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BeornWulfWer
Friday, September 12th, 2008, 02:42 PM
It was the feminist dream of the 1960s – a world in which men and women share the load equally.

But it seems the fairer sex has all but abandoned the struggle. According to research published today, most men want a traditional wife – and women are often only too
happy to oblige.

In turn, it claims that the husband women most desire is a ‘retrosexual’ – meaning they are more hunter gatherer than a ‘metrosexual’ stay-at-home father.

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2008/08/28/article-0-026FBCE600000578-69_468x371.jpg

More than 1,500 adults were asked about the attributes that they ‘most valued’ in a spouse or partner. Their answers could have been taken from a manual to happy married life in the 1950s.

At the top of the men’s list was ‘taking care of the home’, followed by cooking, cleaning and great parenting.

Only 16 per cent said they value ‘financial stability’ in a woman – which means most men put domestic bliss above a wife who calls the shots in the boardroom.

The research from.the Yorkshire Building Society found many women are making equally conventional choices.

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2008/08/28/article-0-026FBC8000000578-196_468x592.jpg

Nearly 40 per cent said ‘financial stability’ is one of the most important qualities in their husband and they rank gardening as more important than an ability to cook or clean.

Tanya Jackson, corporate affairs manager at the building society, said: ‘A lot of women used to think they wanted a metrosexual man.

‘But then they realised they were fed up with a man who spent longer in the bathroom than they did.

‘Many women now feel they actually want a hunter-gatherer and they will look after their man in return.’

Figures from the Office for National Statistics bear out the claims. More than 2.1million women say they do not work because they are ‘looking after their family or home’.

Only 193,000 men gave the same answer – a figure which has fallen by 6 per cent over the past year.


Source (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-1050094/Men-want-women-traditional--women-HAPPY-housewife.html?ITO=1490)

Eccardus Teutonicus
Friday, September 12th, 2008, 06:08 PM
Hurrah! Good to see the pendulum swinging back in the feminists' face. Perhaps we have cause to be optimistic about coming years, the scum of the 1960s may have all the dark nightmares they have constructed for society utterly destroyed.


Brother Blackshirts, my comrades in struggle:

Our fight is for the soul, and in that battle we go forward together till victory be won. Our struggle is hard, because we are fighting for something great, and great things are not lightly or easily gained. We are fighting for nothing less than a revolution in the spirit of our people. We must be worthy of our mission, for blackshirts are those who are summoned to lead the people to a new and a higher civilization.

The Blackshirt is a revolutionary dedicated to the service of our country. We must always possess the character of the true revolutionary. It is not the character that you observe in the little men of the old parties, blown hither and thither by every gust of convenience opinion, elated by a little success, downcast by a little failure, gossiping and chattering about the prospects of the next five minutes, jostling for place, but not so forward in service. Without loyalty, endurance, or staying power, such a character is the hallmark of financial democratic politics. It is the opposite of national socialism.

In the true revolutionary, the first quality is the power to endure. Constancy, loyalty to cause and comrades, manhood and stability of nature. These are the qualities of... the true revolutionary. In our movement that great character... has been reborn. And for that reason we carry within us... destiny.... We care not whether we win tomorrow morning or at the end of a lifetime of labour and of struggle. For to us the little calculations of the little men mean nothing. All we care is that win we will because Britain demands it and no power on earth can hold down the will within us.

Struggles we have had and will have. Blows we have taken and will again. Victories we have had and will have again.... Through good and ill we march on, till victory be won, for this is the character of the true revolutionary. In the great moments of supreme struggle and decision it is easy to hold that character, even in supreme sacrifice. It is not so easy in the hard daily task. It is then even more that in the great fights we have together that I would like to be the companion of every one of you. I would like to be with every action team that carries the message of our new faith to new streets. I would like to be with every man or woman during the hard but vital job of giving leadership to the people in the block of houses for which they are responsible.

For these are the jobs that come, by the dedication of thousands to that mission of leading the people in their own homes and streets, revolution is won. In that task I cannot in body be with everyone of you every day. But in spirit I am with you always.... Together... we have lit a flame that the ages shall not extinguish. Guard that sacred flame, my brother Blackshirts, until it... lights again the path of mankind.

Oswald Mosley, 1938

MockTurtle
Saturday, September 13th, 2008, 08:44 AM
This is definitely some of the best news I've read in quite awhile. And from England? Wow, I didn't see that one coming at all. :|

mischak
Saturday, September 13th, 2008, 09:03 AM
lol any study that claims 25% of women seek a man with good gardening skills as a top priority is utter crap.

I prefer balance, thank you very much.

OneEnglishNorman
Saturday, September 13th, 2008, 09:13 AM
Why is "Gardening" above "Puts the family first"

?


http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2008/08/28/article-0-026FBC8000000578-196_468x592.jpg

MockTurtle
Saturday, September 13th, 2008, 10:11 AM
Perhaps 'Gardening' implies that he is stable and owns a house? :P

Pino
Saturday, September 13th, 2008, 01:55 PM
Maybe the family unit has broke down because everybody paves over there gardens these days?

Theres a conspiracy theory for you.

Thrymheim
Sunday, September 14th, 2008, 04:56 AM
I don't want a bloke to touch the garden, that's my area! along with the kitchen, although he does have to wash up!!!

Stormraaf
Sunday, September 14th, 2008, 08:08 AM
When I don't see a survey's data sanitised to show a "things women say they care about but don't" category, I tend to not believe a word it says. :P

Eccardus Teutonicus
Sunday, September 14th, 2008, 09:50 PM
Why is "Gardening" above "Puts the family first"

?



It struck me as odd too, but I say don't look a gift-horse in the mouth, we're making some progress here.

Hamar Fox
Sunday, September 14th, 2008, 10:40 PM
I really doubt the female ego would ever accept a reversion to domestic 'duty' over materialistic 'freedom' without the foundation of the 'wage-slavery-as-liberation' imperative being shaken to its core -- something which is sadly nowhere on the horizon.

Rainraven
Monday, September 15th, 2008, 06:30 AM
I believe I am secretly being trained in housewifery by my boyfriend, though I can't really complain because I think we both enjoy the meal more when I've cooked it! I don't think I could ever spend my life time being a housewife but I won't feel repressed if I do it for a number of years while I have children, whats most important to me is that I have the choice and when I do it, it's not because I have to but because I want to.

Jäger
Monday, September 15th, 2008, 08:30 AM
I don't think I could ever spend my life time being a housewife
What is it you think you would be missing?

Rainraven
Monday, September 15th, 2008, 08:40 AM
What is it you think you would be missing?

I also want to gain a university degree and have a career. I want to know that before I take my place as a wife and mother I have the intelligence and means to support myself. Perhaps this is just pride on my part?

TheGreatest
Wednesday, September 17th, 2008, 03:56 AM
It must be very recent... My sibling is currently getting a degree but she absolutely loves cooking and all that stuff.


I think it has to do because our mom was a corporate type (six figures manager at a huge company) and was never around to raise us. We had nannies and the like.
I think this has had an impact on my sisters. I think they remember growing up without seeing Mom or Dad much, so they want to "do it better" when it comes to their children.


Though being a mom was not an easy as it once was. One of my siblings makes much more money than her boyfriend. If they want a good life then obviously he will be the one staying at home and raising the children.

MockTurtle
Wednesday, September 17th, 2008, 04:12 AM
Though being a mom was not an easy as it once was. One of my siblings makes much more money than her boyfriend. If they want a good life then obviously he will be the one staying at home and raising the children.

Lol, this is something I've never understood. Why do women complain about this sort of thing and then end up involved with these types anyhow? I can't understand why any woman would get involved with a man who is clearly less accomplished financially (except perhaps in really rare cases of inherited wealth, etc.). Why do they do it? Do they feel 'intimidated' by more financially accomplished men? :D

Oh well, luckily for me I won't have to worry about it.

CrystalRose
Wednesday, September 17th, 2008, 04:52 AM
Lol, this is something I've never understood. Why do women complain about this sort of thing and then end up involved with these types anyhow? I can't understand why any woman would get involved with a man who is clearly less accomplished financially (except perhaps in really rare cases of inherited wealth, etc.). Why do they do it? Do they feel 'intimidated' by more financially accomplished men? :D

Oh well, luckily for me I won't have to worry about it.

I don’t think women should be looked down upon for being successful. Maybe she takes more initiative than the boyfriend and loves him regardless of how much he makes. However, women who complain about these 'types' shouldn’t get involved with men who make less. Conflict? Fix it. I don't think I’m intimidated by men who are financially more accomplished than me.. I was raised to look beneath the materialistic things that money buys. Has money, great! The more the merrier. Doesn’t have more money than me, well great, I have my own! Maybe certain men can’t handle a woman who can financially take care of herself because they want to control every aspect of her life, since life requires money. Are you intimidated by women who are financially capable of taking care of themselves? From what I’ve experienced, men with money just want a trophy girlfriend/wife, dumber than a box of rocks, to show off to their friends. Got something to say? No, just sit there and 'look' pretty. I do see women who are gold-diggers, I see women who genuinely love a man with nothing to offer the world except love, I see women who put their careers before their family(if they even have time to create one) But us sitting here talking about it isn't going to make women seek only successful men. So, stop worrying about it ;)

CrystalRose
Wednesday, September 17th, 2008, 05:14 AM
Maybe men shouldn't stay home afterall..:D

Police: Dirty dishes led to woman's rampage

She faces charges after allegedly biting, swinging sword at boyfriend

Tues., Sept. 16, 2008

FORT WORTH, Texas - A 20-year-old woman faces an aggravated assault charge after she bit her boyfriend, broke a picture frame across his face and swung at him with a sword during an argument about him not doing the dishes, police said.

The woman was arrested Thursday afternoon at the couple's apartment, the Fort Worth Star-Telegram reported on its Web site.

The 21-year-old man told police that he became involved in an argument because the woman was upset that the dishes were not clean. Police Lt. Paul Henderson said the woman told the man to leave the apartment, but he refused.

Henderson said the woman then tried to physically remove the man. During the ensuing struggle, the woman bit the man's right shoulder and broke a picture frame across his face, causing visible cuts, Henderson said.

The woman then grabbed an approximately 2-foot sword and swung it at him, but missed, police said.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26742851/


I tried to warn SouthernBoy..

MockTurtle
Wednesday, September 17th, 2008, 05:29 AM
I don’t think women should be looked down upon for being successful.

Neither do I.



Maybe she takes more initiative than the boyfriend and loves him regardless of how much he makes.

Sorry, but to me that's just stupid on her part, and actually contrary to the proper 'system of relationships' that has taken root in our culture. As TG said, what happens when the issue of children come up? Who's supposed to sacrifice their work schedule for the children? If the man does it, that's just an abomination in my mind, and something I'd never tolerate. If he isn't motivated, then why is she with him in the first place? Motivation is an important quality after all, and speaks a great deal about an individual. Why wouldn't she be more discerning?



However, women who complain about these 'types' shouldn’t get involved with men who make less. Conflict? Fix it.

I agree.



I don't think I’m intimidated by men who are financially more accomplished than me.. I was raised to look beneath the materialistic things that money buys. Has money, great! The more the merrier. Doesn’t have more money than me, well great, I have my own!

No, money isn't everything, but it's not totally insignificant, especially in the context of a long-term male/female relationship. From an evolutionary standpoint, it makes perfect sense that the woman would be attracted to males who are financially accomplished, because this implies greater protection of offspring and therefore greater survival advantage.

Saying that 'it's everything' isn't correct, IMO; but, saying it's nothing is equally incorrect too.



Maybe certain men can’t handle a woman who can financially take care of herself because they want to control every aspect of her life, since life requires money.

Handle her? How do you mean?

Don't you think it makes at least some sense that men would want leverage in a relationship? I know I certainly do. Women have other qualities that give them leverage; most importantly, they have physical qualities that can be very influential in this context. The man should be able to gather resources and provide a stable environment; that's what we do, after all.

I don't think it's so much about 'control', so much as it's about being able to bring something valuable to the table. Stable, lasting relationships require more than just love, they are also based on the fulfillment of other responsibilities (resource acquisition being one of them).



Are you intimidated by women who are financially capable of taking care of themselves?

No. But, at the same time, I definitely wouldn't get involved with someone who earned more than me. That would violate the relationship system that functions best.



From what I’ve experienced, men with money just want a trophy girlfriend/wife, dumber than a box of rocks, to show off to their friends. Got something to say? No, just sit there and 'look' pretty.

Well, I know I certainly don't want that, and those men who do actually search for such a person aren't real men, IMO. Real men aren't like that. I want someone who has their own opinions, is capable of holding their own intellectually, etc. I've always enjoyed my in-depth conversations with women.

But (and here's the key point), I also wouldn't tolerate any of the 'male-bashing' that might conceivably come from such a person either (it tends to be prevalent in University settings nowadays, and therefore many intelligent women have been exposed to it). It's a wonderful thing to have a partner that is intellectually capable, but relationship stability also depends on positive attitudes towards the opposite sex. I'm not meaning to be overly-pessimistic, but women seem to be getting less and less capable of really demonstrating this sort of respect.



I do see women who are gold-diggers, I see women who genuinely love a man with nothing to offer the world except love, I see women who put their careers before their family(if they even have time to create one) But us sitting here talking about it isn't going to make women seek only successful men. So, stop worrying about it ;)

It's a twofold problem, really; restoring attitudes to the sexes that are more harmonious, while also being able to harness and stimulate the resource-gathering energy of males once again. Our future depends on it.

Sigurd
Wednesday, September 17th, 2008, 07:04 AM
Police: Dirty dishes led to woman's rampage

She faces charges after allegedly biting, swinging sword at boyfriend

Ouch. This could of been me. :-O

Jäger
Wednesday, September 17th, 2008, 08:12 AM
I want to know that before I take my place as a wife and mother I have the intelligence and means to support myself. Perhaps this is just pride on my part?
More like bowing to current social expectations, a degree does not prove that in anyway.

Rainraven
Wednesday, September 17th, 2008, 09:33 AM
More like bowing to current social expectations, a degree does not prove that in anyway.

A degree by itself doesn't but a career does.
Social expectations? I don't think I'd be doing a degree that's comprised of85% males if that was the case :rofl

Jäger
Wednesday, September 17th, 2008, 10:39 AM
A degree by itself doesn't but a career does.
Still, this depends highly on the career itself, I know many people who are very much dependent on their employer to "support themselves".
Why would it proof independence to work for some stranger and get paid, than to work for your family and get provided?


Social expectations? I don't think I'd be doing a degree that's comprised of85% males if that was the case :rofl
How would this be against social expectations? Raising numbers of females in male dominated sciences are celebrated like a national holiday by the "voice of the people", the media :|.

Rainraven
Wednesday, September 17th, 2008, 10:45 AM
I believe that if I save and invest my income then I won't have to rely on job security.

Jäger
Wednesday, September 17th, 2008, 11:32 AM
I believe that if I save and invest my income then I won't have to rely on job security.
So the pay is higher is what you mean?

Rainraven
Wednesday, September 17th, 2008, 11:42 AM
Perhaps, but later I will take the savings I have made and invest them in something else - My childrens futures.

Jäger
Wednesday, September 17th, 2008, 12:33 PM
Perhaps, but later I will take the savings I have made and invest them in something else - My childrens futures.
Noble, but sounds paradox to my ears, you work and abdicate from children during this time, then later you use your earned money (work time) to spent on your children anyways.
Why not work for your children from the start?

Is it really that women have so much fear to be left alone by their husbands, and thus need to do everything on their own?
The union between man and woman is supposed to be a relief for both (in regard to child raising), and yet, no one dares to count on his partner anymore.
A truly sick society I see. :(

MockTurtle
Wednesday, September 17th, 2008, 01:25 PM
Is it really that women have so much fear to be left alone by their husbands, and thus need to do everything on their own?
The union between man and woman is supposed to be a relief for both (in regard to child raising), and yet, no one dares to count on his partner anymore.
A truly sick society I see. :(

So true. People seem less and less capable of really developing strong bonds between each other. There are too many 'flings', too much adolescence. By the time many people think they have found their stable partner, they realize how alien such stability actually is. Simply put, they are unable to trust.

Rainraven
Wednesday, September 17th, 2008, 10:10 PM
Noble, but sounds paradox to my ears, you work and abdicate from children during this time, then later you use your earned money (work time) to spent on your children anyways.
Why not work for your children from the start?

Currently I'm a student, as is my boyfriend. We have no income and live off our student loans from week to week. How would we be able to buy a car or house without any real income? Those are only two things that are pretty much essential when you start wanting to have a family.


Is it really that women have so much fear to be left alone by their husbands, and thus need to do everything on their own?
The union between man and woman is supposed to be a relief for both (in regard to child raising), and yet, no one dares to count on his partner anymore.
A truly sick society I see. :(

I have to agree that it is sick that marriage is now seen as only a temporary thing.

It's important that both I and my husband have skills to support our future family. That doesn't mean we will both have to work. But what if he falls ill for a long period of time? Or wants to further his education? Change his career later on in life?

EQ Fighter
Sunday, November 9th, 2008, 06:49 PM
Rainraven

We have no income and live off our student loans from week to week. How would we be able to buy a car or house without any real income? Those are only two things that are pretty much essential when you start wanting to have a family.

If you have student loans you are already in the hole.

Rainraven


It's important that both I and my husband have skills to support our future family. That doesn't mean we will both have to work.

That will entirely depend on the future world we find our selves. There is no guarantee that any degree you have now will be of any use in the future.

If you don’t mind telling us.
Just out of Curiosity what is your major.

Anfang
Sunday, November 9th, 2008, 07:19 PM
I dentify as a Sachsen. My Sachsisch Volkisch friends and myself feel no need to say thing like "Men wan't women to be more traditional".
If you have to say "I want you to be more this or that"- there is already some lack of connection. Basta.
But then the Sachsen historicaly considered Men and Women equals. The old sachsen when they were married gave a horse and a sword to each other. A woman could leave the marriage and take all her stuff back if the man was not a good provider or was lazy abusive.
On top of the racial questions I think that many people have got to extirpate the jesus created Phallocentric thinking from their lives. Otherwise we might just as well start cloning scandinavians and stick with the cultural and "spiritual"garbage that we have been believing, exept as artificially manufactured people now.

Perhaps there is a Difference between the different germanic groups in this,
I dont know, but it seems to me that Germanism is a package of race, spirit and Will. The will of the semitic people's religiously ordained World view has effected the Germanic thinking , has been artificially imposed on us.

Sigurd
Sunday, November 9th, 2008, 11:52 PM
On the initial thread title - I feel that I have to throw in an experience I made on the weekend: It is not hard at all to find women that believe in traditional roles - and they came in all ages, shapes, forms, and from all walks of life.

On Friday I found myself talking to this lassie for several hours about god and the world whilst I was at a birthday party. Either way - at some point she had headed for the toilet ... and did not return. We all wondered were she had gone to. Eventually she was to be found in the kitchen - of her own according tidying up some of the mess that had been made, in the predicament of "Well - if the bunch of you men prefer to drink, I might just as well do something productive". :D

I decide to make a joke about her being the perfect housewife, if she tidies at parties without being requested to do so, and she did say that she believed in traditional roles as to who does which duties ... something I, nor none of the others had anticipated when confronted with some of her rather "liberal" political stance a bit earlier. LOL - I think when we collectively found her washing out beer cans etc. etc. we were all considering a mock proposal. :D

So far so good - I thought to myself, that maybe there is hope for the world if you find that often especially those women you'd never expected to hold more traditional views actually hold them. But then the Saturday topped that one tenfold! :D

For some reason, after a night out in town, I and two lasses ended up at the place of some random bloke for another beer or two. I understand that one of them knew him, though ... either way, when we sat there and felt that hunger got the better of us, I said - being the old, cheeky mock chauvinist that I am - "You women could make us something to eat, ya know?" (I can be very bluntly straight-forward when I've had a few pints :D).

And that got us talking about traditional roles of men and women again - and both of them ... whom I had also not expected to hold such views in the slightest, because there was no hint in the ideas they had offered beforehand and the company they kept that they'd be your stereotypical "Women should be HAPPY to be the housewife" type of lasses. And again, my belief in mankind (and ultimately, more correctly, my belief in wenchdom :wsg) was reinstated once more.

Ergo - women can be more traditional than you think they are ... just many men probably never have the face to directly enough say, "Woman - make me dinner", even if they are just friends/fresh acquaintances ... or something along the lines. :P

Or did they just pretend to share my (maybe overly radically presented) viewpoint because all three were quite evidently likely trying to hit on me, thinking that'd abet their chances? :rofl

Cliodhna
Saturday, September 4th, 2010, 06:39 PM
I wish there were more men in the United States that wanted a good housewife...I meet more men who would rather me support them. I want to be the traditional housewife, but I need a man who will actually work first LOL Of course, it would help if the unemployment rate here wasn't upwards of 10%...:~(

Curtisw
Saturday, September 4th, 2010, 07:02 PM
In polls and such, most women want to learn a professional skill, but only work part-time. I think that's more what the future will look like - not a reversal to the 1950s, but rather women being educated in a profession and working 20-30 hours a week, taking care of house/family the rest of the time, with men working full time.

SpearBrave
Saturday, September 4th, 2010, 07:21 PM
I wish there were more men in the United States that wanted a good housewife...I meet more men who would rather me support them. I want to be the traditional housewife, but I need a man who will actually work first LOL Of course, it would help if the unemployment rate here wasn't upwards of 10%...:~(

I know this was a subject of great debate at my house last year. I wanted her to stay home and look after things there and work towards a future goal we both have. Her biggest argument was " I want my own money" or " I want my freedom" . Well after some concessions were made on my part she decided to stay home. Now she has her freedom and my money:D. Since then she has started selling her art work and now would not trade her housewife lifestyle for anything( I hope ).

Don't give up hope there are still some men out there that want the things you want. :)

Fyrgenholt
Saturday, September 4th, 2010, 07:29 PM
My girlfriend always tells me she wants a modern, comtemporary, city-like lifestyle in which she can express her independance and work as a strong business woman.

Yet she lives at home, currently, in her lovely, comfortable, country home in rural Lancashire where she grows fruit and veg, stocks chickens, has a few ducks and likes to take quiet walks through farmland pathways. She likes to feel protected and looked after. She loves to cook.

I don't know, I think there is always a difference between what people say they want (the things they 'like' the idea of) and what people really want!

Also, I think that with some things, if not most, nature always overcomes nurture.

Cliodhna
Saturday, September 4th, 2010, 07:57 PM
My girlfriend always tells me she wants a modern, comtemporary, city-like lifestyle in which she can express her independance and work as a strong business woman.

Yet she lives at home, currently, in her lovely, comfortable, country home in rural Lancashire where she grows fruit and veg, stocks chickens, has a few ducks and likes to take quiet walks through farmland pathways. She likes to feel protected and looked after. She loves to cook.

I don't know, I think there is always a difference between what people say they want (the things they 'like' the idea of) and what people really want!

Also, I think that with some things, if not most, nature always overcomes nurture.


That sounds like a wonderful life... :D

Fyrgenholt
Saturday, September 4th, 2010, 08:21 PM
That sounds like a wonderful life... :D

She's very fortunate. I'm not lucky enough to live the lifestyle she does, but with being in a close relationship with her, I get to indulge in it when I have the time ;)

nordfrisk
Saturday, September 4th, 2010, 08:27 PM
personally i like the idea of a women that takes care of the children, but i like the balance because i love my child too. also maybe when you get married you will understand how important the second income can be. its helps a lot.

Cliodhna
Saturday, September 4th, 2010, 08:33 PM
personally i like the idea of a women that takes care of the children, but i like the balance because i love my child too. also maybe when you get married you will understand how important the second income can be. its helps a lot.


I understand the second income can be important...I make candles and other things and I can certainly sell them from home if we needed a second income...although I would rather skimp and save than ship my future children to daycare...

Reshki
Saturday, September 4th, 2010, 10:18 PM
I wish there were more men in the United States that wanted a good housewife..

Heh, I wish there were more women who WANTED to be a housewife.

And you're spot on. If a woman has any skills, thanks to the internet, she can turn her hobby or skill into some extra income, while being the housewife.

BTW men can turn a hobby into extra income (and sometimes their primary income) from home as well -- I know quite a few guys that turned a knife making and leatherworking hobbies onto the internet to make some extra cash, and their stuff (even in this economy) are so in demand that they quite their regular job for it, and are making more money now.

Jäger
Saturday, September 4th, 2010, 10:39 PM
...or " I want my freedom" .
:D Only a woman can tell a man that work has anything to do with freedom :thumbup

SpearBrave
Saturday, September 4th, 2010, 10:50 PM
:D Only a woman can tell a man that work has anything to do with freedom :thumbup

yeah I never could figure out what she was trying to say by that statement so I just gave up and quit asking.:D

Rassenhygieniker
Saturday, September 4th, 2010, 10:59 PM
Men Want Women to Be More Traditional

Yes, why do you think so much white males go for oriental females? Because the majority of oriental females act traditional, while the majority of white females act like rabbies infected crazy negress dykes.

nordfrisk
Saturday, September 4th, 2010, 11:43 PM
I understand the second income can be important...I make candles and other things and I can certainly sell them from home if we needed a second income...although I would rather skimp and save than ship my future children to daycare...

thats just how i do it. not everyone does it that way.

Northern Paladin
Saturday, September 4th, 2010, 11:51 PM
It's obvious, that's how it's always been, since we were all cavemen crawling out of Africa the men would be out hunting and the women stayed put with the kids. However, if you dare point this out to a woman nowadays, you are labeled a "sexist!"

Zogbot
Sunday, September 5th, 2010, 07:47 PM
Yes, why do you think so much white males go for oriental females? Because the majority of oriental females act traditional, while the majority of white females act like rabbies infected crazy negress dykes.

This is true. I detest race treason but I can absolutely see why guys go for the orientals and why females go for the negroes. Negroes are masculine, loud and dominant and that's what women want now that the jews have completely emasculated White men. White men on the other hand want a woman who isn't constantly back-talking them and belittling them, which is what a lot of White women these days do - I mean that quite literally, they constantly insult their men on a range of topics including penis size etc.

Men are ultimately in the wrong here of course, because we let these goddamn kikes run buck wild in our societies.

Berlichingen
Monday, September 6th, 2010, 04:33 AM
My mother's family went from being rich to being very poor when my grandfather died unexpectedly.

Maybe it's just the specter of that tragedy looming over my family, but I'd never marry a woman who wanted to stay at home. I don't like the idea of a family being dependent on one member. What if I died or became badly injured? A chain is only as strong as its weakest link.

Hellbound
Monday, September 6th, 2010, 04:56 AM
Both parents having jobs has become more neccisary these days, though Id prefer a wife who atleast wants to be a mother.

Also, if I remember correctly, one of the primary founders of the feminist movement later hated it because it ruined the value of motherhood.

EQ Fighter
Monday, September 6th, 2010, 05:52 AM
In polls and such, most women want to learn a professional skill, but only work part-time. I think that's more what the future will look like - not a reversal to the 1950s, but rather women being educated in a profession and working 20-30 hours a week, taking care of house/family the rest of the time, with men working full time.

LOL!
Yeah, Right!
Well I will Agree with you on one point.
The Future will not look like the 1950, that is for sure, but unfortunately it will not look like the Idealized Bull $h!t dream of "Equality" that the American Left dreamed up in the 1960's.

I'm doubting that whites will be having many "Family's" 10 to 20 years form now. Because I'm guessing by then we will already have been supplanted by none white populations, due to things like abortion, feminism, and a backlash from the white male population, that we are just beginning to see at the moment.

So realistically I would say that these are the "Good Old Days" when there is actually some remnant of what might still be called a "White Family" .

In 20 years form now the White Population of Europe, will be a Minority, and in much shorter time the Middle Eastern Countries, will have completely taken over both the banking system in the western world, as well a achieved a military parity with the west, because of technological, spread throughout the world, and because they are the only ones that did not roll over to the Marxist West. IE NATO, UN, EUSSR, and other forms of Communism/Equality.

EQ Fighter
Monday, September 6th, 2010, 06:18 AM
I dentify as a Sachsen. My Sachsisch Volkisch friends and myself feel no need to say thing like "Men wan't women to be more traditional".
If you have to say "I want you to be more this or that"- there is already some lack of connection. Basta.
But then the Sachsen historicaly considered Men and Women equals.


You Know Anfang; It is one thing when a woman advocated's for her rights, but when a Mangina does it, it then becomes absolutely absurd.



On top of the racial questions I think that many people have got to extirpate the jesus created Phallocentric thinking from their lives.


Looking at the going record, of Fem-centric Societies, including Scandinavians. I think ill put my money, on the Phallocentric thinking, and set back and watch the latest group of Feminist, and Manginas, crash and burn in the trash heap of history. ;)



Otherwise we might just as well start cloning scandinavians.

Maybe not a bad idea, because at the current state of affairs, the average Swedish woman seems to be a face down in the mud, failure on multiple levels regarding traditional woman's duty's. But then again using the technology developed by men to keep alive a evolutionary failure, so we can have women with yellow hair, seems to be a misappropriation of technology does it not?

Cliodhna
Monday, September 6th, 2010, 06:34 AM
My mother's family went from being rich to being very poor when my grandfather died unexpectedly.

Maybe it's just the specter of that tragedy looming over my family, but I'd never marry a woman who wanted to stay at home. I don't like the idea of a family being dependent on one member. What if I died or became badly injured? A chain is only as strong as its weakest link.



Well in my case, I am a very competent worker. So, if I had to work I could easily get a job with my resume. A woman staying at home doesn't necessarily leave the family in peril. She could always go to work if the need arose. Also, you can have life insurance in case something were to happen to further provide for the family you leave behind. But I understand your concern...

EQ Fighter
Monday, September 6th, 2010, 06:43 AM
On the initial thread title - I feel that I have to throw in an experience I made on the weekend: It is not hard at all to find women that believe in traditional roles - and they came in all ages, shapes, forms, and from all walks of life.

On Friday I found myself talking to this lassie for several hours about god and the world whilst I was at a birthday party. Either way - at some point she had headed for the toilet ... and did not return. We all wondered were she had gone to. Eventually she was to be found in the kitchen - of her own according tidying up some of the mess that had been made, in the predicament of "Well - if the bunch of you men prefer to drink, I might just as well do something productive". :D

I decide to make a joke about her being the perfect housewife, if she tidies at parties without being requested to do so, and she did say that she believed in traditional roles as to who does which duties ... something I, nor none of the others had anticipated when confronted with some of her rather "liberal" political stance a bit earlier. LOL - I think when we collectively found her washing out beer cans etc. etc. we were all considering a mock proposal. :D

So far so good - I thought to myself, that maybe there is hope for the world if you find that often especially those women you'd never expected to hold more traditional views actually hold them. But then the Saturday topped that one tenfold! :D

For some reason, after a night out in town, I and two lasses ended up at the place of some random bloke for another beer or two. I understand that one of them knew him, though ... either way, when we sat there and felt that hunger got the better of us, I said - being the old, cheeky mock chauvinist that I am - "You women could make us something to eat, ya know?" (I can be very bluntly straight-forward when I've had a few pints :D).

And that got us talking about traditional roles of men and women again - and both of them ... whom I had also not expected to hold such views in the slightest, because there was no hint in the ideas they had offered beforehand and the company they kept that they'd be your stereotypical "Women should be HAPPY to be the housewife" type of lasses. And again, my belief in mankind (and ultimately, more correctly, my belief in wenchdom :wsg) was reinstated once more.

Ergo - women can be more traditional than you think they are ... just many men probably never have the face to directly enough say, "Woman - make me dinner", even if they are just friends/fresh acquaintances ... or something along the lines. :P

Or did they just pretend to share my (maybe overly radically presented) viewpoint because all three were quite evidently likely trying to hit on me, thinking that'd abet their chances? :rofl

I would be carfule befoure barking up they "Traditional Roles" Tree Sigurd.

Because "Traditional Roles" were not that great for men in fact. I would say that what you are probably seeing is the fact that some Gen Y women, are finding out that the "Traditional Female Role" was not too bad as it was made out to be by feminist. That being said, we really cant just say xnay, xnay and go back to where we were.

Truth is these women want "Traditional Roles" when it suites them and none traditional roles when it suites them.

Rassenhygieniker
Monday, September 6th, 2010, 01:28 PM
But then again using the technology developed by men to keep alive a evolutionary failure, so we can have women with yellow hair, seems to be a misappropriation of technology does it not?

How dare you belittle our Nordic Lords and Saviours? Their blood is the life source of the Aryo-Germanic races, take them out of the pictures and after awhile we will end up looking like arabs at best. Look at the Greeks, or any of those backward countries who haven't had any Nordic genetic contribution (or at the very least Nordic Hierarchy in charge of the country) for centuries, as soon as the Nordic bloodflow stopped their country stopped evolving or worse it went backward and their race started degenerating unto crass.

Take our Nordic Masters out of the pictures and this will be the end result for us:

http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/4190/r05r05.gif

Jäger
Monday, September 6th, 2010, 01:38 PM
I don't like the idea of a family being dependent on one member.
Ideally, you can also count on your extended family: your nation.

Sigurd
Monday, September 6th, 2010, 02:39 PM
also maybe when you get married you will understand how important the second income can be. its helps a lot.

Second incomes can be made quite easily from home in this day and age, including all types of office jobs. Even part-time work is always possible whilst the children are at school (that is unless you home-school, of course), finally also what Kadski said about options of vending self-sufficiently over the internet. Plenty of options where one doesn't exclude the other. :)


:D Only a woman can tell a man that work has anything to do with freedom :thumbup

You say that to you, work is a nuisance? Strike the "German" from your postbit, you know we only live to work. And that coming from an Austrian to a Prussian... ;)

Jäger
Monday, September 6th, 2010, 03:19 PM
You say that to you, work is a nuisance?
Sometimes affinity and duty correlate.
However, it is still one of the most baffling feminist propaganda achievements, to make women belief that work would have to do anything with freedom, it is the inter-dependent relationship par excellence.

EQ Fighter
Tuesday, September 7th, 2010, 12:06 AM
How dare you belittle our Nordic Lords and Saviours? Their blood is the life source of the Aryo-Germanic races, take them out of the pictures and after awhile we will end up looking like arabs at best.

I'm not trying to deliberately belittle them, but that fact remains that Scandinavians, especially Sweden is in no position to be anyone savior, because at current they cannot even save themselves.

At this point I would say that most Nordic Countries are the equivalent of a Ground Zero, where a Cultural Nuclear war has been fought. It is a society which is suffering from "Cultural Fallout".




Take our Nordic Masters out of the pictures and this will be the end result for us:


Granted!
But what solution do you have to offer, the average Nordic Guy??
Do you think Elin Nordegren types, are going to save the Nordic Race??

I'm thinking Cloning is a better and more reliable option than women like her.

Sorry if that is cold.

Cliodhna
Tuesday, September 7th, 2010, 12:11 AM
I think gardening includes things like mowing the lawn, which in the United States at least is something a man generally does. However, I mow the lawn in my house and do all the gardening...;)

SaxonCeorl
Sunday, September 12th, 2010, 02:18 AM
I think gardening includes things like mowing the lawn, which in the United States at least is something a man generally does. However, I mow the lawn in my house and do all the gardening...;)

I get annoyed when I see married women mowing their lawns; why aren't their husbands doing it? When I get married, I won't have my wife doing physically taxing tasks such as lawn mowing. Physical suffering is meant to be borne by men. Call me old fashioned, but that's how I feel. We men need to 'make up' for child birthing after all, don't we?

EQ Fighter
Sunday, September 12th, 2010, 03:26 AM
I get annoyed when I see married women mowing their lawns; why aren't their husbands doing it? When I get married, I won't have my wife doing physically taxing tasks such as lawn mowing.


LOL!
Yep! Mowing a Lawn could probably Kill a woman, Better send in the Men for that one. :D



Physical suffering is meant to be borne by men. Call me old fashioned, but that's how I feel. We men need to 'make up' for child birthing after all, don't we?

LOL!
Ah!
So!
Exactly why should Men, have to make up for something women were naturally designed to do.

Reshki
Sunday, September 12th, 2010, 04:08 AM
Physical suffering is meant to be borne by men. Call me old fashioned, but that's how I feel. We men need to 'make up' for child birthing after all, don't we?

No, but it gets us out of the house, and away from the mental suffering, er, nagging!

LOL

;)

Sigurd
Sunday, September 12th, 2010, 04:32 PM
I get annoyed when I see married women mowing their lawns; why aren't their husbands doing it? When I get married, I won't have my wife doing physically taxing tasks such as lawn mowing.

That is certainly also how I was raised for a large part: The man does the stuff around the house - lawn-moving, clearing the driveway, stacking resp. carrying the wood, clean the pool, do much of the gardening. The woman does the stuff inside the house - cooking, cleaning, washing, decorating. Some stuff, such as the harvest of whatever little fruits and vegetables you have in your yard is done by both in shared effort. :)

Whatever is supposed to be "slavery" for the woman there and "no fair share" for the man in that arrangement I have never understood. At university we get our share of feminists, some of them have related in their youthful idealism about how they would never cook for a man, and when I mentioned my opinion it was "yea, but we get to do the things that aren't nice" --- yea, right, like clearing the driveway or mowing the lawn was a particularly nice task. :oanieyes

SpearBrave
Sunday, September 12th, 2010, 05:08 PM
If my woman wants to mow the lawn who am I to stop her.:P

Actually we both mow the lawn and we both do house work except clothes washing(she wants things done her way or else).

I was raised in a house that the men did all the gardening and outside work. Things are different today though, my woman enjoys being outside and really there is little inside work to do as we are not messy people.

I do lay claim to the garden, but that does not stop her from helping if she so chooses.;) Besides it is a great way to spend time together.

Sigurd
Sunday, September 12th, 2010, 06:29 PM
(she wants things done her way or else).

Whipped by choice? :wsg

http://roissy.files.wordpress.com/2007/12/image001.jpg

Forgive me, my friend. I couldn't help it. :P

SpearBrave
Sunday, September 12th, 2010, 06:44 PM
^ no not at all she likes the clothes done her way. I just make sure they are clean and folded according to military standards.;)

She likes to put in all that smell good stuff and fabric softener in.:D

The way I view it is that it is her house, but my farm, barn, garden, and shop. I did not pick out the paint colors, the furniture, bedding, or other things like that. Personally I could live in a cave and be happy. I hope you understand women want nice things in their homes, I think it makes them feel better about themselves.:)

Reshki
Sunday, September 12th, 2010, 08:12 PM
You know, that's interesting. The yard was always the man's, but the garden was always the woman's when I grew up.

SaxonCeorl
Monday, September 13th, 2010, 01:46 AM
LOL!
LOL!
Ah!
So!
Exactly why should Men, have to make up for something women were naturally designed to do.

Designed for it or not, I tip my hat to women and childbirth. I would NOT want to do that...

More generally, I have a sexist belief that men can handle pain and suffering better and we should bear the rigours of life so our sweet and delicate ladies don't have to. Factually sound? No. Based on any proof? No. In fact, I think I recall studies that indicate women actually have better pain thresholds :D

SpearBrave
Monday, September 13th, 2010, 02:02 AM
You know, that's interesting. The yard was always the man's, but the garden was always the woman's when I grew up.

Reshki, please excuse the bantering between Sigurd and I as we were joking with one another.:)

The term garden is subjective, I use it in the sense that it includes where we grow our food crops. Plus I have background in horticulture, so naturally all of those things are under my domain.;)

Cliodhna
Tuesday, September 14th, 2010, 06:17 AM
Well, I am not married anymore...however, I mowed the lawn and the reason I did it was because he was allergic to the grass clippings...it didn't kill me lol It is good excercise..

Adalheid
Monday, June 25th, 2012, 03:40 PM
This fits my family situation...I prefer my husband to follow a very traditional role. He is strong, capable, works hard, protects us, establishes his place at the table all while at the same time he knows that being soft with his wife and daughter is important. We have a very good relationship--exceptional, if I may say so. We've been married now for five years and together for seven. Our marriage is wonderful because of the traditional roles we take. I wish more people would at least try it and see, because it brings so much joy into our lives.

I welcome him home every day with a fresh pot of coffee, a kiss and a good meal. His home is tidy, his wife is happy and his child is well adjusted and cared for. As our family grows this will be more challenging for me me, but I enjoy the challenge nonetheless.

I am a stay at home mother, and I am blessed for it. It can be tough...especially in this day and age when it isn't highly regarded anymore. ("What, you don't have a career and your child isn't in DAYCARE?!!" I get this a lot like as if it's some sort of bad thing that someone else isn't raising our child)...and living in the city doesn't allow me the same kind of joys that I'd have if we owned some land and I could have a vegetable garden, outdoor space for children to play and a clothes line...but I make do. We're going to buy land soon, and then you'll see me grinning with pleasure as I can enjoy the outdoors with my family more....

I have my fingers crossed that the traditional marriage makes a comeback. While I do have a few girlfriends that share in my housewifery, there aren't many around who do. I firmly believe that when more women turn to their homes, husband and children, we'll see leaps and bounds in the improvement of our people and numbers. Men need to not be afraid of offending and voice their desires to their women about this. We need to open up and allow change to happen, for the better. Men need to be loving to their women and show them they can indeed be valuable and respected for being a mother and a traditional wife. A huge reason why women turn away from this is rooted in insecurity that they're not productive members of society and will be looked down on for not having a career.

hyidi
Monday, June 25th, 2012, 03:52 PM
This is article true? (hope it is)

Feminst and feminism not important to us, It's just the liberals are pushing for this stupid organisation which most of us don't even want. Goes to show feminism is not a natural thing to a women and man.

Olavssønn
Monday, June 25th, 2012, 04:04 PM
I can sign under on this. I definitely value traditional feminine qualities rather than this "career above everything else"-mentality that the culturalmarxists have tried to impose on all women in the postmodern West. The tide will turn sooner or later. After all: biology will always win over ideology in the end.

Gustaaf
Monday, June 25th, 2012, 04:48 PM
Is it too much to ask for a woman to be a woman and a man to be a man? It's increasingly hard for a traditional man to find a traditional woman. I'm lucky, I'm already settled. But even in my relationship, things aren't always what I'd consider ideal. One thing we disagree on is the relationship of parent to child. I believe the father should have the final say on all things related to the child, but my wife vehemently disagrees. I try to downplay it, but it's something that's causing some friction between us. And that's what feminism has brought into the modern family that doesn't belong: friction.

tigerlily
Monday, June 25th, 2012, 05:51 PM
Is it too much to ask for a woman to be a woman and a man to be a man? It's increasingly hard for a traditional man to find a traditional woman. I'm lucky, I'm already settled. But even in my relationship, things aren't always what I'd consider ideal. One thing we disagree on is the relationship of parent to child. I believe the father should have the final say on all things related to the child, but my wife vehemently disagrees. I try to downplay it, but it's something that's causing some friction between us. And that's what feminism has brought into the modern family that doesn't belong: friction.

When people live in close quarters there will naturally be a lot of friction between them. It is inevitable. To blame this on feminism and suggest that it didn't exist before is somewhat naive about human nature..

Gustaaf
Monday, June 25th, 2012, 07:01 PM
When people live in close quarters there will naturally be a lot of friction between them. It is inevitable. To blame this on feminism and suggest that it didn't exist before is somewhat naive about human nature..

But it's the conflict of roles caused by feminism that's causing the friction. Would we still fight about other things if feminism weren't a factor? Maybe. But this isn't something I'm sure about. Feminism is poison.

Jens
Monday, June 25th, 2012, 07:06 PM
Is it too much to ask for a woman to be a woman and a man to be a man? It's increasingly hard for a traditional man to find a traditional woman. I'm lucky, I'm already settled. But even in my relationship, things aren't always what I'd consider ideal. One thing we disagree on is the relationship of parent to child. I believe the father should have the final say on all things related to the child, but my wife vehemently disagrees. I try to downplay it, but it's something that's causing some friction between us. And that's what feminism has brought into the modern family that doesn't belong: friction.

Why should the father have the only opinion that matters? Do you actually have any rational reason at all to have that opinion? If you do, pls explain.

Adalheid
Monday, June 25th, 2012, 07:16 PM
Why should the father have the only opinion that matters? Do you actually have any rational reason at all to have that opinion? If you do, pls explain.

Agreed, Jens.

My marriage is a partnership where I respect my husband's opinion as much as he does mine. He does play a unique role as do I. I don't think he'd ever want to do anything that wasn't creating a sense of well-being for his entire family, nor would I. Compromise, consideration and compassion for your partner existed long before feminism or any other facility of modern influence.

That's just my input, the reality is that marriage is different and means different things for different people.

Gustaaf
Tuesday, June 26th, 2012, 01:23 PM
Why should the father have the only opinion that matters? Do you actually have any rational reason at all to have that opinion? If you do, pls explain.

Men and women should both have opinions on child rearing, but when they disagree, it should be the man's opinion that triumphs. What results when the opposite is true is the ridiculous modern parenting methods that have turned the young generations into degenerates and school drop outs who have kids when they're still in their teens. Children need discipline and austerity. This is why our societies in the past were a success and the death of these practices is why they aren't anymore.

tigerlily
Tuesday, June 26th, 2012, 03:44 PM
An ideal marriage is a partnership in which both opinions have equal importance. Resentment and division can arise from an imbalance in this regard. As a woman I do not believe that my opinions should be unvoiced unless they are kept to some area which society says I am allowed to comment on. This is too restrictive for many people. Everybody's opinion can have some value.

Jens
Tuesday, June 26th, 2012, 03:55 PM
Men and women should both have opinions on child rearing, but when they disagree, it should be the man's opinion that triumphs. What results when the opposite is true is the ridiculous modern parenting methods that have turned the young generations into degenerates and school drop outs who have kids when they're still in their teens. Children need discipline and austerity. This is why our societies in the past were a success and the death of these practices is why they aren't anymore.

You are making an irrational jump from men having a monopoly on children to women having a monopoly. You're supposed to compromise in a marriage. Your wife is a person, not your pet. Anything less is just a fancy way of acting out a sadistic dominance fetish :thumbdown. If you don't trust your wife's judgment, why on earth did you marry her? Do you really believe that men are necessarily going to be right whenever there is a disagreement in marriage? Especially with child rearing issues where a woman is almost always going to be more experienced? Past societies were not successful at all, they barely even managed to survive, and in the most miserable conditions imaginable.

Nobody is suggesting you should trust feminists (you didn't marry one did you?), but a husband has to trust his wife. Overruling her is a strong vote of no confidence. I doubt there is a faster way to destroy a relationship.

Svante
Tuesday, June 26th, 2012, 04:52 PM
This is article true? (hope it is)

Feminst and feminism not important to us, It's just the liberals are pushing for this stupid organisation which most of us don't even want. Goes to show feminism is not a natural thing to a women and man.
.
håller med dig, but i think women there still want to be more then housewife. the guy also he want to be more then sombody that come home from work at night. i think both men and women want more from relatiionship today. i know i do not want relationship such as this becuase it will b e very boreing.







.

Gustaaf
Tuesday, June 26th, 2012, 05:07 PM
You are making an irrational jump from men having a monopoly on children to women having a monopoly. You're supposed to compromise in a marriage. Your wife is a person, not your pet. Anything less is just a fancy way of acting out a sadistic dominance fetish :thumbdown. If you don't trust your wife's judgment, why on earth did you marry her? Do you really believe that men are necessarily going to be right whenever there is a disagreement in marriage? Especially with child rearing issues where a woman is almost always going to be more experienced? Past societies were not successful at all, they barely even managed to survive, and in the most miserable conditions imaginable.

A man should consider his wife's opinion, but ultimately, in any disagreement, it's the man who should put his foot down. Men not asserting themselves when it comes to children is precisely what makes every generation more petulant than the last. Indulgence, understanding instead of rebuke, explanation instead of authority all have failed in creating citizens of any benefit to the nation.


Nobody is suggesting you should trust feminists (you didn't marry one did you?), but a husband has to trust his wife. Overruling her is a strong vote of no confidence. I doubt there is a faster way to destroy a relationship.

I listen to her on a number of matters, but on child rearing it's clear we won't ever agree.

Jens
Tuesday, June 26th, 2012, 05:20 PM
A man should consider his wife's opinion, but ultimately, in any disagreement, it's the man who should put his foot down. Men not asserting themselves when it comes to children is precisely what makes every generation more petulant than the last. Indulgence, understanding instead of rebuke, explanation instead of authority all have failed in creating citizens of any benefit to the nation.


Understanding and rebuke can coexist quite well, as can explanation and authority. I think in both cases they need to go together to avoid creating a severely socially incompetent person. Men putting their foot down regarding children would have no effect on the child's petulance in general, especially considering you may well be the woman advocating your style of child rearing in another relationship. And not every generation is more petulant than the last. That same observation has been made by every writer as far back as ancient Rome, and yet, here we are. You only see the segment of society that sticks out, which is the part you hate, thus the illusion of constant degeneration.

Adalheid
Tuesday, June 26th, 2012, 05:21 PM
Men not asserting themselves when it comes to children is precisely what makes every generation more petulant than the last. .

I don't disagree that men need to be assertive and have a firm role in a marriage, Gustaaf, but I don't agree that being gentle with your child and wife will lead to petulance. Being secure enough in your leadership doesn't require your most loved ones to bend to your will at your demand. My friend, it's a losing battle when you approach a child and your wife like this. She may eventually give in to your demands, but in her heart, and in your child's heart, your hardheadedness will never be forgotten or forgiven.

Sometimes showing your child that a father can be gentle, accommodating and compromising is just as important as teaching a child to respect their elders and to be obedient. It's called being well rounded and having character.

I am a strict mother compared to most that I know, but my rules do not have a blade's edge. I will listen to a explanation and judge accordingly, everything isn't so cut and dry. You may find that your firm decisions for your family will go down a lot more easily if you only approach them with a little more compassion. If you have to do things differently than you'd hoped, and your children are happy, well adjusted and respectful, then who's losing? Just because your children aren't always ruled as firmly as you'd hoped doesn't mean their future will spoil.

...and sometimes, too, it's okay to give in a little and not grind your child and wife into submission if it means that at the end of the day, there are still smiles on their faces and your wife will still lay with you...

Svante
Tuesday, June 26th, 2012, 05:24 PM
Men and women should both have opinions on child rearing, but when they disagree, it should be the man's opinion that triumphs. What results when the opposite is true is the ridiculous modern parenting methods that have turned the young generations into degenerates and school drop outs who have kids when they're still in their teens. Children need discipline and austerity. This is why our societies in the past were a success and the death of these practices is why they aren't anymore.
.
The men and women should have opinions o n child rearing but I thiink it should be the women who are close t o needs of children. The men there should take care of money that are important and to provide for the familie.






.

Gustaaf
Tuesday, June 26th, 2012, 05:31 PM
Understanding and rebuke can coexist quite well, as can explanation and authority. I think in both cases they need to go together to avoid creating a severely socially incompetent person. Men putting their foot down regarding children would have no effect on the child's petulance in general, especially considering you may well be the woman advocating your style of child rearing in another relationship. And not every generation is more petulant than the last. That same observation has been made by every writer as far back as ancient Rome, and yet, here we are. You only see the segment of society that sticks out, which is the part you hate, thus the illusion of constant degeneration.

I can create a list of things that seem to be done by mothers [and feminized fathers]. Siding with the child against the school administration board. A lot of the time, kids get no discipline at home. You have kids verbally and physically abusing their mothers before they even reach double figures. The only place they get any kind of authority is at school. The kid gets a detention or gets expelled, and the parents take the side of the child against the principal and undermine the only source of law or order in the kid's life.

They don't issue chores. They let a kid relax whenever he's not at school [if he goes to school]. This attitude follows them into adulthood and they become slackers, stoners or other leaches on society.

Mothers don't stand up to their children, so even when they know their son is committing a crime, they do nothing. Sometimes this is because they're scared of the tearaway brat that they created, but often they carry the same sense of entitlement for their kid that the kids feel themselves.

I could go on, but I'll sum up by saying fathers need to stop standing on the sidelines nodding their heads and get themselves into gear.

Adalheid
Tuesday, June 26th, 2012, 05:39 PM
I could go on, but I'll sum up by saying fathers need to stop standing on the sidelines nodding their heads and get themselves into gear.

Speak for yourself, Gustaaf. Just because you've observed these traits in the fathers you see and know, doesn't mean that fathers that aren't complete stubborn and insensitive men are crappy fathers.

Don't lump all mothers into one category because you've had a poor example set in your environment. I would not just "sit back" and let my child rot into a worthless lump while he commits crimes. Your comments are so ridiculous that they're verging on trolling.

And what exactly is the matter with a child being a child once in a while. They're children, not soldiers.

Gustaaf
Tuesday, June 26th, 2012, 08:08 PM
Speak for yourself, Gustaaf. Just because you've observed these traits in the fathers you see and know, doesn't mean that fathers that aren't complete stubborn and insensitive men are crappy fathers.

Don't lump all mothers into one category because you've had a poor example set in your environment. I would not just "sit back" and let my child rot into a worthless lump while he commits crimes. Your comments are so ridiculous that they're verging on trolling.

And what exactly is the matter with a child being a child once in a while. They're children, not soldiers.

The fact is that I have traditional opinions. I'm relaxed on most things, at least prepared to admit to myself I'm outmoded, but not in this. This is the one thing I'm not prepared to budge from. It's a family tradition. I was raised the way my father was raised, and he was raised the way his father was raised, and his father, and his etc.

Jens
Tuesday, June 26th, 2012, 11:15 PM
I can create a list of things that seem to be done by mothers [and feminized fathers]. Siding with the child against the school administration board. A lot of the time, kids get no discipline at home. You have kids verbally and physically abusing their mothers before they even reach double figures. The only place they get any kind of authority is at school. The kid gets a detention or gets expelled, and the parents take the side of the child against the principal and undermine the only source of law or order in the kid's life.

They don't issue chores. They let a kid relax whenever he's not at school [if he goes to school]. This attitude follows them into adulthood and they become slackers, stoners or other leaches on society.

Mothers don't stand up to their children, so even when they know their son is committing a crime, they do nothing. Sometimes this is because they're scared of the tearaway brat that they created, but often they carry the same sense of entitlement for their kid that the kids feel themselves.

I could go on, but I'll sum up by saying fathers need to stop standing on the sidelines nodding their heads and get themselves into gear.

So you're saying unless you are a complete dictator and lord over your wife and children like a megalomaniac the only other option is to be a complete doormat? Seriously? Do you even see how insane that is? Do you know how kids turn out like that? When they have a father who treats them like they're broken pieces of turd that need to be molded into something moderately acceptable. Someone they hate with such a fiery passion that they're willing to do anything, even destroy themselves, just to piss him off.

There is NOTHING traditional about fathers taking control of child rearing. Neither of my grandfathers had any role in my parents' upbringing. And my great grandfathers were even less involved. Fathers did not traditionally control that process. Most of them were more raised by their older/adult siblings than either parent. What you're suggesting is like micro managing your techs if you're a CEO. Also known as being bad at management.

Forest_Dweller
Tuesday, June 26th, 2012, 11:57 PM
I think if anything this stereotypical dominearing father/husband is one of the things that has attracted women to feminism. Feminists have used this stereotype to demonize traditional roles with this extreme idea of the patriarchal father. You need to win your childrens respect and confidence, acting like a megalomaniac or a pushover will achieve neither.

I do agree though that the way children treat their parents these days is quite disgusting. This bratty attitude is also promoted in the media as normality.

Adalheid
Wednesday, June 27th, 2012, 12:15 AM
Let me just say that I have a very "traditional" husband, and our child respects him, as will our future children. He does not need to threaten, intimidate or otherwise belittle his child--or his wife in order to receive that. We do right by him, because we are inspired to by his character, by his strength in morals, by his kindness, by his standards for all people in his life. If there ever was anything so troubling for him that he felt angry over it, he would sit us all down and speak gently about it. In return as his wife, I do my very best to rectify the situation. I would not feel the same if he came to the table slamming fists like a cave man. Neither would he listen very closely if I was hysterical and irrational.

It is said that much can be determined about a man's character by how he treats those that are weaker than he.

Gustaaf
Wednesday, June 27th, 2012, 01:35 PM
So you're saying unless you are a complete dictator and lord over your wife and children like a megalomaniac the only other option is to be a complete doormat? Seriously? Do you even see how insane that is? Do you know how kids turn out like that? When they have a father who treats them like they're broken pieces of turd that need to be molded into something moderately acceptable. Someone they hate with such a fiery passion that they're willing to do anything, even destroy themselves, just to piss him off.

I'm adhering to the ways and traditions of my family. I was raised that way and so was my father. To say my father treated me like 'turd' is offensive. He did what he knew was best for me. He knew that in the long run, studying instead of playing Nintendo games would make me a better person with a clear purpose and not someone who wastes his short time on Earth overengorging on apathy.

Why are you so eager to judge the old in terms of the new, when the 'new' is causing the destruction of the Germanic people?


There is NOTHING traditional about fathers taking control of child rearing. Neither of my grandfathers had any role in my parents' upbringing. And my great grandfathers were even less involved. Fathers did not traditionally control that process. Most of them were more raised by their older/adult siblings than either parent. What you're suggesting is like micro managing your techs if you're a CEO. Also known as being bad at management.

Fathers didn't take control and micromanage when they were certain that the mother would comply with the father's wishes and his basic philosophy on parenting. A father would intervene whenever a child did something exceptionally naughty. How rarely this occurred is a testament to how rarely naughty children were under this old system. I'd be happy to let my wife take charge of rasing the children if, and only if, I could be sure she wasn't rewarding bad behavior or any of the other things that I've mentioned.

Jens
Wednesday, June 27th, 2012, 01:51 PM
Fathers didn't take control and micromanage when they were certain that the mother would comply with the father's wishes and his basic philosophy on parenting. A father would intervene whenever a child did something exceptionally naughty. How rarely this occurred is a testament to how rarely naughty children were under this old system. I'd be happy to let my wife take charge of rasing the children if, and only if, I could be sure she wasn't rewarding bad behavior or any of the other things that I've mentioned.

What an absurdly naiive and romanticized view of history. This is looping back to our starting point. I have a feeling we've arrived at a point in our disagreement where we keep repeating ourselves at each other to no effect.

Gustaaf
Wednesday, June 27th, 2012, 02:52 PM
What an absurdly naiive and romanticized view of history. This is looping back to our starting point. I have a feeling we've arrived at a point in our disagreement where we keep repeating ourselves at each other to no effect.

I'm sorry you feel this way. I felt I was able to better elaborate on my position over the course of this debate.

Adalheid
Wednesday, June 27th, 2012, 07:07 PM
Hey Gustaaf, there's a pretty good chance that you're unlikely to find anyone sympathizing with your position on parenting or husbandry. In the end, it doesn't matter...how you choose to relate to your family is your business. But, you must understand that there are other viable, reasonable and honourable ways for a a man to lead his family than the one you've chosen. It doesn't make them lesser than you in the area of parenting for choosing to to have an intimate relationship with their family.

Edit: I'm not out to offend anyone's viewpoints. I think I'm done participating in this discussion. Good luck, Gustaaf. No ill will. I hope that you and a your family manage to find a happy medium.

Freja_se
Wednesday, June 27th, 2012, 07:27 PM
I agree that there is nowadays often too little discipline and too much laissez-faire. Children and adolescents need boundaries and rules as well as love and affection. It makes children more harmonious and calm when adults set the rules for them, rather than having to constantly search for them and test the limits

I also think it will make the children respect the parents' authority more, when they actually behave like authority figures rather than buddies. When a laissez-faire parent suddenly tries to put up some kind of restriction the child will be prone to question it and challenge the parent.

Later in life some of these young adults become bitter and complain that they had a feeling throughout their childhood that their parents didn't care about them, didn't ask where they were going or when they were coming home.

These kids had all the freedom they could wish for but actually wished that their parents had been stricter, since it would have been a sign that they cared about them. I think that is rather sad.




I can create a list of things that seem to be done by mothers [and feminized fathers]. Siding with the child against the school administration board. A lot of the time, kids get no discipline at home. You have kids verbally and physically abusing their mothers before they even reach double figures. The only place they get any kind of authority is at school. The kid gets a detention or gets expelled, and the parents take the side of the child against the principal and undermine the only source of law or order in the kid's life.

They don't issue chores. They let a kid relax whenever he's not at school [if he goes to school]. This attitude follows them into adulthood and they become slackers, stoners or other leaches on society.

Mothers don't stand up to their children, so even when they know their son is committing a crime, they do nothing. Sometimes this is because they're scared of the tearaway brat that they created, but often they carry the same sense of entitlement for their kid that the kids feel themselves.

I could go on, but I'll sum up by saying fathers need to stop standing on the sidelines nodding their heads and get themselves into gear.

Jens
Wednesday, June 27th, 2012, 07:33 PM
I agree that there is nowadays often too little discipline and too much laissez-faire. Children and adolescents need boundaries and rules as well as love and affection. It makes children more harmonious and calm when adults set the rules for them, rather than having to constantly search for them and test the limits

I agree with you. This wasn't a discussion of boundaries, rather whether or not a child should ever play (at all), or do nothing but work all day. And whether or not a man should consider a woman's opinion as equal to his in regards to how a child should be raised. Or should instead believe that his male opinion is intrinsically more reasonable and likely to succeed. At least that's what I've been arguing about.

Freja_se
Thursday, June 28th, 2012, 10:23 AM
This wasn't a discussion of boundaries,



Well, yes, the post I responded to was. If you have them from the start and establish authority and confidence one can avoid many of the things described in that post.

Jens
Thursday, June 28th, 2012, 10:56 AM
Well, yes, the post I responded to was. If you have them from the start and establish authority and confidence one can avoid many of the things described in that post.

The post you responded to is about mothers, and Gustaaf's claim that women are inherently incapable of setting boundaries for children. The post is his justification for why men should dominate women in decisions about child rearing. No part of this debate was about whether boundaries are good, it was about whether or not women, and not just any woman, the woman he married and the women that people on this board trust enough to marry, can be trusted to set such boundaries.

I think any woman that can be trusted enough to have children with can be trusted to raise a child.

Freja_se
Thursday, June 28th, 2012, 11:26 AM
The post you responded to is about mothers, and Gustaaf's claim that women are inherently incapable of setting boundaries for children. The post is his justification for why men should dominate women in decisions about child rearing..

Many people find it difficult to set boundaries because they are themselves victims of a bad upbringing influenced by leftist/ liberal norms and laissez-faire ideals. They think that love, tenderness and pleading with the child is enough. It is not.

Generally speaking, many women do have more problems establishing authority in the home than men do, even though many modern men seem to have lost the ability, too.

There was a TV series from England, I think, that showed dysfunctional families where the mother especially was almost terrorized by her children just the way that he described it, since they had no respect for her at all. It was not hard to see why, either.

Jens
Thursday, June 28th, 2012, 11:46 AM
Generally speaking, many women do have more problems establishing authority in the home than men do, even though many modern men seem to have lost the ability, too.

I think that is an incarnation of liberalism, not femininity. I've never seen a disparity between men and women in their ability to dish out punishment and discipline in among my circle of acquaintances and family. I think the absence of fathers tends to highlight women who fail, but I doubt putting their husbands in charge of the situation would change matters. They are liberal people. They suck at child rearing.

I don't think a conservative woman should be suspected of having an innate desire to be a hippy about her child rearing policies and categorically overruled. It is entirely possible for a conservative woman to have a better, more educated opinion about child rearing than the father of her children, who is, in a traditional household, always less experienced.

Berlichingen
Monday, July 2nd, 2012, 06:33 AM
I'm going to go out on a limb here and point out that our idea of a housewife is a fairly modern construction.

Consider a town in the Middle Ages. The women aren't micro-managing the kids. They're helping out with the farm, gathering herbs and berries, working a loom, that sort of thing. Childcare is a collaborative effort by the extended family.

Georgia
Monday, July 2nd, 2012, 07:44 AM
I was always happy and content being a wife and mother. I love to cook, bake, sew, work in the garden, and most of all I enjoyed taking care of my husband when he came home from a long and hard day at work. We were married for 7 years before our first child was born. And then I became a mother and I had not just my husband to spoil but I also had to take care of our child. When our second child was about 2 or so, a young co-worker of my husband was killed on the way to work leaving behind a young wife and two small children. Fortunately there was family to help and assist. Otherwise I don't know what would have happened to a young widow trying to raise two small children, no trade, no degree...life in the rural South would have been very hard, perhaps even impossible unless she would have found another husband. After this incident my husband approached me and suggested that I should think about going back to school to get a degree. He assured me that he would help me with our children and whatever else needed to be done while I was away from home to study "if something ever happens to me I want you to raise our children in Dixie. In such a situation I want you to be independent and be able to stand on your own two feet." I first started as a part time student, but after a year I went to school full time. I also started out being a math major but later changed the major. This actually turned out to my benefit.


To make a long story short, it took 7 long years until I had reached my goal. My advanced degree enabled me to have a career as well as a wonderful marriage and home life. I was able to work part-time or full-time, pretty much pick the days I wanted to work. Our marriage and our home life always came first. I worked part-time and full-time, even home schooled our youngest son for almost seven years while working part-time. My husband always remained the head of our family unit, I would have not wanted it any other way, despite me having a career. Our sons were already grown when my husband, who was never sick as long as we knew each other, became quite ill with flu-like symptoms. Well, it wasn't the flu. He immediately became disabled and exactly 18 month and two days after being diagnosed with Squamous Cell Lung Carcinoma Stage IIIb he closed his eyes in our home surrounded by his family.


Where am I going with this? For six month after he was diagnosed, unable to work, no income, not even disability since there is a six month waiting period, keeping his health insurance, Cobra payments of 600 FRNs per month for eighteen month, the weekly trip(s), 100 mile one way, to the cancer clinic for palliative treatments, I worked and supported us. I would have never been able to do this without having gone back to the university to obtain a degree and at least work a bit to develop a career. Our daughter was still in school when my husband died. Without my job we would not even have health insurance at this time.

So yes, being a housewife is a great calling. In the past when there still was an extended family unit it certainly was enough to be a housewife and a wife and a mother. People have changed and today the extended family unit rarely exists. As for me, I think it is important for a woman to be able to have a trade or a degree which she can use to support herself and her family if the need arises. I have seen so many situations where the opposite was true and when the provider of the family no longer is able to provide, this can happen to any family, it is a disaster.

hyidi
Monday, July 2nd, 2012, 11:01 AM
For the first time in my life, I actually cooked dinner tonight for the family and felt more right than working 8 hours a day' when a unemployed man could had my job. Felt like I belonged in the kitchen, more so than at work. Felt good too! ;)

Hersir
Sunday, July 15th, 2012, 06:19 AM
What Women Want


Reading over the comments (more like essays) on the last article I penned, I would like to bridge what obviously seems to be a gap between White Nationalists and females. Being both myself (no, I’m not Greg Johnson, but I will take that as a compliment), I have access to the minds of beautiful and fertile Caucasian goddesses, which, judging from the lack of female representation on WN sites, you probably don’t share. Instead of condemning me and taking the side of bitter pussy-obsessed mansophere gurus, you should be pumping me for information.

Continues here. (http://www.counter-currents.com/2012/07/what-women-want/) (Counter-currents)

Another (http://www.counter-currents.com/2012/06/pick-up-artists/)text by the same author

Bernhard
Thursday, July 19th, 2012, 01:15 PM
I'm going to go out on a limb here and point out that our idea of a housewife is a fairly modern construction.

Of course it is, we live in modern times. The important question is whether this modern idea of a housewife respects the essential qualities of women (and of men) in the same way as it was done in other times, albeit that the pracitical implementation of it is different due to the fact that it had to be adjusted to a different type of society.

ablutive
Thursday, July 19th, 2012, 05:19 PM
What I find kind of amusing about the whole housewife thing is that the system really broke down not because women resented having so much drudgery to do at home, but because the drudgery had been replaced by labour saving devices (for middle class women) and they were bored. The opposition to that system was the tantrum of a bored child.

I still kind of resent it, they had too much leisure time and instead of making the best of it, using the time to think and learn and create and build, they had a tantrum and begged to be allowed to go out and engage in drudgery in the workplace instead.

flemish
Monday, July 23rd, 2012, 01:16 AM
My last partner initially had no problem with my staying at home and taking care of the house, but as our relationship continued and he cheated; he told me to find employment. I take it he was afraid of the idea of my finding another man in a workplace setting. Once he started cheating and formed relationships with these other women, he basically told me to get a job and move out. You take a real chance when you drop out of the workforce to take care of household, partner, and children.
When you're out of the workforce for a number of years, finding work can be difficult. Be careful girls; those of you considering becoming housewives. When the relationship is over, you're just a used up old bag who has very little to put down on a resume. Keep some sort of employment while you're playing housewife.

ablutive
Monday, July 23rd, 2012, 02:03 AM
My last partner initially had no problem with my staying at home and taking care of the house, but as our relationship continued and he cheated; he told me to find employment. I take it he was afraid of the idea of my finding another man in a workplace setting. Once he started cheating and formed relationships with these other women, he basically told me to get a job and move out. You take a real chance when you drop out of the workforce to take care of household, partner, and children.
When you're out of the workforce for a number of years, finding work can be difficult. Be careful girls; those of you considering becoming housewives. When the relationship is over, you're just a used up old bag who has very little to put down on a resume. Keep some sort of employment while you're playing housewife.

I feel like deciding how to live my life on the assumption that divorce is probable is a deeply depressing thought (especially since I am adamant now at least that if I were to be divorced I would not remarry - although I never much had a problem with being alone so it's not such a hard thought for me unless it were to happen before I had a reasonable number of children).

Sigurd
Monday, July 23rd, 2012, 10:18 AM
Generally speaking, many women do have more problems establishing authority in the home than men do, even though many modern men seem to have lost the ability, too.

Since the woman typically gets to spend more time around the children, I actually find it is yet more important for the woman to be able to establish authority than it is for the man. In reality, all the man is supposed to give at the end of the long workday is either his support for what the woman forbade, or the permission for which the woman told the child to wait until daddy was home. I.e. usually the 'big things'.

Most of the 'little things' like allowing or forbidding the child to go outside and play football with his friends before having finished their homework and the likes will ultimately have to be decided by the woman alone. The idea of being available to negotiate things happening at home every time of the day sounds very ideal, but at the end of the day your employer isn't going to be watching for long if you excuse yourself a fifth time from the same business meeting. ;)

Freja_se
Wednesday, July 25th, 2012, 01:43 AM
I could never downplay the importance of the father as an authority figure in the home. In an ideal home environment the father and mother complement each other, and both are immensely important in their own way.

I don't think anything can ever replace a strong, loving father figure. He protects, is a role model to his sons especially, and brings stability and order as well as love and affection.

I think most women are naturally softer and gentler so sometimes it can be harder for us to have the necessary authority. I think children sense this instinctively and sometimes take advantage of it.

It is the same thing later in school. There was always the male teacher who never said or did anything special, but as soon as he went into the class room everyone immediately turned silent and gave him their attention, even the most boisterous boys. It was just a natural, effortless authority. I remember that I always looked forward to those lessons.



Since the woman typically gets to spend more time around the children, I actually find it is yet more important for the woman to be able to establish authority than it is for the man. In reality, all the man is supposed to give at the end of the long workday is either his support for what the woman forbade, or the permission for which the woman told the child to wait until daddy was home. I.e. usually the 'big things'.

hyidi
Thursday, August 2nd, 2012, 05:20 AM
Since the woman typically gets to spend more time around the children, I actually find it is yet more important for the woman to be able to establish authority than it is for the man.

It's the men that don't want to establish authority to the children, men don't want to been seen as the evil parent or to be hated by their own children (In some cases, mothers /fathers want to be best friends to their children and not their parents) Being hated by your children is a good thing, it shows you are being a good parent etc... keeps the child inline with behavior and crime. Sure at times, I hated my mother for her strong authority over me but I came out a good person and I still love her always.

Nachtengel
Wednesday, August 29th, 2018, 01:32 PM
Millennial Men Prefer to Be Family Breadwinners, Have Stay-at-Home Wives

A New York Times op-ed on millennial men details some surprising statistics regarding the way men ages 18-34 view the role they play, or should play, in family life. Nearly 50 percent of men ages 18-25 believe it better for “everyone involved if the man is the achiever outside the home and the woman takes care of the home and family.” A similar survey of high school seniors in 2014 revealed that 58 percent “agreed that the best family was one where the man was the main income earner and the woman took care of the home.” Why, you may ask? The strongest theory suggests that the generation that grew up with two working parents is well aware of the stresses that dynamic brings upon family life:

…there is considerable evidence that the decline in support for “nontraditional” domestic arrangements stems from young people witnessing the difficulties experienced by parents in two-earner families. A recent study of 22 European and English-speaking countries found that American parents report the highest levels of unhappiness compared with non-parents, a difference the researchers found is “ entirely explained” by the absence of policies supporting work-family balance.

The writer at the Times quickly turned the statistics into an argument for increased government involvement in family life in the form of paid leave policies and “affordable, high-quality child care.” To back up this claim, the author cites statistics that show that when a woman has to manage too much of the childcare and household responsibilities, presumably because she lives in a male-breadwinner household, the couple’s sex life suffers.

In other words, the Times wants to combat a generational craving for traditional home and family values with the lure of better sex and potential for increased financial security. Obviously, they aren’t aware of other recent statistics revealing that millennials are increasingly prioritizing family over career, often to the point of choosing the stay-at-home parent dynamic. They must also be unaware of statistics showing the more educated the woman, the more education and earning power she’s looking for in a man, precisely so she can stay at home with her children while they are young.

To their credit, the Times clearly illustrates the difference between the two types of family culture we’re being asked to choose from. One is the candy-coated vision of mythical “high-quality child care” and extended maternity leaves being forced on us by politicians and activists who insist that a woman’s greatest accomplishments can only be measured in a man’s playing field. The other is the desire of a growing number of young men and women whose vision of family life exists out of that field’s bounds:

…millennial men are significantly more likely than Gen X or baby boomer men to say that society has already made all the changes needed to create equality in the workplace.

Both visions are competing against the Times’ Don Draper-esque vision of reality that has men smoking in board rooms and women chained to kitchens and babies. It is in this way the statistics are most revealing: Millennials think Don Draper is the stuff of television, not real life. Perhaps it’s time the writers at the Times catch up.https://pjmedia.com/parenting/2017/04/05/millennial-men-prefer-to-be-family-breadwinners-have-stay-at-home-wives/