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View Full Version : Wicca - Serious Faith or New Age Crap?



Blutw÷lfin
Monday, June 5th, 2006, 08:17 PM
Share your opinion on Wicca, please. Don't confuse it with ancient Irish Druids or mediaeval witchcraft.

Sigrid
Monday, June 5th, 2006, 08:30 PM
New Age crap as far as I can tell.:thumbsdow

Blood_Axis
Monday, June 5th, 2006, 09:12 PM
New Age crap as far as I can tell.:thumbsdow
I concur ;)

Pellonpekko
Monday, June 5th, 2006, 09:34 PM
Yep, new age crap. :thumbsdow

freya3
Monday, June 5th, 2006, 09:43 PM
I have to agree New Age Crap:doh

Gagnraad
Monday, June 5th, 2006, 09:44 PM
Wicca is just utter bullshit. About 50 years old, and the wiccans cclaim it have been around for thousands and thousands of years... New Age Crap

Ewergrin
Tuesday, June 6th, 2006, 12:21 AM
Trendy New Age crap for die hard Enya and Yanni fans. Oh, and for those who think The Celstine Prophecy was touching or meaningful.

Weg
Tuesday, June 6th, 2006, 02:41 AM
Feminist crap.

Alkman
Tuesday, June 6th, 2006, 03:27 AM
It started as an umbrella group for those who didn't want to identify as christians as far as i know but all in all a crap.

nordicdusk
Tuesday, June 6th, 2006, 11:31 AM
New age crap.I know a few and they just annoy me so much.

Sigrid
Tuesday, June 6th, 2006, 11:55 AM
I have also noticed that they have a tendency, especially recently, to be making overtures to the "interfaith" mob and so whereas at first Wiccans were vociferously anti-Christian and couldn't stop saying "Never again the burning times", they are increasingly beginning to say "Anything is better than racists so let's all hug and kick the sh*t out of folkish people with the pointy parts of our little silver shoes."

Eisenmann
Tuesday, June 6th, 2006, 11:58 AM
So when they are able to decide between the Malleus Maleficarum and the Edda, they choose the former? What a brilliant example of their brainlessness. :D

Sigrid
Tuesday, June 6th, 2006, 12:46 PM
The trouble is [s.o.s], that so many of them are pretending to be "magical" that they have made of this a commonplace thing, a kind of "witchcraft for everyone" that Black Sabbath stated in jest (people took them seriously :doh ) when they started to play music that needed an image to get attention. I think Wiccans, and many other oddballs in the "magic" trade, basically just want attention. Besides the fact that I have visited some of their souls and I have found genuinely unpleasant creatures masquerading there. All religion has the unfortunate capacity for attracting masked wonders from trolltown and jotunheim.

Ălfhere
Thursday, June 8th, 2006, 06:39 AM
I've known more Wiccans I dislike than like, but I have met a few decent ones, my wife being one of them. I don't have a problem with them as long as they recognize the differences between Wicca and heathenism. For example, I would be annoyed by someone worshipping the Germanic gods in the Wiccan fashion, then calling themself Asatru. :mad: I'm not bothered by Wiccans as long as they don't make extravagant claims about their religion, and recognize that their belief is a modern invention.

Sigrid
Thursday, June 8th, 2006, 07:52 AM
I have seen webs on the net calling it "Wiccan Asatru".

The Horned God
Thursday, June 8th, 2006, 10:29 AM
Don't know (there's no choice for don't care).

nordicdusk
Thursday, June 8th, 2006, 12:13 PM
Trendy New Age crap for die hard Enya and Yanni fans. Oh, and for those who think The Celstine Prophecy was touching or meaningful.
Yes but as much as i love Enya on her new album she has gone one step beyound by inventing her own lanuage.

forever united
Thursday, June 8th, 2006, 02:58 PM
deffintly new age crap! i got to high school and since i started wearing my hammer (out side my shirt) theyve all tryed to explian to me who Thor is and what my hammer means...lets just say they have no idea what there saying.:thumbsdow :thumbsdow there so full of them selfs!!

Ălfhere
Monday, June 12th, 2006, 07:09 PM
Here's an interesting article entitled The Pentagram and the Hammer (http://www.ravenkindred.com/wicatru.html), which lists the major differences between Asatru and Wicca. And another article: No Alliances With Wicca (http://www.odinic-rite.org/nowicca.html) from the OR.

barry
Thursday, June 15th, 2006, 12:36 AM
I believe it was heavily influenced by Aleister Crowley ,it does seem
a strange mixture of various forms of occultism.

Sigrid
Thursday, June 15th, 2006, 05:59 AM
Yes I have noticed that the Golden Dawn of Crowley has infiltrated the consciousness of a lot of people coming from Wicca to Asatru and mostly caused them to stay kind of Wiccatru. The pentagram is often their symbol and they see the runes as a magical system akin to the occult. Also the idea of free will is implicit in this "Do as thou will" thing they have and it conflicts with Heathen honour ideology.

Northerner
Friday, June 16th, 2006, 05:13 AM
Modern Wicca is often considered to have been started by Gerald Gardner, although some debate this (one reason for this is that Gardner supposedly never actually used the word "wicca"). However, almost no one denies that he strongly influenced early wicca. From what I've read, most historians of the movement consider modern wiccan groups to be derived from or influenced in some sense by the Gardnerian tradition.

Gardner was a very unusual and interesting individual. Born in England, he was a rubber planter in both Borneo and Malaysia as young man. He was something of an amateur anthropologist also and even wrote a book on Malay weapons and magical practices, Keris and other Malay Weapons , which received some critical scholarly acclaim.

Gardner was a longtime student of the occult and magick. He appears to have been influenced, at least to a small degree, by Aleister Crowley. While I personally believe that the so-called Gardnerian tradition is largely a synthesis based on the different pagan, occult, and magickal schools of thought that Gardner had studied, there may possibly be more to it. Gardner claimed that he was initiated into an old form of European paganism during the late 1930s (though there is a considerable amount of debate as to who actually initiated him and which tradition was represented). Interestingly, there apparently is some evidence suggesting that Gardner may have belonged to a family of hereditary witches. At any rate, one of his ancestors was burned as witch in the 17th century.

Sigurd
Friday, June 16th, 2006, 06:04 AM
I can just imagine a truthful advertisement on Wicca... :D :

"Wicca - Ancient faith Est. 1957

Today's Rituals Include:
-Girl-on-girl interaction
-Collective intake of hallucinable disks and other intoxicatives
-Emancipative bragging

Why not have a look inside and tell us what you think of the 'great' offer we have? Now offering the Hongkongese version of the Triskel!"

Sifsvina
Friday, June 16th, 2006, 07:31 AM
For the most part utter crap but I have met a few, quiet ones usually, who I can respect, it is more a personal system (as opposed to a religion) for them and they don't make any silly claims. The burning times....:doh 6 million seems to be a favorite number.

oddevold
Saturday, June 17th, 2006, 01:35 AM
Wicca is founded on a ultimate religious freedom in contrast with Asatr˙ which is based on a traditional order!

Wicca is utter crap, invented by some idiots!

BSLW
Thursday, June 22nd, 2006, 03:00 AM
I would say it was a seirous religion, but seeing all the half wits at my school running around saying the Goddess will slay thee I have to this....HOGWASH

Sigrid
Thursday, June 22nd, 2006, 06:20 AM
I think the TV series "Charmed" has caused a lot of people to get all excited about nothing and to believe that paganism is all about throwing fireballs at multicultural demons.

Blutw÷lfin
Thursday, June 22nd, 2006, 07:25 AM
I would say it was a seirous religion, but seeing all the half wits at my school running around saying the Goddess will slay thee I have to this....HOGWASH


Wicca never was serious since its beginnings in the "ancient times" (1954). It always was New Age. Don't confuse Wicca with Witchcraft.

Gagnraad
Thursday, June 22nd, 2006, 12:47 PM
Wicca is originally a peacefull "religion", or?
I know a wiccan(I don't like talking to her pretty much though)And she say stuff like:
I like to write curses to people, and so forth.

Anyways, wicca was, is and will forever, to the day we all have sunk back into the very soil we came from, be just utter new-age crap!

Sigrid
Thursday, June 22nd, 2006, 02:43 PM
I see a lot of people are fond of the pseudo power their interest in cursing gives them. Forgetting, of course, that cursing is an art, for both good and evil, and that self styled "magicians" usually fall into their own hot wax.

Eisenmann
Thursday, June 22nd, 2006, 04:31 PM
I know a wiccan(I don't like talking to her pretty much though)And she say stuff like:
I like to write curses to people, and so forth.she w...:D
*shrieks in hysterical laughter*

ohhh... the sheer sadness of demoralized people trying to nurse their negative self-view a little by jumping head-on into any material that can make their separation from the flock seem somewhat suggestively positive..:doh

Sigurd
Sunday, June 25th, 2006, 02:29 AM
I see a lot of people are fond of the pseudo power their interest in cursing gives them. Forgetting, of course, that cursing is an art, for both good and evil, and that self styled "magicians" usually fall into their own hot wax.

Yes, I know, those "magicians".:rolleyes:

"I can fart on my hair gel and it creates a flame that will once engulf the entire globe. See, I am a magician." and all the other getting-purple-lightning-bolts-from-the-guardian-watchtower crap it is. And to many of them just believing the whole thing.
It's what even crept into a small school with 45 people. A girl and a boy suddenly ran around writing weird symbols and whatnotall. All this "we-are-all-equal-because-we-can-all-be-magic-by-creating-pink-dancing-fireballs-on-our-armpits" fallacy/hype is then ntensified by stuff like bordering-on-Wicca books in concurrence with multiculturalist docrines...yes you're right, J.K.Rowling's books can be as devastating as Buffy to the common sense of a young teenager...


And of all the PC bs not to talk....

PS: Forgot to mention, don't trust those "Folkish" guys that won't allow the Ugandan homosexual to be part of their faith...:D

Sigrid
Sunday, June 25th, 2006, 08:53 AM
Sig, you're right, and I laughed when I read the fireball from hair gel description. I have witnessed this description from a goggle eyed believer who insisted that "magic" existed and that he had been in a group where a "huge flame" had shot up out of some magi-mix fire they were huddling over chanting witchy brew incantations. This from a grown man. I was horrified at the sheer stupidity of it. Especially as I know what being "a little different" is like and believe me it's nothing like they say it is in the magic books.

All the sing-song shamen and the journeys and the predictions. This is where things go a little AWOL. The future has not happened (one must have a working knowledge of the universe to appreciate this) so there is no way anyone can predict it other than from obvious leads in the present or past. Very sensitive individuals often make predictions and have prophetic dreams but they lack exact meanings and times or dates so these are hard to pin down. They are just unusual seemingly prophetic experiences. I have had some and they have had no time dimension. A death, for example, dreamed of exactly as it happened to the person concerned but nine months before it occurred and with no predictive aspect. Just a dreadful play and conclusion and then a phone call long after that didn't surprise me.

But these things are very unusual and sitting around chucking runes about and predicting the future is utter bollocks. So is journeying to regions "unknown" and bringing back all sorts of high flown rubbish about man's destiny. There is something some of us possess that seems able to pick up certain things but Gypsy Rose and her crystal ball really are figments of the Victorian imagination. And Wicca seems to be so tied to that time when people so desperately wanted and needed a sense of "magic". Pity it is back here now in an age where daily these people are shown to be charlatans.

Some are psychotic, one must must make exceptions for these as they really do see things and hear things and this is caused by schizophrenia which is now known to be a brain disorder and not a weird shamanic gift. Like autism, that also had a run of paranormal fantasy in the seventies, this phenomenon has also proved to be nothing more than brain disorder, usually inherited and this has been greatly explained by its simultaneous occurrence in identical twins.

This is the source of the vaccination hysteria. Autism in the two year olds who had the jab. But what they don't (and refuse) to accept is that two is the age when the symptoms of the disorder become apparent. And identical twins who had the vaccination both developed autism. When home movies were shown to experts of the children before the age of two the experts could see the signs of impending autism in the behaviour of these babies. They were just a disorder waiting to manifest, sadly.

Yet a whole mad conspiracy oriented goon show has flourished about the "evil" of vaccinations. Which means that a large group of hapless children may fall prey to terrible diseases with life long scarring and deformities because their dumb parents believed the Jews were out to get them and were hiding in vaccine shipments, or that corporations were behind the desire to poison babies with mercury. It is utter bull. Like everything else they churn out with increasing abandon. The ramblings of uneducated paranoiacs who have read too many conspiracy web sites and then turned on their own advanced technological civilization because they are afraid of it. That is even worse than Wicca, that is sheer ignorant hysteria.

As paganism is now full of these idiots I have little hope it will flourish among anyone other than these dumb dumbs. They think the world is out to poison them. "Poison" is in their every sentence (and so is "bigot" and "racist"). They are all cut from the same dumbed down cloth and I blame the deplorable state of education today. It is churning out primitive people where once it turned out brilliant scientists and engineers and artists who didn't think art was a cow in a bin full of formaldehyde.

If we are devolving it is our own fault and new age paganism isn't helping matters, if anything it is in many cases making matters worse. It's causing people to split off from the mainstream and exist in sweaty little groups of paranoid loons who are not much different from those old jokes about nutters carrying signs that said "the end is nigh". It has been "nigh" now for two thousand years. Wake up, folks, ain't gonna happen. There are, however, other very real threats poking their ugly heads up over the horizon. Real Jotuns like global warming and overpopulation, avian flu and the depletion of energy and other vital resources. For goodness' sake try rather to deal with that. And have those vaccinations or your kids will end up looking like Tiny Tim Cratchet. :mad:

BSLW
Thursday, June 29th, 2006, 03:23 AM
I think the TV series "Charmed" has caused a lot of people to get all excited about nothing and to believe that paganism is all about throwing fireballs at multicultural demons.

All the litten wiccan girls at my school are obsessed with Charmed. There is this girl she thinks Charmed is real lol. I told it was fake and she slapped me.

Gagnraad
Thursday, June 29th, 2006, 04:56 AM
All the litten wiccan girls at my school are obsessed with Charmed. There is this girl she thinks Charmed is real lol. I told it was fake and she slapped me.
Oh my... They are obviously living in their own world then.
But if people honestly want to live in their "own" world created by the creators of "Charmed", "Buffy" and Wicca... By all means! Let them!

Sigrid
Thursday, June 29th, 2006, 08:22 AM
I agree Gag, it's a passing show, and real life, where there is no magic, just you and your destiny, will show them the way soon enough. :(

What irks me is the political correctness that is fed into this kind of universal witchcraft and then the enormous profits gleaned from the viewers. If these things could be just like Santa used to be, a jolly elf, who brought presents, then it would be a lovely childhood memory of generosity with the principle of having to be good to get a gift. But now the way to be "good" is woven into a moral that more often than not has a specific socio-political agenda, not just a universal moral.

That's why I switch them off. Not because they are crap, as everything fantasised falls into the same category and all magic is wish fulfilment and good for people to watch in a world where you can't change things at will. I just think that trying to apply that kind of magic (brainwashing) to people's minds through these things is where the real danger lurks. And it doesn't just lurk in children's literature or film, it appears in adult work too, especially when they use sex or horror as their vehicle for the agenda.

These things are often nothing more than propaganda wrapped in fantasy. They possibly always were, it's just that the agenda differed a while ago and was more pleasingly universal in terms of moral behaviour than it is today. Then it had to do with being good and true. Everyone benefits from that. Now it is just about doing what Big Brother wants you to do, or you will be shunned and dispossessed and, worst of all, you'll be uncool.

Seldom today do these things have any lasting artistic value. To make things worse, they have also made it almost impossible for anyone to write new work. The corporate beast has come to grip the publishing, film and music industries very hard. And art, as such, is practically dead. Real artists and writers are often starving and lapdog artists are all obscenely rich. A sign of our times.
:trollcros

nordicdusk
Thursday, June 29th, 2006, 04:32 PM
[QUOTE=BSLW]All the litten wiccan girls at my school are obsessed with Charmed. There is this girl she thinks Charmed is real lol. I told it was fake and she slapped me.[/QUOT
Im sorry but i have to laugh at these people its so so sad to live your life by such shows.How can people get the information and morals you need in the real world from these stupid teen shows.

Gagnraad
Thursday, June 29th, 2006, 04:58 PM
Indeed ND, indeed!

People are brainwashed by what they see on TV and on the news. The parents believe what they see and they teach their kids what they believe. That's an eternal cyclus we can't do anything with.
Who are we to "teach" anyone, and tell people what they believe in is wrong?

Therefore we must forget about the world, and think about us, our family and friends, these are what really matters. Not people you don't know.

That's what I mean, however.

Sigrid
Thursday, June 29th, 2006, 05:16 PM
I wish I could throw fireballs ...

Gagnraad
Friday, June 30th, 2006, 12:30 AM
I wish I could throw fireballs ...
I wonder if it hurts to throw a fireball... I mean, the flame come from your hand?! Must burn alot, and the pain must be excrutiating... :P

Sifsvina
Friday, June 30th, 2006, 09:02 AM
They just came out with another one, Hex, I just watched a tiny bit on BBC America. Just terrible! A slick excuse to lay on twisted multi-cult values and a whole lot of sex. I can enjoy a bit of fantasy for what it is and even ignore some small distasteful elements but this is disgusting. I wouldn't be surprised if there will be kids out there who with start thinking they are possessed by an angel and he makes them screw everything. :rolleyes:
"real" "magic" just isn't much fun and rarely has more than the most subtle effects if any. I understand the need to feel powerful in a society that has taken all your power away but this stuff usually just renders them even less capable of making genuine change. It's a tempting fantasy to think you have this special power that puts you apart from the idiots and make people like you and think you are valuable but it's false and will just re-enforce the feelings of inadequacy and alienation. It's not an either or choice between automaton and hedonist, loving everyone or beating your children, reviling the past or living in the dark ages, there are all sorts of other choices that do not make you a christian right republican.

Sigrid
Friday, June 30th, 2006, 10:16 AM
I wonder if it hurts to throw a fireball... I mean, the flame come from your hand?! Must burn alot, and the pain must be excrutiating... :P

Gag, as with God, so with magic, all things are possible. :D Besides which they will tell you it is made of that special "energy", the kind science can't find or test. Apparently it is everywhere and you can just pluck it out of the air. Green, blue, red, silver - take your pick. "Concentrate" on it, "draw it in" and hey presto fireballs.

Or Sigurd's story of flaming hair gel. Rub some on your palm, spit on it, fart on it, say "magic" words and you go up like a Roman candle.

The reason why I want to be able to throw fireballs is I need them for the next Harry Potter movie. I think it's time this insufferable little nerd took a powder. And a brick would break the TV screen.

Sifsvina
Friday, June 30th, 2006, 10:27 AM
sigh, yeah, fireballs would come in quite useful:D I wonder how much time they'd take to reload though...

Gagnraad
Friday, June 30th, 2006, 02:53 PM
Now, I'd rather be like Darth Vader...

nordicdusk
Friday, June 30th, 2006, 03:06 PM
Now, I'd rather be like Darth Vader...
Its hard to beat the mighty Lord Vader.:)

Leofric
Thursday, July 6th, 2006, 11:01 PM
Well, I'm going to go it alone and say that I think Wicca is as serious a faith as any other, in itself. I agree with most of the folks here that most of the people who profess to be Wiccan are not serious about faith, but I think that the Wiccan faith, at least as expounded by Gardner, can be a legitimate religion if it's taken seriously by its practitioners.

I think the problem with Wicca is that most of the people who go into it are doing it mainly for attention. They want people to know that they're different because they're Wiccan. I think most of them don't care at all about the tenets and ceremonies of the religion as Gardner explained them, and the few who have investigated them seem to want to swear them off.

But I think if someone were to really practice Gardnerian Wicca with a group of people who really practice it, it could be perfectly beneficial to those people spiritually. At least as much as Buddhism or Islam or what have you.

Ălfhere
Saturday, July 8th, 2006, 09:41 PM
Well, I'm going to go it alone and say that I think Wicca is as serious a faith as any other, in itself. I agree with most of the folks here that most of the people who profess to be Wiccan are not serious about faith, but I think that the Wiccan faith, at least as expounded by Gardner, can be a legitimate religion if it's taken seriously by its practitioners.

I think the problem with Wicca is that most of the people who go into it are doing it mainly for attention. They want people to know that they're different because they're Wiccan. I think most of them don't care at all about the tenets and ceremonies of the religion as Gardner explained them, and the few who have investigated them seem to want to swear them off.

But I think if someone were to really practice Gardnerian Wicca with a group of people who really practice it, it could be perfectly beneficial to those people spiritually. At least as much as Buddhism or Islam or what have you.

I guess I can agree with you for the most part. Whether or not Wicca is a serious faith depends on who practices it.

Leofric
Sunday, July 9th, 2006, 03:38 AM
As a matter of fact, I just stumbled across a site for folks who are trying to take the religion seriously and, to some extent, out of the hands of the idiots who make it seem like a joke.

http://wicca.timerift.net/

It's called "Wicca: For the Rest of Us." They're not perfectly free from silliness, of course, but I think they seem to be making a good honest effort to take their religion seriously.

Here's their description of who "the rest of us" are supposed to be:

Wiccans who aren't in it for show, to make a political statement, to upset their parents or express a dislike of any other religion.

Eclectics, Traditionals, Solitaries, coven members, newcomers, elders, and everyone in-between. It isn't about being "right". It's about being smart. [Leofric's note: they seem to define Eclectics a little differently than I've seen in the past — rather than a little Freya, a lot of Isis, and some Diana for good measure, it's a little Gardnerian, a little Alexandrian, and so forth]

Those who value and respect history and have no need of an erroneous Old Religion.

Those who understand that "toleration" means acceptance of all religions, not just certain ones, and that continuing to propagate the myth of all Christianity persecuting us is nothing short of a persecution against Christianity.

Those who also understand that toleration is not the same as belief. Blind absorption of other religions' traditions and pantheons is not only silly but insulting.

We cover a large variety of beliefs, but we likewise do not accept that "Wicca is anything you want it to be."


That sounds to me like it's clearly a step in the right direction, at the very least. And they are very clear in saying that ┴satr˙, Celtic pagan belief, Greek or Roman paganism, and so forth, are all not Wicca. I think their willingness to distinguish sharply between their religion and other non-mainstream western religions (I would say other pagan religions, but I don't think Wicca is really pagan) helps their credibility a lot.

Ălfhere
Thursday, August 17th, 2006, 08:32 AM
Here is a site where people are apparently trying to meld wicca and heathenry.

Wiccecraeft (http://www.angelfire.com/ab4/vanic/witchlord.html)

Bodi_Donarsson
Thursday, August 17th, 2006, 09:01 AM
Here is a site where people are apparently trying to meld wicca and heathenry.

Wiccecraeft (http://www.angelfire.com/ab4/vanic/witchlord.html)

Wow...talk about a direct rip-off of heathenry, thinly masqueraded as wicca. I wonder how many people will be duped into believing that.

Dorru­r
Tuesday, February 6th, 2007, 09:04 AM
I'm not a practisioner of Wicca and don't plan on becoming one, but I have Wiccan friends and none of them do it for show or whatever. It is a path they follow and if you run into people who aren't into all the bs buffy the vampire slayer stuff, then you'll find you can respect and even co-exist with them.

If used maturely and with forebearance, then I say it qualifies as a serious religion.

NatRev
Tuesday, February 6th, 2007, 08:21 PM
Mmmm, to be honest, I'd opt for 'each to their own'.

I did have a few books on Wicca but in all honesty it wasn't for me.

A tad too hippyish frankly.

However, if we started slating other beliefs and stuff just because it doesn't gel with our own... aren't we as bad as the Christian fundies??? :O

To be honest, it's something that's never really concerned me.

I went into a new age shop ages ago, all that concerned me was the amount of utter tat they were selling for extortionate prices. But, at the end of the day, I've never had Wiccans knock on my door and try get me to convert, nor have I had them stop me in the street and want to talk to me about 'the Goddess' so like I said, 'each to their own'. :rolleyes:

Wolfsong
Sunday, February 11th, 2007, 11:41 AM
Wow...talk about a direct rip-off of heathenry, thinly masqueraded as wicca. I wonder how many people will be duped into believing that.

I count 1 the guy who made it !
this site makes me want to:fviking

Rongoteus
Sunday, February 11th, 2007, 12:17 PM
Same kind of crap as Scientologia.:thumbsdow

In Finnish: "Joutavallle jottain".;)