

From your other comments you suggested that you disagreed with those saying that morality is relative and yet you're doing it here, if wrong is wrong, then why does the holocaust mean that Germany has to commit racial suicide while Israel can run what is in effect a highly militarised, ironically rather fascist, ethnostate?

Grimm
Wednesday, January 7th, 2009, 08:53 PM
From your other comments you suggested that you disagreed with those saying that morality is relative and yet you're doing it here, if wrong is wrong, then why does the holocaust mean that Germany has to commit racial suicide while Israel can run what is in effect a highly militarised, ironically rather fascist, ethnostate?

There's two ways one can go. One can be totally pro-German(ic) and decide that whatever is good for the folk is acceptable. Or one can try to be pro-German(ic) within the context of the world at large, preferring that all peoples follow the same moral compass. I have respect for both ways of thinking. Personally I feel torn between the two.

As far as Germany's past sixty years, I was only judging their methods by the results, which is having the respect of the world. I can't help but feel good about that, but I have acknowledged that what might be good for this German-American's heart may not have been in the best interest of the common German.

And I have no respect for Israel. If a bunch of Jews had gone in by themselves and taken Palestine, I would have respect for them. Instead they played on the sympathy of the world powers and had it given to them. They are the world's greatest con-artists, as they continue to convince the world at large that their religious fanatacism is rational and that they deserve to be defended.

Hauke Haien
Wednesday, January 7th, 2009, 09:25 PM
but I have acknowledged that what might be good for this German-American's heart may not have been in the best interest of the common German.
Not quite. What we have to keep in mind is the totality of all Germans that currently exist, have been in existence, and ever will be. The "common German" may very well have interests that radically diverge, such as selling out our biological base for petty wealth. It is easy to view the best of us as yet another resource that is squandered for short-sighted and unsustainable gain, given the fact that high-performing individuals are usually "rewarded" with childlessness and the resulting destruction of their blood line. It is a form of predatory exploitation the common German profits from.

Schmetterling
Thursday, January 8th, 2009, 05:21 AM
Grimm, the people who resent immigrants don't do it because they don't want to integrate. They do it because they're foreign period. Even if a German started speaking Russian fluently and adopted Russian culture, there still would be feelings of animosity towards him. As a matter of fact, sometimes flying the flag and singing the anthem when you're an immigrant is perceived as offensive by the natives.

My family immigrated to the USA when I was a child. They integrated quite quickly. My sister, particularly. She considers herself a proud American and wouldn't for a second think she is German. But one doesn't just become American overnight. To some Americans, my family are still German immigrants and nothing more. I moved to Germany. My parents and sister were left behind, because they prefer the USA. But I don't think they will ever be true Americans. There is that saying, a pig in a stable doesn't turn into a horse.

In the USA, however, it's much easier to integrate as you say, and to become American, because most people, like you, perceive America to be a melting pot, and everyone who comes off a ship or plane can be a true American. In Europe it's a whole different story. Here, for centuries, there was a clear outline between the native and the foreign. Jews who had been in Germany for centuries and spoke German as a native language were still considered Jews. Only minimal Slavic influence was accepted and that didn't mean openness to more Slavic marriages. That changed after WWII when the USA imposed its multicultural model on Germany.

TheGreatest
Thursday, January 8th, 2009, 09:14 AM
Grimm, the people who resent immigrants don't do it because they don't want to integrate. They do it because they're foreign period. Even if a German started speaking Russian fluently and adopted Russian culture, there still would be feelings of animosity towards him. As a matter of fact, sometimes flying the flag and singing the anthem when you're an immigrant is perceived as offensive by the natives.

My family immigrated to the USA when I was a child. They integrated quite quickly. My sister, particularly. She considers herself a proud American and wouldn't for a second think she is German. But one doesn't just become American overnight. To some Americans, my family are still German immigrants and nothing more. I moved to Germany. My parents and sister were left behind, because they prefer the USA. But I don't think they will ever be true Americans. There is that saying, a pig in a stable doesn't turn into a horse.

In the USA, however, it's much easier to integrate as you say, and to become American, because most people, like you, perceive America to be a melting pot, and everyone who comes off a ship or plane can be a true American. In Europe it's a whole different story. Here, for centuries, there was a clear outline between the native and the foreign. Jews who had been in Germany for centuries and spoke German as a native language were still considered Jews. Only minimal Slavic influence was accepted and that didn't mean openness to more Slavic marriages. That changed after WWII when the USA imposed its multicultural model on Germany.


The US was not "multicultural" in the 1950's, that wasn't well into the 1970's with the Jim Crow law, Revision of the Immigration system (1965; thanks JFK) and the Civil Rights' act.

And we didn't impose a "multicultural model" on anyone. The right of return was the idea of German Politicians, not during the occupation but actually going back to the National Socialists in the 1940's, when they handed out citizenship to the VD/ASL of Eastern Europe.
Now some of us might be responsible for changing social views in post-war Germany, but I imagine the Nazi losing was a far bigger impact in that regard than the Germans getting some foreign-dubbed Hollywood movies.

theTasmanian
Thursday, January 8th, 2009, 11:23 AM
(The US and Canada are obvious exceptions due the nature of their development. Australia and New Zealand may be excepted as well, although possibly not because their history is decidedly British until relatively recently.)

just to expand on what Brynhild posted one German community in Australia(most of my family are still there) that has assimilated and held onto its roots very well(its getting slowly eroded)

just for your interest;)

http://www.adhills.com.au/tourism/towns/hahndorf/

Grimm
Thursday, January 8th, 2009, 07:11 PM
Grimm, the people who resent immigrants don't do it because they don't want to integrate. They do it because they're foreign period. Even if a German started speaking Russian fluently and adopted Russian culture, there still would be feelings of animosity towards him. As a matter of fact, sometimes flying the flag and singing the anthem when you're an immigrant is perceived as offensive by the natives.

My family immigrated to the USA when I was a child. They integrated quite quickly. My sister, particularly. She considers herself a proud American and wouldn't for a second think she is German. But one doesn't just become American overnight. To some Americans, my family are still German immigrants and nothing more. I moved to Germany. My parents and sister were left behind, because they prefer the USA. But I don't think they will ever be true Americans. There is that saying, a pig in a stable doesn't turn into a horse.

In the USA, however, it's much easier to integrate as you say, and to become American, because most people, like you, perceive America to be a melting pot, and everyone who comes off a ship or plane can be a true American. In Europe it's a whole different story. Here, for centuries, there was a clear outline between the native and the foreign. Jews who had been in Germany for centuries and spoke German as a native language were still considered Jews. Only minimal Slavic influence was accepted and that didn't mean openness to more Slavic marriages. That changed after WWII when the USA imposed its multicultural model on Germany.

I don't want Germany to halt immigration and be a nation entirely of 100% German-blooded Germans, because that would cut them off from the world. On the other hand I wouldn't like to see a Germany with pockets of immigrants here and there, who aren't German in the least. My solution (which would be impossible to set out to create) would be a Germany with small amounts of immigrants who are eager to become Germans and are eager to intermarry with Germans and generate half-German offspring. Those offspring would want to marry full-Germans and generate 3/4 German offspring. I know this is very backwards compared to the thinking of most members, who want to keep the German genepool as uncontaminated as possible. Indeed it could get out of hand and to the point where all Germans had varying degrees of foreign blood. Obviously this would not be a desired result.

It is indeed a flawed theory. I think my views come somewhat from wanting a Germany that is entirely German, but not so. I couldn't imagine a Germany in this day and age made up entirely of fullblooded Germans, but I want everyone in Germany to at least be somewhat German. For instance I once read that Bruce Willis was the son of an American serviceman stationed in Germany and that he grew up there. That didn't make me feel any connection to him at all. Then I read another article which clarified that Bruce Willis' mother was a German woman. That made me feel a connection to Bruce Willis. He is half-German, which is better than not German at all.

As far as the USA and your experiences, I understand that there are people here who will never accept you and your family. I'm against not being accepting of immigrants who want to really be American. My father's parents came here from Germany in the mid-20's, and what they wanted from the moment they stepped foot in the USA was to be Americans. They studied hard and learned English very quickly. They kept some small aspects of their life German. They still ate wurst and Grandpa officiated fussball, but they also ate pizza and watched baseball. Some little customs were held onto, but not the language and not the idea of being German. They (and most importantly for them, their kids) were to be Americans.

They faced their share of prejudice during WWII, but they didn't resent the Americans for it. (In fact someone with a grudge reported them to the FBI accusing them of being Nazi-sympathizers. Federal agents showed up unannounced one day and started asking them questions and looking around the house. My grandfather had said you could see the surprise on one of the agents' faces when he looked through his bookshelf and found books by Thomas Mann. The interview didn't last very long after that, and my grandparents' names were entirely cleared.) Until they died they tried to be the best Americans they could.

I'm sorry that they did not pass on much of their culture to my father, but I'm not sorry that they strove wholeheartedly to become Americans. Anytime I see someone doing that, no matter what race or religion, I'm touched. And that some do it in the face of prejudice makes it that much more endearing.

Hauke Haien
Thursday, January 8th, 2009, 07:58 PM
I don't want Germany to halt immigration and be a nation entirely of 100% German-blooded Germans, because that would cut them off from the world. On the other hand I wouldn't like to see a Germany with pockets of immigrants here and there, who aren't German in the least. My solution (which would be impossible to set out to create) would be a Germany with small amounts of immigrants who are eager to become Germans and are eager to intermarry with Germans and generate half-German offspring. Those offspring would want to marry full-Germans and generate 3/4 German offspring.
This is also what I am thinking of, but I would restrict this to Germanics and the goal for them is not to become generic Germans, but truly enmeshed in their communities. It is actually quite simple: You either fit in or you do not, your presence either improves your community, also in a genetic sense, or it does not.

I notice this curious (and horrifying) idea that we have an obligation to continue the degermanisation of Germany, either for moral reasons or because it happened in the past. There is no such obligation. To the contrary, we need to reverse direction. Assimilation and integration of non-Germanics should take place in their own territories accompanied by continuous immigration, beginning in the Germanic core and permeating through the surrounding layers.

Grimm
Thursday, January 8th, 2009, 08:24 PM
Assimilation and integration of non-Germanics should take place in their own territories accompanied by continuous immigration, beginning in the Germanic core and permeating through the surrounding layers.

I'm not sure if I'm following this part. Are you saying that Germany should be expanding and integrating them while they are still within their homelands or are you talking about immigrants assimilating while in small enclaves within Germany?

Hauke Haien
Thursday, January 8th, 2009, 08:59 PM
I am saying that non-Germanics should never be colonists in Germanic territory. If Germanic settlers encounter valuable and assimilable elements on their way outwards, they can try to integrate them into their local community while remaining Germanic in character. Germania, in an ethno-cultural sense, would be expanding this way instead of being the perpetual target of colonisation. A simple modification of the terms of its destruction is not something I am very enthusiastic about and there is no need to perpuate the warped moral and political beliefs that demand this from us.

Bleyer
Friday, October 30th, 2009, 08:24 PM
from everything I've gathered the Volkdeutsche have never tried to be a part of any of their adopted countries in anyway.
If by that you mean integrate and start to consider us Hungarians, then you're right. Why would we? The Hungarians wouldn't see us as Hungarians either. The Volksdeutsche today didn't make the decision to immigrate to a foreign land. These things happened centuries ago and our ancestors must have had a reason. The point is, it wasn't my decision to be born as a German in Hungary. I was born a German, I think in German. I can't magically snap my fingers and become Hungarian.


I've read that they have been known to refuse en masse to do things as simple as filling out census forms.
We don't refuse to do that. Filling out census forms is important to identify us in numbers from the rest of the population.

Everyone frowns as Gypsies who call themselves Hungarian on census forms. Why should we adopt that attitude?

rainman
Saturday, October 31st, 2009, 05:07 PM
Hauke: Japan is a role model in this respect. Foreigners may visit but they may never be granted citizenship. If you visit Japan I think you have like a 3 year limit then you have to go home. You can then wait a year or something a reapply to visit again. The number of foriegners there at any given time is also limited to so many people and they definately are not treated the same as natives. Not to say they are inhospitable.

The better form of humanity should be expanding. Because of some genetic flaw in whites that causes them to have more sympathy for whales, dolphins and foriegners than their own people the lesser parts of humanity are expanding and encroaching in on civilization. If there was some folk out there with traits that seemed better than us and some use to us it would make some sense to allow a trickle of that to flow into and rejuvinate our blood stream but common sense tells us that the poor, sick, weak, uncivilized, failed masses who can't take care of themselves that flood into our lands contribute nothing to our civilization, in fact take away from it.

As hauke is saying we should be the ones pouring out and raising the racial level of the outsiders rather than the opposite of them coming in and lowering our level.

Jäger
Saturday, October 31st, 2009, 05:14 PM
As hauke is saying we should be the ones pouring out and raising the racial level of the outsiders rather than the opposite of them coming in and lowering our level.
This is not what Hauke said, we have no intention to raise any level of outsiders, if they are beneath us, there is no need to assimilate, read the Borg manual first.

SpearBrave
Wednesday, November 4th, 2009, 03:37 AM
I have very mixed views about all ethnic Germans immigrating to Germany.

First I do not understand why Americans with German blood would want to leave their homeland (which is America) to live in Germany. I would very much like to see a strong Germany, but it would not be Germany if a large amount of Americans lived there. Keep in mind I call Americans with German blood just that and to me a German/American is someone who is from Germany that has immigrated to America.



I don't fully understand how ethnic Germans in Europe feel about moving to Germany, so I can only give a slight thought on the matter. It seems some of these cultures are in extreme danger of becoming extinct. Maybe they should move to Germany but I don't know for sure.

Reich des Waldes
Wednesday, November 4th, 2009, 04:24 AM
First I do not understand why Americans with German blood would want to leave their homeland (which is America) to live in Germany. I would very much like to see a strong Germany, but it would not be Germany if a large amount of Americans lived there. Keep in mind I call Americans with German blood just that and to me a German/American is someone who is from Germany that has immigrated to America.

Perhaps I am mistaken but I believe the idea is that those ethnic Germans that return to German land do not consider themselves American. That is to say, they would wish to fully integrate into their ethnic homeland and renounce their own "Americanized" customs. This would not lead to German lands being populated by Americans or American customs but rather it would be akin to simply more Germans (who practice German customs and speak the German language) appearing. While customs are not so easily shaken off or forgotten, I think that the ethnic Germans who did return would try very hard to integrate.

frippardthree
Wednesday, November 4th, 2009, 04:53 AM
I think that the main concern, that I would have would be over-population. You would also have to get all the minorities, back to their ancestral homelands first, in order to have room for the white population to return to their homelands. This would be nearly impossible in our lifetimes.


From 1960 the total population of the Earth more than doubled, from 3024 million in 1960 to 6465 million in 200510. Every decade, the rate of increase has increased. The growth of the Human population on the Earth is still accelerating. Faster and faster growth, a population explosion, continues. In Global Trends, Michael J. Mazarr writes that "only after 2020 might annual additions to world population begin to decline" [Mazaar, p30-31].


Source:http://www.humantruth.info/population.html#Population


In many Western countries and countries such as Japan, a post-industrial slow in the population growth has occurred. Populations are ageing2. This means that over coming decades, the numbers of old people will continue to rise whilst the numbers of the young continue to decline. It is the first time in Human history that the age distribution of nations has threatened to become long-term top-heavy. What this means is a change in the entire way that society is structured. The young will have an excess of elders, rather than the old having an excess of youth. Our ideas of work, retirement, socialisation and education will have to change.


Source:http://www.humantruth.info/population.html#Ageing

Thusnelda
Wednesday, November 4th, 2009, 12:16 PM
I´d welcome Volksdeutsche who´re unmixed, able to speak our language fluently and who´ve a living connection to our customs, traditions and our culture back in Germany with open hands. On the other hand, people who´re only "German" by their ancestry but have no other connections to my folk (culture, language, identity, etc.) should better stay where they are. :| If you want to come back there can´t be a "I´m German and American", your heart can only beat for one country alone!

I want Germans and Volksdeutsche to integrate and assimilate, not German-Americans...or German-Canadians, German-Australians, German-Argentinians.

Bittereinder
Wednesday, November 4th, 2009, 05:00 PM
I think the Germans of Deutsch-Südwestafrika could be seen as Volkdeutsche who have kept their culture and language alive even though they can all speak Afrikaans, if one can get past the geographical differences.

From Wkikipedia:

A smaller proportion of whites (around 30,000) trace their family origins directly back to German colonial settlers and maintain German cultural and educational institutions.

Deutsche Höhere Privatschule in Windhoek was founded 1909 then called Kaiserliche Realschule.

In South Africa we have quite a few Germans and as far as I know they have integrated into our society to a large extent. My mother is an Insurance broker at one of the SA banks and has a few German clients. Vryheid (a town in SA) has a considerable German farming community.

In the Boer war the Vrijstaat had a Prussian Capt. FWR Albrecht who was the commander of the Artilleriekorps:

http://img267.imageshack.us/img267/8098/dsc03907.jpg

If this is not a testament to a contribution to his adopted country nothing is.


Although the corps took part in two wars during the 1860's, it was only after 1880, when a decorated Prussian artillery officer, Capt. FWR Albrecht, was appointed in command that the unit started taking shape.Source (http://samilitaryhistory.org/lectures/ovsac.html)

The Vrijstaats Artilleriekorps also dressed in Prussian styled uniforms:

http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/1589/dsc03880.jpg

http://img94.imageshack.us/img94/3646/dsc03871v.jpg

http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/6981/dsc03870m.jpg

Assimilation can only occur naturally if the persone who is assimilated shares ideas and ideals of the Folk into which he is to be assimilated. In the case of modern SA Germans they do tend to have a healthy regard IMO for their Fatherland but this does not hinder interaction between themselves and the Afrikaners or their contributions to our society (especially pre 1994). It is not uncommon to see a German flag flying over the gate of German owned farms, this IMO is how it should be...

celticruine
Wednesday, November 4th, 2009, 05:12 PM
I´d welcome Volksdeutsche who´re unmixed, able to speak our language fluently and who´ve a living connection to our customs, traditions and our culture back in Germany with open hands. On the other hand, people who´re only "German" by their ancestry but have no other connections to my folk (culture, language, identity, etc.) should better stay where they are.

Even if they´re speaking with south german / austrian dialect.
I would also welcome them if they´re unmixed.
People with german ancestry who can´t speak fluently High German should stay away ?
Are they really less worth than immigrants ?
Yes mixed should stay away but what´s with the mixed in Germany ?
Like some polish-german mixes ?
Are they more worth because they are speaking german fluently ?



I want Germans and Volksdeutsche to integrate and assimilate, not German-Americans...or German-Canadians, German-Australians, German-Argentinians.
Just give them a Chance.
I think positive of People who are white and unmixed .

Most of the Volksdeutsche should have the Chance to come back to Germany because they can cause became mixed in cause of too little german or white populations.

Nachtengel
Wednesday, November 4th, 2009, 06:41 PM
Even if they´re speaking with south german / austrian dialect.
I would also welcome them if they´re unmixed.
People with german ancestry who can´t speak fluently High German should stay away ?
Are they really less worth than immigrants ?
Speaking High German is necessary to communicate with other Germans. How are you going to be able to communicate with someone outside South Germany, if you don't speak German? Do you expect them to speak some obscure dialect from the Banat from centuries ago?


Yes mixed should stay away but what´s with the mixed in Germany ?
Like some polish-german mixes ?
Are they more worth because they are speaking german fluently ?
That we have mixed people here doesn't mean that we should bring more.


Just give them a Chance.
I think positive of People who are white and unmixed .
This is a German country, just being 'white' doesn't suffice.


Most of the Volksdeutsche should have the Chance to come back to Germany because they can cause became mixed in cause of too little german or white populations.
No, only the worthy ones.

celticruine
Wednesday, November 4th, 2009, 09:37 PM
A dialect which was old is obscure with Germanic origin ?

No i don´t want mixed People coming here.

I´ve meant that not only Germans speak German fluently.

What is worthy depending on Culture,Language or Blood ?

Sissi
Thursday, November 5th, 2009, 06:01 AM
Ethnic Germans who speak dialect but not standard German will usually learn it after a few months spent in Germany (or Austria). There is not much to worry about really.

Rodskarl Dubhgall
Sunday, May 27th, 2018, 12:31 PM
I oppose the Amish in America as setting a dangerous precedent for Hispanics to squat on Anglo land and stick their noses up at us. On the other hand, I wish we all lived like the Amish.

Sigurd
Monday, May 28th, 2018, 02:19 PM
I oppose the Amish in America as setting a dangerous precedent for Hispanics to squat on Anglo land and stick their noses up at us. On the other hand, I wish we all lived like the Amish.

The first Amish settlement on American soil was instituted around 1683, some one hundred years before the United States became a geopolitical entity of any sorts. If one was mean, one'd say they've been around since a time when "Anglo" land-owners were drinking tea instead of dipping it in the Boston harbour. Hardly a case of "squatting". ;)

Secondly, whilst I greatly cherish the traditional vibe of the Amish and laud their efforts to keep their way of living intact, they're also greatly hampering themselves and people in their community. Rumspringa is a real thing, many don't return. Not saying we should adopt all the troubles of a modernist, hedonist lifestyle, far from it. But the point when owning a telephone can get you essentially excluded from your close-knit community, that's a little too antiquated for my personal taste. :)

Thirdy, the American Amish aren't considered to be "Volksdeutsche" these days. Their mostly Swiss-German ancestors naturally would be, though. :)

Rodskarl Dubhgall
Monday, May 28th, 2018, 03:04 PM
I enjoy the assimilation. I would rather intermarry with Amish and live simpler, than for them to badmouth me, stick their noses up in the air and turn their backs on me. They came as invited guests to English society, by the Quakers. Rude guests don't need to be coddled. I don't want bad blood with them. I don't like their self-imposed isolation from me. I like their way of life, but they're a poor example of Germanic unity and a weakness exploited by first, Austrian Papists with German schools and newspapers until the 20th century, until now, Latinos come here refusing to abide by our way of life all the same. It's sad that the most genuine Protestants around us are the model for such asshole behavior in Romanists.

Sigurd
Tuesday, May 29th, 2018, 09:35 AM
I enjoy the assimilation. I would rather intermarry with Amish and live simpler, than for them to badmouth me, stick their noses up in the air and turn their backs on me.

They have a much stricter view on inter-marriage in order to preserve their particular folkway than even most people on board here. Whilst that surely limits their choice of partner to levels small enough to potentially cause genetic disadvantage at some point, I don't think we should look damningly upon Germanic groups that set themselves a much stricter regiment with whom to mix than would even be prudent for general adoption.

Personally, for example, I don't have a problem with the odd Dutchman seeking a Danish woman. Personally I chose a fellow Upper German partner. I wouldn't look damningly upon someone though who made my personal choice a common rule, saying "only Bavarians" or "only Germans". :)


I like their way of life, but they're a poor example of Germanic unity and a weakness exploited by first, Austrian Papists with German schools and newspapers until the 20th century,

I think we have greater problems than fellow Germanics in our countries having newspapers in their own language and schools teaching their native tongue.


It's sad that the most genuine Protestants around us are the model for such asshole behavior in Romanists.

I don't think the choice of Christian denomination makes much of a difference in terms of approach towards acceptable behaviour as a group. There's both arguments to be made why Catholicism respectively Protestantism might serve as a stronger bulwark against the issues that befall us; when it comes to the actual churches, at the same time, both seem to be equally hostile to folk preservation, at least here in Europe. ;)

Rodskarl Dubhgall
Tuesday, May 29th, 2018, 12:58 PM
I'm referring to uniformity of purpose as a Germanic nation, not splintered and weak by factionalism. Foreigners use our own disunity to push multiculturalism. They can point at us for their excuse. Now, if we shared the same in-crowd, this would not be a problem.