The Viking and the Indian

[Blutwölfin]

Algonquin Ancestors walked to America from Greenland

The Norse in Greenland "vanished" between the years of 1340 and 1410. Where did they go?

Eleven American tribes, the Leni Lenape (Delaware), Shawnee, Nanticoke, Conoy, Mahican, Cree, Ojibwa, Abenakis, Wapanaog, Cheyenne, and Micmac all have traditions of their ancestors coming to Northeast America by crossing over a salty sea in the East. Where did they come from?

In 1836 a white man, Rafinesque, published The American Nations, a book about American people before Columbus. The book contained the Walam Olum, which is a history of the Leni Lenape told by pictograms and accompanying verses. The Walam Olum, chapter 3, shows people walking across ice to a new land. Is the Walam Olum a hoax?

A hypothesis that appears to answer these questions is: During the Little Ice Age ancestors of the Algonquin-speaking people walked, en masse, on the ice from Norse Greenland to Merica.

I invite all historians to discuss this hypothesis.

The hypothesis has strong positive evidence in five areas: Linguistic, Biological, Historical, Artifacts, and Cultural:

LINGUISTICS: Reider T. Sherwin wrote eight volumes of the Viking and the Red Man. In those volumes he made over 15,000 comparisons showing that the Algonquin Language is Old Norse.

BIOLOGICAL: Modern DNA studies show that the European Haplogroup X made the deepest penetration via the Great Lakes.

HISTORICAL: Written documents in Europe and the inscribed Walam Olum in America describe the migration. The Walam Olum can be interrupted using Old Norse dictionaries. (See Language above.)

ARTIFACTS: Eight types of large structures in Algonquin areas appear to have been built by Scandinavians. The structures are long house foundations, stone beacons, Hammer of Thor, an European Village, dams, iron forges, and numerous square stone foundations.

CULTURAL: Several Algonquins myths have Scandinavian parallels. The name of the main Algonquin hero “Kluskap” lives on in the Scandinavia

More evidence pro and con is shown on the web site www.frozentrail.org.

Did ancestors of the Algonquins walk to America?

Let us talk about it.

Myron Paine Ph. D.
1716 Elderwood CT
Martinez, CA, 94553
frozntrl@aol.com


Source (http://hnn.us/blogs/comments/19238.html)


One of the most weird theses I've ever heard. A Native American tribe with Viking roots? :scratch:

[Gorm the Old]

The population of Greenland had declined drastically owing to worsening , climatic conditions and malnutrition by the 14th century. I doubt that the Greenland settlers were equal to the task of walking from Greenland to North America, weak and undernourished as they were. Would the surviviors of this trek have been numerous enough to form a tribe adapted to the life and conditions of Eastern North America ? This, also I doubt.

[Gorm the Old]

By the 14th century, the Vikings of the Greenland colony could not produce enough food to maintain themselves. They were dependent on imports from Iceland and even Norway (because the Icelanders weren't doing very well, either.) The pack ice made it impossible for ships to reach the Greenland colony and they died from starvation. Even if some survivors tried to walk to North America on the ice, they would be very unlikely to make it. If they did, the Skraellingar would probably have exterminated them. Norse/Indian relations were never very good.

[Vanir]

Here's something similar. Probably complete crap :shrugs but interesting nonetheless.

Celtic Britain
The Welsh Explorers
Compiled by Peter L Kessler, 2004

In AD 1170, the Welsh prince Madog ab Owain Gwynedd (son of Owain, King of Gwynedd) set out from North Wales on a voyage of exploration.
While crossing the Atlantic his fleet became ensnared in the North Equatorial Current, and his vessels were drawn around the southern tip of Florida and driven aground in Mobile Bay.
No written records or stone remnants attest to this legendary journey. Rather, according to some observers, the legacy was a living one, etched in the faces and culture of North America's Mandan Indian tribe.
George Catlin, a nineteenth century painter who spent eight years living among various Indian tribes, was among those who were impressed by the Mandans' remarkable traits. "A stranger in the Mandan village is first struck with the different shades of complexion, and various colours of hair which he sees in a crowd about him," wrote Catlin, "and is almost disposed to exclaim that these are not Indians.''' The artist also noted "a most pleasing symmetry and proportion of features, with hazel, grey and blue eyes."
Catlin concluded that he had uncovered the descendants of Prince Madog's expedition and speculated that the Welshmen had lived among the Mandans for generations, intermarrying until their two cultures became virtually indistinguishable. In time, the tribe migrated north to the Dakotas, where Catlin encountered them.
Some later investigators supported the theory, noting that the Welsh and Mandan languages were so similar that the Mandans easily responded to the Welsh tongue. Further, it was observed that unlike members of other tribes, the Mandans grew white-haired with age and practised a method of fishing unique to Wales.
By the end of the nineteenth century, a smallpox epidemic had devastated the Mandan tribe, severing the link to their mariner forbears. But the belief in their Welsh heritage still persists and is celebrated by a plaque placed alongside Mobile Bay in 1953 by the Daughters of the American Revolution. "In memory of Prince Madog," the inscription reads, "a Welsh explorer who landed on the shores of Mobile Bay in 1170 and left behind, with the Indians, the Welsh language."
http://www.kessler-web.co.uk/History/FeaturesBritain/CymruExplorers.htm

[IvyLeaguer]

Yes, I discussed this on another thread somewhere already. There is some odd stuff concerning a few of the East Coast Indian tribes and the Bering Strait theory. The Bering Strait theory doesn't hold water when one considers all the indigenous tribes and how diverse their languages are. There was a linguist at Yale named Edward Sapir. He was a Germanist who went on to obtain his Ph.D. in Linguistics.

http://www.nap.edu/readingroom/books/biomems/esapir.html

Anyway, Sapir was really the first scholar to intensively study the Amerindian languages. He noticed such a vast difference between all the different Amerindian language groups that he was unable to ever find one parent root language connecting them all together. For that many languages to be that diverse would have taken a much longer time period than that of the migration theories. This is puzzling for linguists.

What is more confusing is that a couple of the East Coast indigenous languages Sapir started studying had gender distinctions like an Indo-European language. Also, many of the East Coast languages are now extinct or nearing extinction, making it difficult to do further research.


Outside of linguistics, scientists have also recently discovered Haplogroup X among certain tribes:
________________________________________ ______________

"In addition to the primary Native American haplogroups, we have also
identified a rare fifth haplogroup "X" in the northern Amerinds and the
Navajo. This haplogroup is defined by the absence of a DdeI site at np
1715, the presence of an AccI site at np 14465, and several CR variants.
Interestingly, distantly related haplogroup X mtDNAs have been found in
Europe, but have not been detected in Asia. The coalescence a time of
haplogroup X in the Americas is between 12 and 36,000 YBP, suggesting it
represents a distinct migration to the New World."

http://www.madsci.org/posts/archives/jun2000/959811537.Ge.r.html
________________________________________ ___________________


In the first part of the twentieth century a Harvard anthropology professor discovered what appeared to be an ancient pagan site outside Boston. The site has strong similarities to Stonehenge and thus it has been dubbed "America's Stonehenge." The site is still being studied and excavated today. There is no clear explanation as to how it got there or who built it.

http://www.stonehengeusa.com/

There are also early European accounts of some tribes having running water in their dwellings when the European explorers arrived there. You might want to read a new book that just came out called "1491: New Revelations of the Americas Before Columbus" by Charles C. Mann which lists several unusual things about indigenous peoples in the New World.


While I'm sure much of this information is inconclusive, I personally believe that these findings might prove the Atlantis theory more than anything else. Some of the myths and legends from these East Coast Indians contain stories about their gods being giants and coming from the sea, and with their gods supposedly came a knowledge about the stars. One tribe I read about even claimed their gods had come from a star. What was even stranger was that they had a name for that star and knew it's location, as well as an advanced knowledge of astrology, astronomy, and the heavens.

I find all of this both highly bizarre and interesting.